08-01-2001 05:44									#61
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</font>&lt;font size=1&gt;Originally posted by Epik on 01-07-2001 05:04 PM&lt;/font&gt;
"If Barbarians are set to villages only and you have no huts, will barbarians every show up?"

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I hope not.

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"King level seems soft. As does the barbarian setting. You will not have much trouble with happiness or defense. This would make the game less challenging. I prefer Diety, but Emperor would force some early happiness issues. Restless tribes would force defense of cities, with units other than token warriors."

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My thought is that a Diplo game should focus more on Player relations and interactions than on fighting Barbarians and tipping randomly-generous huts. I am hoping that all Players will be able to build viable Civs at the start and engage more in shifting alliances and trade in tech and commodities later. Otherwise, it is just another 7-Player game.

In that regard, the difficulty level is not very important. However, in the same way, it would not bother me to make it Deity (I skip Emperor level only because of the 1 vs 2 settler inequities for some Civs at the start).

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</font>"Will the premade map equalize productive squares to some extent? The standard map is hard on any tribe in the southern hemisphere."

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Yes. I insist on at least some degree of balanced starting position just to avoid ill-feelings at the beginning of the game. Not exact, but everyone should be assured of a decent start opportunity. Besides, there is really no point in massive desert areas. Same thing with jungle. Some random difficult areas, yes; some places with unusual resources, yes: whole tracts of unusable land, no.

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"On the standard map, America is rich in productive land, so I would love to be the American tribe. If they are unavailable, I will take the French.

"Actually I think we should leave the Americans and Aztecs out of it, and then one goal of the game would be to settle the new world. This would let us share the good land of Americas."

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As the old song goes, "The English were Egyptians Long Ago". This will be an unknown world.

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"Were you planning on beginning next Sunday the 14th?"

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I intend to. Unless we suddenly have a shortage of eager participants (unlikely), plan on it.


<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by cavebear (edited January 07, 2001).]</font>

	08-01-2001 07:53									#62
	Remove this text

Well I will miss the ransom money, but I can play without Barbarians. The idea of no huts interests me, because it will take some of the luck out of the game.

If there is no relationship with the map to the real world, then it seems we do not need to chose a tribe before the game begins.

As I mentioned in a previous post, story telling is harder when you do not have a common reference point, but this might clear up later in the game.

Cya Sunday at 4 PM eastern.

	10-01-2001 04:57									#63
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<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by Epik on 01-07-2001 09:53 PM</font>
If there is no relationship with the map to the real world, then it seems we do not need to chose a tribe before the game begins.
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Since the starting positions will be preset, it will be easier on the person who is making the map to only have to do 7 civs instead of all of them. So I need everyone to choose a civ (and some players are really dedicated to a particular civ).

I want to be Americans or English, or Sioux.

	10-01-2001 05:39									#64
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Don't forget the the color limitation...

I will take dark blue. That is German, French or Viking. Of those tribes, I will choose Viking.

	10-01-2001 17:08									#65
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Halla Luya!! This puppy is getting ready to fly!!
I'v got my personal prefers (diety,raging,huts) but can certainly live with these.

I have become a real fan of this simul moves thing, after initially disliking it. REALLY speeds things up... as long as players realize it is TOTALLY unfair when it comes to battles & other encounters. And therefore must be turned off during times of border clashes or outright war.

The unknown world = a great challenge & interesting!
It will be fun not only to see how it unfolds, but how we all report our little pieces to the world.

As for the King setting... i'v got to go along with it, simply because it doesn't make a race-for-Mich's & then race-for-Bach's, winner takes all contest.

Good work Cavebear!! Look forward to reading your eloquent commuiques on the progress of your Sioux elders & citizens!
---------------------------------------
I'll opt for the Green's call me Babys, Zulus, or Japs matters like by me. If have to prefer... go w/ "Z" for Zulu.

What time Sunday? The earlier the better for moi'.
---------------------------------------
CapTVK: Glad U grabbed a spot (we need your wonderful graphics skills). Your English, can't lose because U R either a gentleman or a war hero, will be a welcome addition too (as long as U use the gentleman part with the Z's).

Nappy: Grab a civ! Nothing like having the best as part of the assembly.

Talented Map Maker whomever art thou: Please help ASAP!
(ps-s-s-t... start the little green settler on the mouth of a river with a whale, some fish, a silk, + say a wheat or buffalo or even a pheasant-in-the-woods... your choice. We'll share the victory credits, gift U 3 techs, & 250 gold next game )


------------------
"Hm-m-m, doubt me you will?"

	10-01-2001 17:57									#66
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ALL AAABOAAAARD!

Seems like the train is leaving the station, if you want to catch the train do it now!

Don't worry if you miss the first train, if you really want to get in you'll get in. Every diplogame needs subs, and some subs become permanent.


About the map:
although I would like to play on Earth or a pseudo-Earth I don't have much trouble with random maps. If you do, at least make it an interesting map. Don't make it a seven evenly balanced continents for seven players kind of map, there's no challenge in that. No huts and barbs at all would be a bad idea IMO. Huts and barbs give it that random factor that allows some civs to get ahead (like in real life). And barbs also have a lower attack strength at king-level (100%, 150% at Deity), so raging hordes please (or Emperor/Deity-level)

	11-01-2001 06:32									#67
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It occurs to me that there are *almost* enough players for 2 Diplo games. So I suggest that there be 2 games at the same time, but different settings.

Game A would be the one I described (King, 1x1x, village barbs, no huts.

Game B would be the same map, but Deity, 2x1x (maybe), raging barbs, and huts.

Just name your choice of game and your Civ. When a color in a game is taken, other civs in that color are gone.

--------------

Cavebear, Game A, Americans

	11-01-2001 17:41									#68
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Since this is my first diplogame, I'll join game A as the Celts (Irish).

AD

	11-01-2001 19:31									#69
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I'll stay with the 1st choice, Cave.
Not my usual prefers, but given the overall goal of the game... can live with.
The challenge & randomness of the barbs & huts, as CapTV says = fun. But these are over-shadowed by the randomness & adventure of discovering a whole new world... like really happened!
I am, again like CapTV, hopeful that our mapmaker is creative & diverse in his/her creation of starting points.
===================================
Biggest concern... will players REALLY show up & when?
Somone mentioned Sunday 4pm EST US (GMT-5)as a starting time. Why do we wait so long? If we fail to get started then... it will be another week before re-trying.
Is it possible to get started sooner?
How about, Sat AM eastern US / afternoon European time?
At least long enuf to see who shows & who is just talking & dreaming on this post.
(sorry to be so blunt, but talk seems to be rather cheap with many MP players when it comes to showing up as agreed / when agreed... & this sort of long-running game needs committed & serious players)

	11-01-2001 21:28									#70
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I am totally open on game settings and maps. However, I cannot realistically commit to 10-20 consecutive Sun. (or weekends) to play this game out. Is there any interest in this thread in playing one of the diplo games on on a weekday night like Tues or Wed. 6pm PST on a continuing basis. This would obviously work best for PST, MST, and CST players. The idea here is to get a group of players who will commit to playing out the entire game at a pre-set time .

	12-01-2001 08:20									#71
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I definately can on a weeknite(s)... if i can ever get my ICQ to start working again.

PS: Nap... glad to see U survived the storm (or are U playing from the your hot tub on the roof?

	12-01-2001 08:57									#72
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Cavebear, i posted my own diplo thread but Milo told me to post here in case mine lacks people. I would love to be in a diplo game. My cousin (Mercantile wishes to be in it too) in this respect, as we live in the same house, and share my puter as his now needs a new cd rom we will share a civ. Our pref being Purple as Mongols as this is the only tribe i play and Merc bought one of those asian bamboo hats and wishes to wear it and he needs to be an Asian culture in order to do so. Because we are both busy, we in fact may sub for each other or play together and make decisions together, thus adding a neat element to are participation, very different playing styles, which would also add more character development to the story.
Weeknights after 5pm PST and weedends anytime after 12 noon pst

	13-01-2001 19:25									#73
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Cavebear, did you find a mapmaker?

I am going to go for option B (Diety, Raging Hoards and huts). This sounds like the game War4Ever is setting up.

	13-01-2001 20:50									#74
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The mapmaker has pulled himself away from his scenario development (for our sake) and promises to have our map ready (hopefully by this evening).

So far, for Game A:

Cavebear - Americans
Absurddoctor - Celts
KenThur - Zulu
CapTVK - English
War4Ever - Mongol

That leaves a Navy and a Yellow Civ needed. Did I miss listing someone?

I need someone to host (I don't have DSL or Cable available where I am yet). The map will be a .sav file.

Remember, this game is Sundays at 4-7 p.m. EST. King, 1x1x, non-real large map, village barbs, no huts. We still want simultaneous play, right?

	13-01-2001 23:02									#75
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Hosting is no problem for me..... i have cable modem

	13-01-2001 23:06									#76
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Cavebear, i don't mind playing kings level, i never play it but it doesn't matter for a dip game. I still totally believe in raging hordes for barbs though...... villages is a real crawl, and on a large map it means skimpy defense. Diplo games should have some minor wars and in the ancient era.....glorious civs were plagued at times by barbs ..... i am going to read the whole thread to see what other rules you are proposing and then i will post again

	13-01-2001 23:25									#77
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Hmmm... I was thinking that War4Ever would be starting a separate game. If he stays with this game then I will join too.

	14-01-2001 00:03									#78
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If I understand our mapmaker friend correctly, eliminating huts requires a full scenario (.scn) treatment, and he is doing this as a .sav map. I think we may have huts. I'd rather not, but I can live with them, so whichever we get, we use. On the other hand, he says he can guarantee us no tech imbalances at the start, and that is worth a lot.

Epik - The Navy and Yellow Civs are still up for grabs. There are good Civs to pick from those. Do you have ICQ? My number is 37552809. Add me.

	14-01-2001 10:22									#79
	Got spare money?

When we going start this baby??!!
I'm avail from 0500 - 1230 EST (GMT-5) & later from 1700 - 1200.

Let's get it on guys (& gal, if she shows).

Ought to fun... finally!

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"Hm-m-m, doubt me you will?"

	14-01-2001 21:34									#80
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Looks like there is not enough players to get the Option B game started, so I will join this game as the Navy Blue tribe. If there are no objections, I will be using my custom tribe... the Borg Collective.

As I understand it the game will start at 4 PM EST. I should be online most of the afternoon today, so icq me if turns out we can start sooner.

	15-01-2001 10:41									#81
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Epik, I've listed you as Navy. As far as I know, you can change the Civ name at the startup.

	15-01-2001 10:51									#82
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OK, we still need a 7th player, which surprizes me because there were 13 interested parties at one point. We have:

Cavebear - Americans
Absurddoctor - Celts
KenThur - Zulu
CapTVK - English
War4Ever - Mongol
Epik - Viking (To be renamed)
? - Aztec

The map has 7 preset civs, so without a 7th player, we would have an AI involved (and therefore no simul play). Or maybe someone would join this first session and we would have a week to find a replacement permanent player.

	15-01-2001 02:19									#83
	Inflate your Upload Space

I now see some of the difficulties with getting a diplogame started. Out of all the many people who showed an interest in being in this game (at one point there were enough people to start two games) only four of us are actually here now. We have a fifth with Suas, fortunately, but I've got to wonder, what happened to everyone?

AD

	15-01-2001 21:58									#84
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I am one of the "all talk & missed action" guilty parties.

Since is was not made clear anywhere that i saw, when the exact kickoff time was to be, i agreed to do shop watch for my wifie & then meet with some clients before the hubbie jets off to who knows what part of the country.
Still tried to get back in time but they had MUCH to cover (after a year like last year in the financial markets) & wanted to move asap on many of my reco's... sorry. Reality had to take priority & i DO make a rare Sunday house call.
(how many didn't show due to football playoff games also? Hm-m-m-m?)

Sincere apologies to all that showed... i know how very fraustrating that can be. Name the the next time that is good for all & POST IT HERE pls.

More i think about it, Nappy's suggestion + the experience of some of the long-running games groups, that we pick a more rountine nite of the week when there are fewer surprises / unscheduled events to pop up, mite be a more realistic time. If we can then get in some extra time on weekends... so much the better.

My schedule will be much more predictable & controllable once i get back to Calif Thurs.

I AM very anxious to play in this well-thot-out Diplo & hope everyone doesn't give up after this false start.

	16-01-2001 02:11									#85
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KenThur - My empathy for you on the unexpected business requirements. I hope everything was worked out. Life happens, and there is no getting around that.

I do have to say, though, that I *have* mentioned the 4 p.m. EST Sunday starting time frequently. I don't want to seem too rigid about it, but that is the best time for *me* and that's why I am going through all the effort to get the game organized.

I think there is a varied and talented group of players assembled for this Diplo game, and you would surely be one of those. We really hope that you will be able to play, and we will certainly miss your skill and negotiating ability if you cannot.

I should let you know that we have decided to use a premade map based on Europe and that it will be known to all players. I know that isn't what you wanted, but on the other hand, I think we are going to have huts and restless tribes, so that may balance it out. Oh, and by the way, Europe isn't *exactly* as you know it; it is now Eurasian and global.

C'mon and join the party; I think you'll like it.
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by cavebear (edited January 15, 2001).]</font>

	16-01-2001 09:23									#86
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Cavebear....... my server has been down since friday night in the middle of a game with Rah.... it worked for a few min....then down until now..... problem now is my computer is going weird on me again... gr... so... i will have it fixed by sunday (guarranteed) so i can start then.... sorry if i missed the schedualed start time of last sunday

	17-01-2001 02:01									#87
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I've taken a look at the map Cavebear has done and I've added some improvements to it. I've send it back to Cavebear for further review. I don't think we're there completely but it's beginning to look like a pretty good map with some nice design features, real rivers for example...
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by CapTVK (edited January 16, 2001).]</font>

	17-01-2001 04:59									#88
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War4Ever - I know how frustrating that is. Can't even let anybody know there's a problem. Glad to heae you are up and running again. Oh, and we didn't start the game, yet...

	18-01-2001 05:55									#89
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Cavebear.... i saw your post and i guess a few others didn't realize the start time either.... oh well... lucky for me the puter problems were this weekend .... darn power went out last night too.... i hope that doesnt happen again

	18-01-2001 08:21									#90
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Being in an all-electric house, power loss is worse for me than for people that have gas or oil heat in addition. So you certainly have my understanding of the annoyances that occur when the electric fails!