02-07-2005 20:30									#31
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I for one need the threads back to have those links about the Afghan war, man they were one hell of a good read and now they've gone!!!

	02-07-2005 21:29									#32
	Suffering from ads?

Real life probably popped something up, thats my guess as to why the restoration is behind schedule,

	02-07-2005 21:44									#33
	Inflate your Upload Space

Well you might be right there Erika, lord only knows how much we all could accomplish if that damn "Real World" would just stop cramping our styles. Still, I suppose what might satisfy many on this forum and this thread in particular is more progress reports and real honest updates.

If life problems are slowing the restoration process down then thats the way it is and I would respect that, I also think most others would respect it as well.

All I'm looking for is real honesty as to what the problem was when the site crashed and what the problem continues to be..... nothing more and nothing less.

	03-07-2005 20:01									#34
	Tired of ads?

It is now been more than a week since the day that the forum was to be restored. I wonder if there is any new news on this front to report?

	03-07-2005 20:50									#35
	Support Apolyton

it's actually been 78 days since the threads were supposed to be restored.

	04-07-2005 01:24									#36
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

78 days? Yikes!! I was simply refering to the day I heard Mark G had given as a deadline, I wasn't aware this was supposed to have been done 78 days ago.

Just out of curiosity, can somebody who knows for sure tell me what exactly happened to cause the crash? I've heard some differing stories from different people. I'd prefer to hear an explanation from the admin, but the next honest explanation I hear form that admin on this topic will be the first.

	04-07-2005 05:04									#37
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

you'll want to read here: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=132298

In the first post of the thread, dated april 17th, MarkG said the recorvery would take two days...

	04-07-2005 07:12									#38
	Put an end to popups!

I see, well I thank you for providing me with that link to have a gander at, but it still doesn't explain just how the entire forum was accidently delted. I understand accidents happen, sometimes on massive scales such as this one. What I'm curious to learn is how it happened and what caused it? Was it some sort of system error or was it human error?

Even if it was human error I wouldn't be upset, we all make mistakes and nobody likes to be raked over the coals over them. What I dislike is when people run and hide and in this case do nothing but side step the issue of what happened.

Any thoughts anyone?

	04-07-2005 08:45									#39
	Here are mine . . . . . Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Thought 1; Civ4 is due for release anytime now. Don't ask me how I know that.

Thought 2; Who pays much attention to the civ1 forum? Would you miss it if it simply "disappeared" due to, say, some kind of "mistake?"

Thought 3; line from an original episode of the Twilight Zone; "obsolete! (repeat ad infinitum)"

Thought 4; priorities and revenue--the bane of us all in a capitalist world. Even if we aren't capitalists ourselves.

I read something once. "All art aspires to the condition of Muzak." In short, dissolution and decay are inevitable. The 3rd law of thermodynamics. There are no enclaves. The Buddists said, long ago, that nothing is permanent. I believe them.

Not much help, huh?

	04-07-2005 09:01									#40
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Well Exile those are indeed some thoughts, some interesting ones too at that . Now that thats out of the way, perhaps some thoughts as to what caused the acciendtal crash of '05.

In the mean time, here's a neighbourly thought for ya...

....Happy Independance Day friend .

	04-07-2005 21:46									#41
	Put an end to popups!

Damned colonials We let you win anyway

Hey Sarsstock, why don't you post in the community thread? Tech's right - we need to apply maximum pressure on the site owners...

	05-07-2005 06:14									#42
	Re: Here are mine . . . . . Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Exile Thought 4; priorities and revenue

What revenue? They're not making any money out of this. If anything, they're losing money, and they're doing it in their spare time. MarkG has a job, and DanQ is still studying I believe.

Oh, and yes, it was a human error. St Leo was rearranging the way the SL forum was done as you might have noticed before the **** hit the fan. Using a topped thread with links to the tip threads instead. He then asked to get the subforum deleted, and instead, apparently the whole sleague forum got deleted. Oops!

	05-07-2005 06:28									#43
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The word "revenue" provokes. How odd.

Where, in that statement, did I make clear or imply that ACS earns such? I'm well aware that the site isn't a for-profit endeavor. I've seen Markos state that several times.

In an ideal world, the space for ACS would be made available for free, the way that parks and zoos and recreation areas are made available freely. None of US are earning a dime either, so why is our collective community at this point?

We don't, however, live in an ideal world. We live in a capitalist world, driven by greed and predation. Nothing is forbidden if it brings in the cash. Just as long as it doesn't violate any of the "rules." People can be broken, desolated, mistreated, victimized, plundered, and destroyed . . . . just so long as the money comes rolling in. Sadly, the "revenue" to which I referred was the necessary tithes that Markos, et. al. MUST PAY to the "people" who provide the bandwidth, etc. for the site. Of course, this does tend to place pressures on the site owners, who must then consider each bit of space and the relative worth thereof.

Not a pretty picture, but not an indictment of Markos. More a pessimistic diatribe at the world we live in.

	05-07-2005 07:58									#44
	Got spare money?

You are too cynical... The more pessimistic people there are in the world, the more pessimistic the world will become.

quote: Originally posted by Exile None of US are earning a dime either, so why is our collective community at this point?

It takes a hell of a lot more effort to keep a huge site like this running than it takes to do what we do.

We could always move the SL off Apolyton and start our own website, but I can't see anyone willing to do that. Hell, we have enough problems filling the new SLwiki. And that's something where everyone can help, not just the one or two admins.

	05-07-2005 08:53									#45
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I'm not too cynical. I'm probably not nearly cynical enough. If I only KNEW what was REALLY going on . . . .

And about the wiki thing; I just drive 'em. I don't know what makes 'em work. If I tried to do anything . . . . someone would just have to come along later and clean up the mess. I'll spare the community that disaster.

You live in Holland, correct? Lemme tell ya, If I lived in Holland, I'd probably be a hell of a lot more optimistic too. I envy you that much Jorrit.

	05-07-2005 10:12									#46
	Re: Re: Here are mine . . . . . Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Mercator Oh, and yes, it was a human error. St Leo was rearranging the way the SL forum was done as you might have noticed before the **** hit the fan. Using a topped thread with links to the tip threads instead. He then asked to get the subforum deleted, and instead, apparently the whole sleague forum got deleted. Oops!

You're missing the point, Merc. They've told us the threads COULD be restored and WOULD be. But according to my count, they've missed 3 deadlines so far.

Sure, Apolyton is a labour of love for the site owners, but so is designing scenarios, creating unit art, and exploring the intricate details of this game and so on, for the rest of us. Much of our work was stored on the SL threads that were deleted.

Thanks for the explanation for what happened - it's the most specific rationale I can recall being provided. It's interesting that it comes from you, not those who were directly responsible, and 3 months after the fact.

Speaking only for myself, I don't think we've been treated very well.

	05-07-2005 12:37									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Speaking only for myself, I don't think we've been treated very well.

I agree with you 100%. However, things could be a lot worse.

I think it fortunate that the powers at Poly are aware only of the first 2 parts of the IBM Mushroom Theory of Management.

This is an ancient theory. It dates back to the prehistoric Big Blue age of the 70's when the IBM Colossosaurus 360 and Humungosaurus 370 ruled a world of punch cards. Only a few iconoclasts were starting to ponder if small and nimble PC's might one day replace the titanic monsters.

The 360's and 370's are now lost in antiquity and the world is ruled by PC's. However, like a cat, the theory seems to have 9 lives.

What is the IBM Mushroom Theory of Management? It is very simple and has only three basic steps.

1. Keep them in the dark.
2. Feed them s**t.
3. Can them.


Aren't we lucky that they have not yet figured out how to make tin cans?

	05-07-2005 16:32									#48
	Re: Re: Re: Here are mine . . . . . Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by techumseh Thanks for the explanation for what happened - it's the most specific rationale I can recall being provided. It's interesting that it comes from you, not those who were directly responsible, and 3 months after the fact.

Sorry, but that's a bit unfair: I read the same explanation from St-Leo just after the crash!

So those "responsible" did offer an explanation (and, if I remember well, apologies) right after the event!

So, we can't complain about the lack of information about what happened (apart for those among us who didn't read the right thread ), but I think we are allowed to complain about the lack of information about the recovery...

And yes, I want at least as badly as you do to recover the lost files!

	05-07-2005 17:48									#49
	Re: Re: Re: Re: Here are mine . . . . . Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Exile And about the wiki thing; I just drive 'em. I don't know what makes 'em work. If I tried to do anything . . . . someone would just have to come along later and clean up the mess. I'll spare the community that disaster.

The good thing about a wiki is that that doesn't matter. You can safely create a mess without losing anything. If you just get started you'll learn as you go along. I mean, you could even just start with viewing other people's things first and just previewing your own efforts before actually submitting the stuff.

quote: You live in Holland, correct? Lemme tell ya, If I lived in Holland, I'd probably be a hell of a lot more optimistic too. I envy you that much Jorrit.

I wouldn't be too sure about that. But if that makes you feel better... And I have plenty of reasons to be pessimistic too, you know.

quote: Originally posted by techumseh You're missing the point, Merc. They've told us the threads COULD be restored and WOULD be. But according to my count, they've missed 3 deadlines so far.

No, I know. They have been playing around with us. But there are also plenty of reasons to be lenient with them. I'm just, um, trying to spread the love.

I just don't see the point in continuing to whine about it here, which was also why I closed that thread earlier. Maybe I just have enough other things on my mind to keep me from worrying about this.

Yes, it sucks big time, and it should have been restored by now, but we will get it back.

And, you know, I maybe be sort of the defending them here, I'm screaming along just as loudly in the A/C thread.

Then again, I'm not quite as much into Civ2 as I was, so I had no use for most of the scenarios and art that was lost. The only things I did mind losing I probably have on my own computer anyway, like all the hex-editing stuff.

quote: Originally posted by Cyrion Sorry, but that's a bit unfair: I read the same explanation from St-Leo just after the crash!

Quite...
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=132169

	05-07-2005 20:56									#50
	Re: Re: Re: Re: Here are mine . . . . . Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Cyrion Sorry, but that's a bit unfair: I read the same explanation from St-Leo just after the crash! So those "responsible" did offer an explanation (and, if I remember well, apologies) right after the event! So, we can't complain about the lack of information about what happened (apart for those among us who didn't read the right thread ), but I think we are allowed to complain about the lack of information about the recovery... And yes, I want at least as badly as you do to recover the lost files!

OK fair enough. My apologies to St. Leo.

One more thing though. I think the thread we use to discuss this should be on OUR forum, not over at Apolyton Community. This is where the people affected live. Many don't vist the community forum at all.

	05-07-2005 23:20									#51
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I agree with techumseh. This was where the crash took place and this is where our data was lost. I think it best serves our interests to keep the thread here where it is.

	05-07-2005 23:48									#52
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I agree that this thread serves a purpose - however, the only way to let MarkG and DanQ know our feelings is to post in the Community thread. It's a simple fact of life, and I would suggest that the more of us that do just that, the more notice the site owners will take.

We can whinge amongst ourselves here, but they ain't gonna notice

	06-07-2005 00:44									#53
	Increase Your PM Length

Agree: I'll continue to post here and there, reminding Mark at regular intervals that with still expect it...

	12-07-2005 08:21									#54
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by St Leo MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARKOS! Okay, let's try a different tack. After you get around to doing the SQL merge of awesomeness, I will buy a large Apolyton mug and an Apolyton golf shirt. But not one second before. If you do it really fast, I'll also grab a Commie Yellow tshirt. * St Leo danges money bags in front of MarkG Come on, darth overlord. You know you want to.

quote: Originally posted by MarkG because of this post i will delay any act for 3 days

I don't quite know what to make of MarkG's reply. Up front I'll say that I don't talk personally talk with him, but I've watched him in the community forum for quite a while, and I have to say, this might not be a joke. And I don't have the first clue what to do about it

	12-07-2005 08:30									#55
	Perhaps . . . . . Inflate your Upload Space

His time of the month?

	12-07-2005 09:30									#56
	Put an end to popups!

considering some of the less than respectful things that had been said before, Leo's post was downright tame. Who knows?

	12-07-2005 09:53									#57
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Well I just posted on the community thread for the first time and voiced my opinion that Mark's threats are very vindictive if true. I can't believe somebody in his position would punish the entire forum for the post of a single member, which honestly wasn't that offensive .

I remember at first dismissing the ideas that this was somehow done on purpose or that the moderators have no intention of restoring the threads as paranoid banter, but with actions and the lack there of like the ones we've been seeing lately really forces one to think.

	12-07-2005 20:25									#58
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Also, once the forum's collective 3 day sentence is complete, I wonder what exactly we can expect see in terms of restoration. I have the upmost respect for the work Mark G has done for this forum but I really question his actions as of late.

	12-07-2005 23:24									#59
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Sarsstock Also, once the forum's collective 3 day sentence is complete, I wonder what exactly we can expect see in terms of restoration. I have the upmost respect for the work Mark G has done for this forum but I really question his actions as of late.

Zip would be my guess. He hasn't been working on it anyways, so what's Never plus 3 days?

	13-07-2005 00:18									#60
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Would any other hosted site forum suffer this neglect, or is it just us?

I would definately urge the ppl here who subscribed to demand a rebate.