18-07-2005 21:50									#31
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I still don't see why India shouldn't have war elephants. Sure, they're not unique, but so arent' jaguar warriors, cossacks, men'o'war, riders, javelin throwers, bowmen, mounted warriors, three-man chariots, musketeers, carracks, and probably some more I can't be bothered to think of right now. Elephants were a distinctive part of Indian armies, and I think that's enough.

	18-07-2005 22:01									#32
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Yes. But Civ4 has elephants available to every faction that can get the resource, I believe. I could be mistaken. But we've seen elephants in use by many different factions in the gameplay footage we've seen.

Maybe they could have a UU elephant. Like "Armoured War Elephant" or seomthing like that.

	18-07-2005 23:27									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander01 Yes. But Civ4 has elephants available to every faction that can get the resource, I believe. I could be mistaken. But we've seen elephants in use by many different factions in the gameplay footage we've seen. Maybe they could have a UU elephant. Like "Armoured War Elephant" or seomthing like that.

Why not indeed. It would be no different from having horse UUs despite that everyone can build horsem, knights, and cav.

	19-07-2005 01:01									#34
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I saw Redcoats being built in one of the screen shots, thats gota be the English UU.

	19-07-2005 01:08									#35
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They should have more than one UU then, because English sail ruled the seas, blah blah.

	19-07-2005 01:14									#36
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Lancer, all units are unique, but if you are too hung up on labels sometimes that is hard to see. A true leader will help all his units reach their full potential.

	19-07-2005 01:21									#37
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What do you need bleepin' unique units for in the first place, other than "flavor"?!
You will have the opportunity to make your OWN unique units through promotions! Instead of having a well-rounded army, just focus promotions on one particular area (assuming you can choose your promotions in the first place).

	19-07-2005 01:44									#38
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I got promoted to PFC three times. I was a pretty unique unit.

	19-07-2005 01:45									#39
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quote: Originally posted by 1889 Lancer, all units are unique, but if you are too hung up on labels sometimes that is hard to see. A true leader will help all his units reach their full potential.

My sarge tried that crap.

	19-07-2005 01:48									#40
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I like unique units. They tend to add individuality to the different civs. Same with the traits, like militaristic or seafaring. All of a sudden you have something different, a culture. Otherwise it's all 1s and 0s.

	19-07-2005 02:19									#41
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I like unique units also. Whether it is "flavor" or "culture", it does add something to the game (I usually play Rome and enjoy its legions).

To make a big deal about so long before the game arrives, however, is pretty pointless. But I suppose it's something to gab about until more real content arrives.

And Lancer, congrat's on splitting 1 or 2 posts into 3.

	19-07-2005 02:32									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Jaybe What do you need bleepin' unique units for in the first place, other than "flavor"?!

Strategy, maybe?

	19-07-2005 02:40									#43
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UU + promotions ?

will have to think on that

Done...not both, Promotions seem the better answer to the strategy aspect

	19-07-2005 04:51									#44
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Maybe they could create not UU, but special promotions for every unit of that civ. Not that it would be better than having a UU, but is posible.
For Russia: missile bases? Why not the SU-76, the first motorized artillery that wasn't over a tank system but over a special designed platform? Or a Czar Mail, that took messages from one
part to another of Russia? Better get the old and good Cossak.
For India: no Sikhs, the Sikhs on really are another people that want the independence from India; War Elephants should be available for all that have Ivory. Battle Towers, over elephants, replacing... War Elephants?

Another point, I think we should send out all the mercenaries!

	19-07-2005 05:20									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer I like unique units. They tend to add individuality to the different civs. Same with the traits, like militaristic or seafaring. All of a sudden you have something different, a culture. Otherwise it's all 1s and 0s.

Are civ traits still in the game? I've seen no mention of them. I figured they have been replaced by leader personality traits.

	19-07-2005 05:32									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Are civ traits still in the game? I've seen no mention of them. I figured they have been replaced by leader personality traits.

You figured right. There's no civ traits.

	19-07-2005 06:03									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Are civ traits still in the game? I've seen no mention of them. I figured they have been replaced by leader personality traits.

Same thing, pretty much, except the slight twist that multiple sets of traits can be associated with the same UU.

	19-07-2005 07:30									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Are civ traits still in the game? I've seen no mention of them. I figured they have been replaced by leader personality traits.

At first glance I'd say that's a pity. I'd say the civ traits were one of the high points in Civ3. However I'll not cry too much until I see what replaces them and how it works.

	19-07-2005 08:30									#49
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Lancer - they're in Civ 4, just in the form of "leader traits". The slight difference is that a civ can have a choice between two different sets of traits based on the choice of leaders (for those civs that have two leaders).

	19-07-2005 10:51									#50
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Well that sounds interesting. I wonder why they changed over? Do they believe that peoples don't have traits, just people? If so, blah. Still, who cares as long as it works in the game.

	19-07-2005 11:16									#51
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quote: "Sikh Warrior" isn't really sensible as a unit, as there weren't specific units of Sikhs trained in some Sikh-specific fashion. The Sikhs have a long and distinguished martial history, but that's not the same thing.

If you think this way, cossacks also don't count as they were not any kind of "troops".
They were simply the steppe dwellers of southern Ukraine - their only duty to country was to fight turks and their allies in the south.

Iroquis' riders also don't count then as they were simply grown-up Iroquis' males.

	19-07-2005 11:45									#52
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That's a great pic you're using for your avatar binTravkin.

	19-07-2005 14:07									#53
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quote: That's a great pic you're using for your avatar binTravkin.

Thanks. It's me there..

You should be able to see my temper/behaviour/nature from the pic..

	19-07-2005 14:10									#54
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It is the single most expressive baby pic I've ever seen. You were so cuuuute.

Weight of the world though..

	19-07-2005 14:24									#55
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quote: You were so cuuuute.

And I always tought I was just sooo fat and unproportional as a baby..

	19-07-2005 15:04									#56
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quote: Originally posted by binTravkin And I always tought I was just sooo fat and unproportional as a baby..

That's what I meant by 'weight of the world'.

You look like Churchill pouring over a map. "Damnit Bismark, where are you?!?

	19-07-2005 16:56									#57
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EUREKA!!!!!

UNIQUE PROMOTIONS

Give each Civilization a Unize type of Promotion, various limitations might apply to what kind of unit it can be attacked too ofcorse and it shouldnt be rediculusly powerfull just more unique and flavorfull then the "generic" Promotions.

For Example The English could have an extra level of "Sea Movment" beyond what other Civs can get. The Japanese have a "Bushido" ability that can be applied to certain Infantry units and nutralizes Enemy Promotions or a "Kamakaki" ability which should be rather self explamitory.

Oh and just incase someone else already had this idea, I apologize I didn't read most of the thread.

	19-07-2005 17:49									#58
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Good idea indeed!

	19-07-2005 19:01									#59
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quote: Originally posted by binTravkin If you think this way, cossacks also don't count as they were not any kind of "troops".

The Cossacks were often deployed as a distinct unit of the army. They weren't individuals distributed throughout the Russian army. They were also often cavalry. AFAIK, though, Sikhs served in the main body of the army alongside non-Sikhs in whatever capacity was needed.

quote: Originally posted by binTravkin Iroquis' riders also don't count then as they were simply grown-up Iroquis' males.

That one's a stretch, then. Sometimes, you just have to make something up even if it doesn't fit. There's no need to do that with the Indians, though; there are lots of candidates for a UU without having to select something that doesn't fit well like "Sikh warrior."

	19-07-2005 22:10									#60
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Cossacks were usually employed as light cavalry, and they had their own separate units up to division level during the late Tsardom.