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Jon Miller
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no
education in some of the classes was disasterous
I was/am really really smart
other people aren't such
they need help, which some of the teachers didn't provide
JM
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Jon Miller
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nah, I know a lot of people who weren't smart
who were in college, and would graduate
they had help getting there..
I just think that poor people should get help also
get every chance they can, instead of being discouraged by bad teachers and equipment
JM
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Omni Rex Draconis
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quote:
everyone has the basics they need for a good education if they put in the effort, and it is free
some people just aren't smart. No amount of teaching will change that |
I don't believe either of these two things.
No one can convince me that children are coming out of today's schools with minds that are too full. The IQ of any healthy child has not been used up.
If the children are unwilling to learn, they will not learn. But this is the fault of the teacher. Learning, like work, is something that most of us would prefer not to do and children lack the foresight and control of an adult. When society took up the burden of educating children, it also became compelled to instill certain ethics. Displine, civil behaviour, and a willingness to learn and improve perhaps most of all.
We can argue whether teachers are getting enough money, but I don't think there is enough.
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DRoseDARs
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"My god, it's full of peas..."
Jul 2002
time: 21:37
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As a janitor, I would like to thank you che for taking the time to insult me several times in this thread. 
While I don't dispute the fact that it does take a lot more to create a doctor than a janitor and a great deal of education to successfully returns someone's health, I find it highly insulting that you think so little of my kind and our value to society. If we (who apparently are little more than trained monkeys with mops in your eyes) weren't around to clean up the messes those of you who serve a useful and valuable purpose in society leave behind, and thus actually HAVE value in society, then doctors would have A LOT MORE work to do on a daily basis. Four days a week I'm cleaning up not just the dirt people track in from outside, but I also have the occassional blood spill to deal with or Human excrement from people wiping their ass cracks on our towels or splattering all over our toilets. I don't have all the high-quality antibiotics around me and I don't have a cleanroom to retreat to in case of contact. All I have are some cheap rubber gloves, handsoap, and Purell. Also, I don't have access to these peoples' medical records; I don't know where they've been or what diseases they may be carrying.
Not everyone can be a janitor che, anymore than everyone can be a strawberry picker in southern California, else we'd be seeing far fewer Hispanics in those fields. You clean up a lot of general nasty stuff, your hands get tired from wiping equipment, vacuuming carpets, and yes mopping floors, your back and knees can start to ache, God help you if you have seasonal allergies (like me) and are cleaning up dust. We keep the nasty stuff away from people out in public places so that people can stay away from the doctors.
I bust my ass each cleaning shift I work, I've earned praise and respect from co-workers and club members alike through three different clubs, and I'm not about to sit here and be belittled by anyone. :we-really-need-the-rasberry-tongue-smiley-back:
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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:37
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Ludd, you are arguing opinion against facts. Facts just are. You can't wish them away because they offend your moral code. Society, which is what we are talking about here, currently decides the value of people based upon the market. People are just as much commodities in capitalism as anything else, and thus subject to the same rules in the market place. It may suck, but that's how it is.
I may think there's no redeming value to web design, maybe because it comes so frikkin' easy to me. Society, however, thinks it's worth as much as $100K a year. I'm not gonna argue with someone trying to pay me that much money.
And while anyone can make a web page, not everyone can make a web page that will get them paid absurd amounts of money. Just cuz you can take a picture, it does not mean you are Ansel Adams. Just cuz you can paint, it doesn't mean you are Picasso. No amount of training will ever make you Picasso either. You either got it or you don't.
There is no Picasso of sanitation. Baring some certain physical or mental problems, anyone can be a janitor.
Last edited by chegitz guevara on 04-08-2005 at 20:35
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:37
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
And while anyone can make a web page, not everyone can make a web page that will get them paid absurd amounts of money.[.quote]
Potentially, most people can. (although few would want to)
[quote]Just cuz you can take a picture, it does not mean you are Ansel Adams. Just cuz you can paint, it doesn't mean you are Picasso. No amount of training will ever make you Picasso either. You either got it or you don't.
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Of course no amount of training will ever make you picasso.... he's an individual! If you go into art with the intention of being someone else, you've obviously got a lot yet to learn. Picasso is not famous because of his ability to paint, he is famous for his ability to see, analyse, express, and create, or more specifically - his experience and passion as an artist. Painting while obviously an essential part of his work, was merely one medium.
Can anyone learn to be an artist? Certainly, if they have the passion for it, a means of creating their work, and an environment to learn in.
Like I said before, there are three thigns you need - The Will, The Means, and The Experience. Each one is equaly important and useless without the other two. Someone with the Will and the Means but no experience is nothing but a novice, someone with the Will and Experience but no means, is unable to do anything, and someone with the means and experience but no will to do it will never shine. Very few people ever get to a place in their life where they can meet all three criteria in what they do, unfortunetly.
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04-08-2005 11:48
I'm sorry for your ego being bruised, but I was speaking matter-of-factly. Society does not value your contribution to society anywhere near as much as it values that of doctors or web designers. That's why were need campaigns like the SEIU's Justice fo Janitors campaign. I never crossed a picket line when my janitors went on strike.
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