28-08-2005 01:41									#91
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quote: Like DoY said, password protect it...deny her the use of the internet, it's not rocket science. I think it's a little far fetched for a girl to go round to her friends house to the specific end of getting sexual abused by a monitor. Good parents will always communicate with the parents of their kids friends in any case.

You are again assuming the parents of the other kid is as good a parent as you. even if you communicate tothe other parents the kid cant be on line you cant be for sure that they wont let them do it while in the home. This is all on a trust issue. I am sure alot of you had friends that had way cool parents that let the kids do what ever they want. sure they will tell ur parents no prob il watch them and m,ake sure they are not doing these things and dont, what can you do if you dont know?

	28-08-2005 01:44									#92
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You can't be certain, but you can tell the other parents of your concerns, and no matter how lax they may be, then they won't want their daughter (or yours) doing anything like that so they'll have to act.

	28-08-2005 01:44									#93
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well, you wouldn't want to confront her without proof, so get proof.

http://sourceforge.net/search/?type...words=keylogger

Don't tell her you've installed it, just that you know what she's doing and you'll know if she doesn't stop.

	28-08-2005 02:09									#94
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quote: Originally posted by Mrs. Tuberski quote: I'll be talking to them about protecting their safety and reporting any untoward behaviour they encounter. Then I'll trust them. I'd certainly trust them with most of the 40-something men I know on-line. You are under the assumption that ur teen will tell you everything. That doesnt happen in a lot of cases. Talking to a teen is like pulling teeth. You have to pull this crap out and most of the time all you have to go on is what they say and hope it is the truth.

When you fly off the handle and start locking them up taking away their computer and calling the police over everything no sh.t they don't talk to you. I would lie to you too.

Trust is a two way street. If you don't trust your kids they won't trust you. If they don't trust you they won't talk to you. By severing that bridge of trust between you, you put your kids in MORE danger, because whenever something risky happens (and I guarantee they know when something is risky) they aren't going to tell you about it, because they are just as afraid (perhaps more so) of how you will react than the risky situation in the first place.

You can't monitor your kids every second of every day, you can't be there to tell them what to do every second of every day, you can't be there to hunt down every dangerous person they come across. If the only thing standing between your kid and danger is the parent, then that kid is screwed. He/she needs to learn how to navigate danger and that requires people he/she can trust who can talk things over with them in a loving, non-punitive, non-judgemental way.

	28-08-2005 02:36									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Mrs. Tuberski For your refrences and stuff all you have to do is watch the news cases such as these come on every day. Main point if this has not been or is not a probelm then explain to me why almost every law enforcement has a special until dealing with this issue and this issue anyway

That's because the media preys upon the fears of parents to drive up their ratings by hyping up a small number of crimes. Since this is a democracy, those parents, all scared senseless by some sensational media stories all demand their police "do something" about the problem. So the police, ever eager to take advantage of public fears to increase their budgets (or politicians ever eager to win votes by appearing to be tough on this hyped problem) embrace special units dealing with the "epidemic of Internet sex crime".

Just like parents are petrified of letting their kids within 100 feet of any strangers because of hyped up stories of kidnapping-murders. The reality though is that child abuse by strangers is very rare, and children are at FAR more risk from their own parents, aunts & uncles.

Of course the media doesn't hype that (blaming parents doesn't get good ratings) so no one knows that fact.

	28-08-2005 02:54									#96
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quote: When you fly off the handle and start locking them up taking away their computer and calling the police over everything no sh.t they don't talk to you. I would lie to you too.

Where did i ever say i took the pc away from my kid and called the police? First of all I said i adjusted his pc buddy list and limited his time on the pc so if u are talking to me i hardly think i flew off the handle. I told wb I never called the police. I protected my kid. Its up to the other parents to do so as well. My kids will talk to me. But its like pulling teeth. They are out for their privacy and dont want their parents to know their business. In case you dont have one i do, and have been living this for the last 3 years and it has nothing to do with being a bad parent. It has to do with them and a privacy issue.

	28-08-2005 02:57									#97
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quote: he/she can trust who can talk things over with them in a loving, non-punitive, non-judgemental way.

I find it interesting that you are lecturing on this topic Ozzy. I think you might do better if you listen to Mrs. Tubes, rather than talk down to her like she was a child.

After all, upon how many kids have you had a chance to practice this loving, non-punitive, non-judgemental way?

	28-08-2005 02:59									#98
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quote: Originally posted by OzzyKP Yea that would really fricken work. No wonder there are so many screwed up kids out there. You guys all seem to have no concept of parenting skills.

You want to apply such an aversive stimulus that they won't bother doing it again.

1) A computer keyboard is a THING. The girl is a person. You can always replace a keyboard and monitor.

2) You're not abusing the girl. I'm not talking about beating the crap out of the girl. Just a few smacks on the bottom.

3) I'd rather have a few bruises and spending a trip to the computer store to replace a broken computer than have to endure the loss of a relative.

	28-08-2005 02:59									#99
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quote: Np dis. I am indeed a lady. I have been seen by a few polly posters and spoke to another on the phone

Yep, she's very much a lady.

	28-08-2005 03:06									#100
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quote: Trust is a two way street. If you don't trust your kids they won't trust you. If they don't trust you they won't talk to you. By severing that bridge of trust between you, you put your kids in MORE danger, because whenever something risky happens (and I guarantee they know when something is risky) they aren't going to tell you about it, because they are just as afraid (perhaps more so) of how you will react than the risky situation in the first place.

You are right trust is a two way street. Todays teens think that u as a parent need to mind ur business and stay out of it till they need ya. Well lots of time the kids might know something is wrong but will go along cause of the friends they have. What they they consider dangerous will never be the same thing you as a parent consider dangerous.

	28-08-2005 03:11									#101
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quote: You can't monitor your kids every second of every day, you can't be there to tell them what to do every second of every day, you can't be there to hunt down every dangerous person they come across. If the only thing standing between your kid and danger is the parent, then that kid is screwed. He/she needs to learn how to navigate danger and that requires people he/she can trust who can talk things over with them in a loving, non-punitive, non-judgemental way.

Show me a loving non punitive non judjmental way to parent your teens. It doesnt exist. They do something wrong what do u do tell them hey no sweat or do u punish them?? Non judgemental ur kid hangs out with a teen deliquent and is gettin him in trouble what do u do say hey no sweat or say the kids a bad seed and ur your not to hangout with him thus for you have judgemental.

	28-08-2005 03:21									#102
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one last thought parenting and keeping them safe is more important then bieng their friend. There is a way to do both but being the parent and making the decisons comes first. The relationship you build with your child depends on the strength and notice you throw into their activities. And I am sorry but if being sternis wrong then i dont know what to say i just know that my kid wont end up in juvnille hall for the lack of parental supervision that is given them

	28-08-2005 03:29									#103
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It isn't a conflict between being your kids friend and keeping them safe. Having a good relationship with your kids is the best way to keep them safe. Being a dictator is just going to screw them up worse.

That's exactly what happened to my friend. His step-dad never let him do anything. He never learned for himself to be responsible because he had a parent just tell him what to do all the time. So when he got out on his own he went nuts and has been in and out of prison.

Being strict on your kids is going to make them less safe.

Look at the examples Mercator cited. That is exactly how these things play out. The more punitive you are with your kid for talking to someone online the more they are gonna run to that person.

	28-08-2005 03:41									#104
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But it's not a case of being punitive - you tell them exactly what the problem is, and they should end up as scared as you are. You're not trying to ban all net use for kids, just telling them that it is better to do it safely. Rebellious streaks will not get that far when confronted with the risk of rape and/or death.
They can't be unaware of that US soldier who ran away to Germany with the girl he met in a chatroom. You just have to emphasise the need to be cautious, and then they should be trusted to do as they like.
Kids are dumb, and they love to rebel, but not when it is going to lead them to something as horrible as rape or murder.

	28-08-2005 03:54									#105
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quote: Having a good relationship with your kids is the best way to keep them safe. Being a dictator is just going to screw them up worse.

With this being said where do u hit on being to lax on the kid?? You build a relationship and if punisment comes with that then the child needs to have the structure to know hey what i did was wrong. They dont know everything like they think they do. Ozzy you go to an extreme by saying dictator course that can mess up a child but there is an inbetween. which is the type of parent I am, an inbetween . If nobody believes that there is an inbetween then i beg to differ. If calling the police is going to protect my child then yes i am going to do it.
I dont really care if allof u think i am a dictator i know i am not. Tuberski can tell you i am a softy when it comes to the kids. I do have to punishe them and if that means pc restirctions then thats what ill do i dont take the thing from them. And to let you know in my house they have their own pc because i trust them and they have done nothing so far to show me they dont deserve it

	28-08-2005 03:57									#106
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quote: Originally posted by Mrs. Tuberski ahh i see this is where it becomes a witch hunt when it happens to you.

Nope. You missed the point. It becames a bug-hunt when you have your kid asking you for help, or when you actually have evidence.

That's real evidence- not an assumption that any adult male communicating with a juvenile is a paedophile.

And there isn't just the one way to bring up kids correctly.

	28-08-2005 03:58									#107
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quote: Being strict on your kids is going to make them less safe.

So is not being strict if u let them run wild and do what they want you are inviting danger into their lives.

	28-08-2005 04:00									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan 2) You're not abusing the girl. I'm not talking about beating the crap out of the girl. Just a few smacks on the bottom.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I don't hit my kids. There isn't just one way to bring kids up correctly.

	28-08-2005 04:01									#109
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Circular logic

	28-08-2005 04:04									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp Nope. You missed the point. It becames a bug-hunt when you have your kid asking you for help, or when you actually have evidence. That's real evidence- not an assumption that any adult male communicating with a juvenile is a paedophile. And there isn't just the one way to bring up kids correctly.

No lazz I dont think i did. I dont know of any parent that is willing to gamble that the guy is doing nothing wrong I am sorry if you dont understand my point. Id rather find out before its to late and if you dont get that then i dont know how else i can explain it.
Ur right there is no set way to raise a kid you do the best you can and hope you are making the right choices.

as for the adult males being pedophiles the only adult males that need to be talking to my childern besides parents and family should be maybe a long known neighbir, lonf term of friend of the family, teachers etc In no way will i accept a middle aged man talking to any of my children on the computer

	28-08-2005 04:06									#111
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Don't bring them here then. I hear that a certain "Ming" fits that nefarious category.

	28-08-2005 04:11									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp Can't speak for anyone else, but I don't hit my kids. There isn't just one way to bring kids up correctly.

I dont hit my kids either but i guarantee if my 15 yo boy who out weighs me and is taller then i, tries i will take him down. I am not a small lady i am 5 11 145lbs
but my son is 6 3 250 he will not raise a hand i cn guarantee it.

	28-08-2005 04:16									#113
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quote: In no way will i accept a middle aged man talking to any of my children on the computer

At best that's naive, at worse that's just stupid. The best way to let something bad happen is to forbid your kids to do it. Either you take away the computer/password it, or you adopt a pragmatic approach of teaching the kid and yourself about the dangers. It can be incredibly useful for kids to have contact with older people who can advise them or perhaps tutor them etc, it would be blind to simply whitewash that out.

Remember also that you're not going to be around to protect your kids forever, if you wrap them in cotton wool then how are they supposed to cope when they enter the real world unless they are equipped to make decisions for themselves?

	28-08-2005 04:17									#114
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quote: Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp Don't bring them here then. I hear that a certain "Ming" fits that nefarious category.

I hope that is a joke And not to worry my kids arent allowed here on polly its blocked on their computer. I only have one kid in the chat rooms and he is 15 the 10 and 8 yo are not allowed.

	28-08-2005 04:18									#115
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quote: I dont hit my kids either but i guarantee if my 15 yo boy who out weighs me and is taller then i, tries i will take him down. I am not a small lady i am 5 11 145lbs

Christ almighty, you're talking about taking your kids down? You really should seek some professional help!

	28-08-2005 04:21									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Whaleboy At best that's naive, at worse that's just stupid. The best way to let something bad happen is to forbid your kids to do it. Either you take away the computer/password it, or you adopt a pragmatic approach of teaching the kid and yourself about the dangers. It can be incredibly useful for kids to have contact with older people who can advise them or perhaps tutor them etc, it would be blind to simply whitewash that out. Remember also that you're not going to be around to protect your kids forever, if you wrap them in cotton wool then how are they supposed to cope when they enter the real world unless they are equipped to make decisions for themselves?

I said i will not accept it. does not mean that it wont happen and i have told my one kid that is in chat rooms to be aware and the dangers of the pc and lurkers. I am not wrapping them in cotton. My oldest wants to go to the movies he knows the rules i will drop u off you will call me when the movie is over, if u dont then you wont be allowed to do it again. If he breaks the rules i set then he has to pay the consequenses which is loss of the privlidge

	28-08-2005 04:23									#117
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quote: Originally posted by Whaleboy Christ almighty, you're talking about taking your kids down? You really should seek some professional help!

what the hell am i suppsosed to do let him hit me i think not. thing you didnt get is that he wouldnt try cause he knows that i wouldnt roll over if he did. so try another troll hun

	28-08-2005 04:23									#118
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quote: I said i will not accept it. does not mean that it wont happen

You're fudging the question. Would you, or would you not tell a child not to talk to such people?

	28-08-2005 04:25									#119
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quote: It can be incredibly useful for kids to have contact with older people who can advise them or perhaps tutor them etc, it would be blind to simply whitewash that out.

I'm sure. And I'm also sure that what you consider appropriate 'tutoring' is rather more broad than most.

quote: Remember also that you're not going to be around to protect your kids forever, if you wrap them in cotton wool then how are they supposed to cope when they enter the real world unless they are equipped to make decisions for themselves?

With things like this, where kids have been raped and killed, you protect them so that they will live to reach the age where they can make decisions for themselves. I can't see how restricting a kid from chatting with adult males on the internet is going to render them incapable of making decisions for themselves.

	28-08-2005 04:27									#120
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quote: what the hell am i suppsosed to do let him hit me i think not. thing you didnt get is that he wouldnt try cause he knows that i wouldnt roll over if he did. so try another troll hun

If he wouldn't hit you then why mention it?

I would never hit my own mother because I love her dearly, she'd do anything for me even though she's ill and in constant pain, and because I find it abhorrent to hit a woman. If any of those things don't apply to your relationship to your son, then I would still suggest seeking help.