02-11-1999 10:32									#1
	Favourite Units? [It's wartime] Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

What's your favourite ground unit in:

1) Àncient age
2) Renessance
3) Industrial age
4) Modern age

You can also tell about your favourite combinations of units and so on.

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	02-11-1999 10:46									#2
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1) Pikemen (great defense)
2) Musks (superior against any ancient units)
3) Alpine Troops (great movements)
4) Spy (the single best unit)

[This message has been edited by Steve Clark (edited November 02, 1999).]

	01-11-1999 23:25									#3
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1) Knights
2) Dragoons
3) Cavalry
4) Howitzer

	02-11-1999 00:01									#4
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ST,

Good choices, but I think the knight is a Renaissance unit. I nominate the elephant in its place.

	02-11-1999 03:31									#5
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1) chariot
2) engineer
3) spy
4) spy

	02-11-1999 07:26									#6
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You use chariots!?!?
I thought engineers were industrial age.

	02-11-1999 07:54									#7
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I think this is a great thread, I can learn alot from the responses. However, just so we are all on the same page, I got out my chart and put this list together:

ANCIENT units:
Diplomats
Warrior
Archers
Horseman
Pikemen
Phalanx
Chariot
Legion
Trireme
Catapult
Elephant

RENAISSANCE units:
Knights
Caravel
Dragoons
Crusaders
Musketeers
Frigate
Cannon

INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION units:
Alpine Troops
Cavalry
Fanatics
IronClad
Submarine
Fighter
Destroyer
Riflemen
Cruiser
Artillery

MODERN units:
Marines
Battleship
Armor
Bomber
Helicopter
Paratroopers
Spy
Partisans
AEGIS Cruiser
Cruise Missile
Nuclear Missile
SAM Battery
Mech Infantry
Howitzer
Stealth Bomber
Stealth Fighter

I hope I got everything.
Note: I only included those units with an attack value and also included naval/air units even though the original post said favorite ground units.

[This message has been edited by Steve Clark (edited November 02, 1999).]

	02-11-1999 15:00									#8
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I know not many posts yet but so far Steve Clark is the only one here who probably knows how to battle.

Marines are *the* units to battle with. A battle ship (or whatever you have), a transport full of vet marines = coastal city snot beating invasion group. Pound on a city with sea units. Attack with marines from transport. Move transport into city with remaining marines, that still have movement left and attack more. You can wipe out the AI in no time like this. Damaged marines that have won a battle are safe on the transport from return attack from AI ground units. Works for me.

	02-11-1999 16:55									#9
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Never been a big fan of Marines. They take a long time to get and you have to study a dead-end advance for them. By the time they are available, the AI has city walls everywhere and is defending with vet Riflemen and/or Alpine Troops. And unlike ships, Marines don't ignore walls and have just 20 hps instead of 30.

60 shields also buys Cavalry, which can land and then attack, effectively doing the same thing as Marines. Cavalry arrives earlier and if you have Leo, you're likely to get a bunch of them. After landing in a city, Cavalry have twice the movement of Marines and can quickly grab those outlying fortresses. Double movement also means they can sometimes attack twice - very handy. Bring along some Alpines to get the high ground that doesn't have roads. Once the battle moves inland, Cavalry and Alpines are more versatile than Marines.

	02-11-1999 18:24									#10
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Marines are nice once and a while- to establish yourself [if your willing to spend 6 marines]. However, Howisters are the only way to go for decisive result. Everything else is just complimentary.

Too bad, too. Tanks should be the princible unit in the game, but aren't.

Ancient= Warriors [for exploration and attitude adjustment]
Favorate combo- Elephant and Archers.

Renisance- Knights
Fav Combo- Crusaders and Knights [fast and furious]

Industrial- Transport
Fav Combo- Transports loaded with Calvary and Riflemen.

Modern [standard rules]- Mech. Inf.
Fav Combo- Howisters and Mech. Inf.

Modern [altered rules]- Tanks
Fav Combo- Tanks and Mech. Inf., supportted by a few Howisters to blow out the worst defenders.

	02-11-1999 18:27									#11
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Ah what the heck i'll put my limited knowledge of civ2 and its units for all to see.


Ancient> ummm being a bit of a "builder" pikeman for defense definitely

Renaissance> Dragoons

industrial> Cavalry and fighters

Modern> spy and armor

	02-11-1999 19:30									#12
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Using Steve Clark's list

Ancient: Trieme (needed for goodie hut searches and caravan delivery)
Renaissance: Caravel (see above)
Industrial: Cavalry (it's time to fight)
Modern: Spy (it's time to subvert)

Your list includes spies but not diplomats. Also, the list does not include Galleons or Transports. While they have no offensive capability, they are absolutely, positively, indespenible on a multicontinent world.

This is the editing addition: The original message asked about favorite ground units. They really don't interest me. Whatever is available is what I build. Since I usually have a science advantage, whatever I am building is at least as good as what the AI has. Saying this, I must admit to a fondness for howitzers.
[This message has been edited by jpk (edited November 02, 1999).]

	02-11-1999 19:42									#13
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My favs:

Ancient : Catapult

Renessance : Musks

Industrial : Riflemen

Modern : Stealth Fighter

One vet catapult coupled with ,lets say an archer found in a hut, makes a very cheap war machine, positioned on a hill or mountain next to a city. This will give u a few xtra cities early. The Stealth Fighter rules!
Cities without SAM are at its mercy, and its movement is unrivaled. If all enemy cities are defended to the max, its still great for harassing the enemy, and it attacks up to 14 times out of a city.
Im talking about single player games off course, as I have never played more than a few hotseat games, let alone real multiplayer.

	02-11-1999 19:46									#14
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And if I could stick to the subject just once, I would give the Howitzer my vote in the modern age as the question was fav. GROUND unit. Sorry bout that..

	02-11-1999 21:08									#15
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Have to admit that I had never used howitzers or stealth units, usually I had conquered the world before I get those advances.

I have to agree with Sieve (sorry MWHC) on Marines, they are good for getting into a coastal city but getting into the interior, not so good. I remember capturing a large coastal city with 8 marines on a transport, used a couple for defending, then disbanding the remaining to build alpines.

jpk's comments are good, most units have some value militarily. I think I forgot to include Dips, I just had never used them to conquer, they cannot incite revolts. By the way, I interpreted Sinclair's original post as 'favorite ground units to attack with'.

	02-11-1999 21:41									#16
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Diplo... Diplo... Spy... Howi..

What else do you really need against the computer

	02-11-1999 21:54									#17
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Ming,

Since the AIs love to hoard gold, I've had to pay outrageously large sums of cash for mediocre AI cities (500-1000 gold). I finally decided it's more efficient to buy some good attacking units with that cash, and I'll still have some of them left over after capturing the city. Admittedly, a bribed city is usually in better shape than a conquered one, but I still prefer conquest to bribery.

Steve Clark,

Diplos *can* bribe/subvert cities, or at least they can in my game...

	03-11-1999 10:04									#18
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Ming/Dave: You're probably right, I had just never seen that option when a Dip goes into an enemy city. Could it be the level or some other factor?

	03-11-1999 10:14									#19
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DaveV... against the AI, once you get your caravans going, money isn't a problem, no matter what the cities cost to subvert
Heck, it's only money. And yes, the cities come to you in much better condition!

If they are in democracy... that's what the howies are for

	02-11-1999 23:54									#20
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Ming (and other trade gurus),

How long does it take in a typical game to set up the caravan money machine? I've always lost patience when I've tried to play perfectionist. It seems like pretty slow going compared to ICS. Can you really get tons of cash from trade routes in the BC or early AD years, or do you need to build up some super cities first?

	03-11-1999 00:17									#21
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Dave V, it takes a while for it to kick in. First you really need Magellan so that your ships can go a decent distance each turn. To get the maximum benefit you want to trade with the distant civilizations. It helps if you have ships all along the route to that you can do ship chaining or at least mid ocean transfers of caravans. Magnetism should be a research priority.

I tend to build a lot of early wonders so my caravans may start later than other players. Since I play on 10,000 square maps it may take even longer than for others. I'm going from memory but I would guess that it kicks in around 500 AD to 1000 AD. Once I get radio it goes into overdrive. While I haven't tried it, after I have radio, I suspect that I could set my science to 10% and still get an advance almost every turn. (You need some science so that the trade bonus kicks into an actual advance) With a 30% luxury rate I could have a 60% tax rate and use the tax money to buy lots of airports real fast. Perhaps I will try this in my next game.

If you play on a one continent world, ICS is probably a far better strategy for a quick victory. A trade strategy may be better if you would rather not push around big armies. My plan is to get a sizable technological lead and then attack with a small army of superior units and diplomats or spies.

A trade base strategy is probably ideal for a space ship game. This is more the kind of game I play. Usually I retire before building the space ship.

	03-11-1999 00:38									#22
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I vote with Ming. early on, diplomats can buy cities cheap, force peace, and establish embassies. They can defend against barbs by bribery.
In the second age, I rarely build the units.
Later, I still like spies, esp. vet spies. By now, I have acquired a large civ through bribery.
At the end, I still like spies, but howitzers on railroads can finish off a civ quickly.
How do I get the gold?, not particularly through trade. If you have michelangelos, JSB and adam smiths, combined with a temple and marketplace in each city, then fundamentalism produces HUGE amounts of gold. Try it--it's fun.

	03-11-1999 00:46									#23
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geofelt: What is a huge amount of gold? I remember one game while under Fund with most of the cities doing Capitalization, I was cranking out 1800 per turn and couldn't spend it fast enough so I had over 25,000 in the kitty. Is that alot or not?

	03-11-1999 00:46									#24
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1:
Archers (charriots in civ1)
2:
Knights
3:
Subs!
4:
Howys


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Alien Infiltrate

	03-11-1999 01:02									#25
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Ancient:
Archer

Renaissance:
Dragoons

Industrial:
Riflemen

Modern:
Spy

	03-11-1999 01:14									#26
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Subs = slow and underpowered cruise missiles that can only attack sea units. Once they attack, a cheap Destroyer will come along and kill them. The only thing Subs are good for is to soften up AI Battleships by sacrificing themselves so that my Battleship can finish off the AI. After Bombers and Cruise Missiles, they are good for nothing.

	03-11-1999 01:40									#27
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Going by Steve's list.

1) Ancient

Goody hut chariots (is that OK?). Ever stumbled across that single AI city with one or two of those early on? Poof! No more city, no more AI civ, but lots of territory to expand in! Reputation is also "poof!", but who cares against the AI?

2) Rénaissance

Anything on something that has four legs!

3) Industrial

The super ironclad!

4) Modern

None, really. No personalities, no charm, nothing.

Carolus

	03-11-1999 02:02									#28
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Ancient - I don't think anyone has mentioned this but the settler. I probably build at the very least 40 of these in a game (i'm talking small maps) Without them many people wouldn't be able to beat the game. Well except maybe Paul . But if you wanted only military units then the horsemen they are good for exploring and cheap. With Leo's they get transformed to cavs .

Renisance - Musketeers I'm usually not offensive until I get transport and a vet musketeer with walls is unbeatable (almost)

Industrial - When I said settler I won't say engineer. Probably the Cavelry is my favorite they provide nice fast attacks.

Modern - I think most players would agree the spy is one of the most (if not the most) important offensive and deffensive unit in the game. But if you don't count this then howitzer

	03-11-1999 02:27									#29
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See my answer in 3) for the "almost" after vet musketeers behind walls...

Carolus

	03-11-1999 05:44									#30
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25 k in the kitty? Not hard, but I find it boring to get that far ahead of the AI. I like it nice and easy, and then I go conquer with Knights in like 1200 AD.