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I didnt know that appearance was the most important factor in civ games....
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Shavlor
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Kempton, PA, USA
Oct 1999
time: 05:14
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DarthVeda: I beleive that if you didn't like the gameplay of CTP then you will probally not like gameplay of CTP2. I think that CTP has definately had the best graphics I have ever seen for a Civ. SMAC had ugly graphics in comparinson to CTP.
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Big Dave
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Texas
Apr 1999
time: 23:14
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Darth,
Have you read what's been done to nukes? MAD is now possible and nukes will have been changed, tho we're not sure exactly how. That was based on feedback from this forum. Numerous other changes have been made, again based on feedback from this and the CTP2 Suggestions forum.
If you are expecting the same Civ game you know and love, forget it, this is CTP and it's different. I personally love the unconventional warfare units and the way trade has been abstracted, just to name 2 of the improvements. The development team from Activision is listening to what we say in here. That means that the players are helping to design this game!!!!
You know how I feel about Activision doing us all wrong with CTP so I won't re-iterate that here, but I've got some hope for CTP2. I will of course try it before I buy, and I recommend that you do the same.
Yes, screenshots can be little more than eye candy. On the other hand some information has been gleaned from them. One of the things we've seen in screen shots are many more diplomatic options. Others are national borders and a city "radius" that grows as your city does. What are your comments on those?
Respectfully,
Big Dave
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The Kaiser
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Stoke-on-Trent, England
Dec 1999
time: 05:14
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I agree the TV man does look a bit stupid, but it's all about instant recon as your eyes scan the map.
As for the other units, I personally think that they didn't look aggressive enough.
And referring back to a thread which I started (but Activision never answered!), I think there wasn't enough city icon styles which would have added variety to the map.
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Diodorus Sicilus
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Steilacoom, WA, USA
May 1999
time: 05:14
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Back to Civ I !!??! Are you out of your cotton-pickng, ever-loving, blue-eyed mind?? The whole point of the Civ system continuous re-release of new games is to PROGRESS, not REGRESS.
Now, having finished screaming, I'll admit that the graphics in CtP, like too much of the rest of the game, were a question of "two steps forward, one step back"... BUT I maintain that the maps were not the main problem.
Frankly, the CtPII screenshots look fne from a map standpoint. What I ask of a game map is that it be functional - I've got to be able to distinquish all the types of terrain that affect play, and that it not hurt my eyes - keep the colors and forms as natural as possible while maintaining functionality. The CtPII shots seem to show these features, and while neatsy-keen maps with runing water and jumping fish and eruptng volcanoes, 16 different kinds of swamp and 13 varieties of beach might be nice, they ain't in no way required for a Civ-type game.
The graphics I worry about are the units, where CtP was, except for the animaion, largely a step backwards from Civ II.
Fur Gawd's sakes you Firaxial tyes, don't give us any more combat troops in white, red, black, or orange jumpsuits!!! Don't give me any more body types taken from the Steroid-sucking freaks at the local gym.
And as a bonus, please, please, please use some of the myriad actual historical troop types that are available in graphic form: from where I sit I can reach over 200 books with color or black/white illustrations of troopees from the Bronze Age to Yesterday. Osprey publishing in the UK alone has over 150 books full of military troop graphics in print right now. You got no excuse not to have exemplary unit icons: Don't Blow It!
...And while I'm on the subject. The animations of the units could use some tweaking, too. Pikemen and Knights stab their opponents with lances and pikes, they don't stand there and whack at them with a sword or halbard. The Trireme rammed to sink its opponent as its primary weapon, and why can't some game sometime actually show a mounted cavalryman charging instead of walking his horse up to the infantry like he was a traffic control mounted cop trying to shove them out of the way...
Enough ranting. The maps look fine from the screenshots, concentrate on the units now.
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Osco
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Brisbane,QLD,Australia
May 2000
time: 05:14
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The only reason this Darthveda kid is saying these things about CTP is because he is frustrated and unable to work out how to play the game....... he is probably 12 years old and wonders why it does not work like C&C
My advice to you Darthveda is to wait until you get a bit older or try reading some books you may develop a brain.
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Diodorus Sicilus
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Steilacoom, WA, USA
May 1999
time: 05:14
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Not only does no man in the world have a television for a head, but also no army in the world consistsd of a maximum of 9 men. ALL the units in CtP (or Civ II, or SMAX, or just about any other Strategy game) are CARTOONS. The whole debate so far is about which cartoons are believable and which are not, in the context of the game. From that standpoint, the Televangelist is no worse than the "future" units like War Walker or the totally @%#$@*up "historical" units like the Paratroop, Marine, Machinegunner, or Mounted Archer - my own candidates for "unit icons I could most do without"...
Meanwhile, since the whole debate is about individual perceptions, it's a dead-end. Drop it and move on to something constructive, like how to improve the map or unit graphics in ways that will appeal to more gamers, make more money for Firaxis, and move them to bring out more Civ games!
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The Kaiser
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Stoke-on-Trent, England
Dec 1999
time: 05:14
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How would improving CTP make more money for Firaxis?
However negative I think some of Darth's views are, I have to say I'm with him on the Televangelist.
And while were on it, why does the Cleric look like the Slaver with a dress on?
Also shouldn't Corporate Branch be available much later in the game, as he obviously has a futuristic anti-gravity desk?
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Nemo
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of no one.
Apr 1999
time: 23:14
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the graphics by activision seem to be, overall, better than most gaming companies of the same game genre. but i fully agree that they recycle their graphics...way too much. lets see...warwalker, can u say a miniature mechwarrior? and the wonders movies were all dupes too! like the edison lab one where the electric went through the wire... that was used in at least 3 wonders movies. and the space shoot in one of the wonder's clip was in at least 2 wonders movies. i like NEW material in a NEW game, not the same crap over and over again.
i dont pay $40+ to see something i already have sitting on the back shelf collecting dust (afterall, i bought ctp practically at opening on the release date...and it lasted 18 days on my pc - 6 for each patch + 6 for the boxed - it has collected ALOT of dust since on my shelf...good thing i dont make the same mistakes twice, though =).
so, i fully agree with darthvada et al. that the graphics are, but should not be, recycled ... regardless of how good they were.
when i bought civ II, it felt AND LOOKED like a new game compared to civ I. something that was worth my money, and played like a new game, not like a patch. grrrr, i get tense just thinking about this new $40 patch ...k, i am going to lurk back at the civ 3 forum now...u know that game thats coming out with NEW GRAPHICS and that is not going to be fixing any problems with civ II...hey, did civ II even have a patch? hmmm, if it did i sure didnt need it to play the game...now ctp i KNOW had patches, cause i couldn't play without them (or even with them for that matter)
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and once more i wonder when the hell did graphics became the most important factor in civ games...
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The Kaiser
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Stoke-on-Trent, England
Dec 1999
time: 05:14
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I believe the point is that if there is little visual change evident in the screen shots provided, it implys that the game as a whole is nothing more than a glorified patch. And however many "New" features might have been added, a lot of CTP1's bad features will be carried over into CTP2.
Yes we know fancy graphics are used many times to hide terrible gameplay, but were talking about Intelligent use of graphics. CTP1 doesn't use graphics intelligently, if it did you wouldn't get only a few ancient city icons, guys with television heads, amazing anti-gravity desks and numerous graphical repetitions.
If the graphics are unintelligent, how can we expect the game design to be any different!
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Milkman
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Oak Harbor, Washington, USA
May 2000
time: 05:14
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Personal opinion here but graphics only look good the first time u see it. Unit animation cool for a few minutes, then seen it, ok big deal, they get turned off. Animated trade goods, looks great, ok turned off. Wonder movies, same as above. After playing the game a few times its just more clutter on the map for me.
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23-07-2000 23:09
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