04-12-2000 21:50									#1
	(Graphical) User Interface development Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Now that many of us are working on or are contributing to making the (G)UI, here's finally the tread to it.

First I want to say that the UI is a major priority now as it will be the thing that makes us connect some of the models together or at least gives us the ability to make a working demo. We are doing a great job I think currently, now hope we can finish it within 1-2 months. That should be possible I think.

The coding of the UI is now being tested using a new CDX class, but I'm not the one to tell you about. What I already HAVE done is making an example of how the structure of the graphical part should be. This first design is a simple, VERY basic pic of what the structure should look like according to Amjayee and me (as we discussed in the last meeting last Sunday). It's located at http://home.domaindlx.com/ggs/screendesign.gif . Take a look and let us know what you think of it.

I will make a somewhat more specific design this week. I also promised to everyone in the meeting I will try to make a design for the Ingame Graphics of the GUI.

That's it for now.

	05-12-2000 11:29									#2
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I agree that UI is the most important thing and top priority right now. Everything else will be contructed on top of it. So, we programmers will make it ready (or at least almost ready) before proceeding to other tasks. And I think 1-2 months is realistic as a time frame, if everything goes as well as right now. Expect some results already this week, though this is not very serious promise. And also remember we are right now mostly prototyping the UI system, so anything we make will not yet be final.

	06-12-2000 00:18									#3
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Here are some tasks for graphics people: first we need a mouse cursor. It can be a simple bitmap, up to 32bpp, and size doesn't really matter, but of course it has to be reasonable. Also shape doesn't matter, but it perhaps should fit into the theme of the UI. Colors should be made so, that it is clearly visible against the elements on the screen. Transparent color can be any RGB color; just put one pixel of that color into the upper left corner of the bitmap, that way it's easiest to handle.

Also we need an icon for the game program. It should perhaps describe the game somehow. It has to be in .ico format. The current icon is 32x32 and is in 256 colors. I'm not sure if we can use more modern icon types, but it is likely. Also ideas for the icon are welcome.

Heardie, perhaps you should contact Elmo to discuss your ideas for the UI graphics. And also others who are interested.

	06-12-2000 02:16									#4
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Keep up the good work, guys!

Since most of the team is working on the UI right now, it should be pretty cool.

As you know I don't really have any idea on how to make a UI, but when you have something I will be ready to test and comment! And untill then I will just keep thinking about design stuff.

------------------
"It ain't broke, so BREAK it."
- Raingoon

GGS Website

	06-12-2000 04:59									#5
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Hum well, what does the icon have to look like? Are the name (GGS) has to be in it? And the cursor: does it have to be a normal styled pointer? I like an normal arrow or something more than an object or anything like that, like an spear or something.
But that's just my opinion.

And I also need more visoins on the graphical look (the structure) or do we all agree with the screendesign.gif I made?

	06-12-2000 07:05									#6
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Okay I whipped somethine up but its pretty crappy. The thing it could be useful for is for others to create there own UI (i.e. Elmo), and it has the right sizzed images in it.
http://members.xoom.com/acchiron/ui.zip

hehardie

	06-12-2000 12:59									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

About the pointer, an arrow, or a triangle, or something like that is fine. But the colors should be appropriate. About the icon, I don't have any specific opinion of it. The name in the icon is not necessary... just something that looks like our game. If it is good-looking and appropriate, I'm sure it will be fine. Any ideas for these are welcome.

About the graphical look of the UI, I agree with what we agreed in the meeting. I'm making a test program, with which I will give a sample of what I think it should be like. Heardie's graphics are a good starting-point, though they are perhaps a little dark. I will come back to this later.

	06-12-2000 21:11									#8
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Amjayee: About the cdx-thingie you made: can you post it here? I can't seem to open it from the sourceforge mailing list (it's just *&^#G@(ETF| text). If you haven't got a server for it, please mail it to me ( elmo@theelk.com ) and i'll upload it. thnx.
[This message has been edited by ElmoTheElk (edited December 06, 2000).]

	06-12-2000 21:40									#9
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I would like to hold the publishing of the UI demo until it is more finished. I can send it to you, since you work closely in the making of the UI, but please don't upload it here! I will do it when it is ready.

	07-12-2000 12:40									#10
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OK. Thanks all right. I just can't seem to open the files attached to the mailing list posts... Does anybody know how this work (I presume so)?

	08-02-2001 23:45									#11
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Hi all!

Finaly I found some time to make a GUI design. Since we make a UI, we need a graphical thingy too right? See it on this location. It's almost 0,5 mb so be patient.

More GUI development soon.

ElmoTheElk
[This message has been edited by ElmoTheElk (edited February 08, 2001).]

	10-02-2001 08:43									#12
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Nice. Real Nice.

	12-02-2001 04:19									#13
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Looks ok, we need more.

	15-02-2001 14:43									#14
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I really liked that image, as I said earlier. Something like that style is what we need. Of course the functioning of the UI will need to be considered carefully, since the system will be quite complex. The buttons in the left hand side are good, with them we can handle the map layers and perhaps some menu systems. I hope I could code some kind of example of how the UI could work some time soon.

	24-02-2001 10:24									#15
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That looks really good.

Although I think the small map view should be larger, so the whole bottom line should be wider. Otherwise it is real nice.

Now we just need to put something in it...

------------------
"If you are to hurt someone you better do it so good that you don't have to fear revenge."
- Machiavelli

GGS Website

	24-02-2001 10:42									#16
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One more thing:

Since my mail is flooded with loads and loads of unread mails I have no idea if I can find the newest version of the UI anywhere.

So could someone please mail me (not via sourceforge, in stead use my mail adress bjarkestaunolsen@ofir.dk ) the newest version, including all graphics and everything else needede, so I can see it.

Thank you.

------------------
"If you are to hurt someone you better do it so good that you don't have to fear revenge."
- Machiavelli

GGS Website

	23-02-2001 23:00									#17
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Oh yeah. Could it be today or tomorrow? I am only home for the weekend, so I would like to be able to download it to my own computer. Those iMacs aren't something you would want to download anything to, not to mention the fact that the thing propable wont work on them.

------------------
"If you are to hurt someone you better do it so good that you don't have to fear revenge."
- Machiavelli

GGS Website

	25-02-2001 01:17									#18
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I send the files to you! Have fun with it. (They include the newer graphics.)

Elmo

	13-03-2001 23:38									#19
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i'm going to check out the UI files and helpout on this front ASAP

korn469
[This message has been edited by korn469 (edited March 13, 2001).]

	19-04-2001 01:31									#20
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Since I am still not 100% happy with my previous design, and I had some spare time, I made a new ingame-gui-designe. You can see it on the web site (here), or directly here:


(This is a mirror, since I noticed the web site is really slow lately...)

Please give reactions!

Elmo
[This message has been edited by ElmoTheElk (edited April 18, 2001).]

	19-04-2001 03:59									#21
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Very nice, especially three butons ... they look so clickable

	19-04-2001 22:36									#22
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I like this a lot. It is very beatiful-looking, and quite original. I like especially the transparent effect in the panels on the right. This way. we could get a full-screen map view; the "floating" effect of the panels is really nice. I think we should go for this look! Have you thought of the menu screens? What should they look like? Should we have full-screen menus or floating menus like in windows? In most cases, I would like the full-screen menus more, only some small pop-up menus would be floating... but I'm not sure. At least the largest main screens, like the region menu, science menu, economy menu, should perhaps be full-screen, with the similar look as the map.

	19-04-2001 23:08									#23
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EXACTLY the way I wanted to see the UI!! That's amazing elmo, I envisiged just this sort of thing for the game, menu's, but a world image which spans most of the screen.

I will look right now at putting this into the game, cos it's ace

	20-04-2001 00:34									#24
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Thanks for the compliments, but now I hope YOU can program it...
I prefer floating windows. Mainly because they look better, but I also want to move them around so that I can loook what's under it. (I used this a lot in civ2).


ore later (working on a window example).

	20-04-2001 19:10									#25
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WOHOOOO!!!!

That is amazing!

You know what bothers me about most open source programs and games? Their UI always look really unprofessional.

But GGS is by all means the EXTREME exception to this "rule". Thanks to Elmo.

I really like the news ticker/message board. It is great. I think there should propably be an info board somewhere on the UI, with lots of buttons and stuff to access all the different menus. But where could we put that? Would it be too much to put it beneath the big map? Or maybe if the news ticker and minimap to the right thicker, the news ticker wouldn't fill as much in the length, and there would be room for an info board beneath the minimap? I am not sure, just some suggestions to an already fantastic design.

I agree with Vet, BTW. The buttons look great!

And I agree with you, Elmo, that floating windows should be used for menus. I think this that you have made should be the "ground level" of UI, and then everything else are floating windows on top of it.

------------------
"All that monsters fear is the day."
- Kashmir

GGS Website

	21-04-2001 15:03									#26
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Jep, I was also thinking about that. To give a little example:



This should be the research screen you see here. Don't know f this system will be used, but it's just to give an impression. (also made a new mouse, which is pretty good think...)

About the panel:"I think we can make a lot more buttons right next to the map, ticker, etc. windows. Just like where they are now, but a little bit smaller and more then. Or do you think we have so much buttons there so that it won't fit? I don't think we have SO much buttons, I don't know what for! (We still use the system from the previous interface where the expanding panels pop up and show more.)

About the unit/city/etc. graphics. I'm not too good in it, except from copy and paste, and there are so many good artists out there,. I mean, you can found literly 100s of unit graphics for free, made by civ2 fans, so why not ask some high quality 2d artists if they want to make some for our project? They may like it!

	21-04-2001 15:13									#27
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heardie bows to Elmo

Great work!!

	21-04-2001 19:31									#28
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Man, this is ace! The colors are really beatiful and the layout too. I'm very enthusiastic with this. About buttons to access menus, info boxes and such, perhaps we should have a pop-up menu which come forward when you press right mouse button, and there you could access the menus? It would be sad to obscure the beatiful screen with too many buttons and stuff.

	23-04-2001 03:35									#29
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Thats a really good option! I LOVE the right-clcks popup menu's. Never seen them in a game though, how strange...

Maybe we should settle this later, because we have to know what sort of menu's we have and what you should be able to do with it. We haven't got this info right now...

Elmo

	26-04-2001 04:58									#30
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hey, am I only one who likes chrispies latest work??
If something needs doing for map routines, I can do it just name the thing. I know amjayee and Leland had some ideas but I am near to finished with this book I work with and a bit before schedule, so I have more time.

by the way, there were right-clicks in SMAC too. I am not against them, but dont see much in them either.