16-08-2001 06:23									#31
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It is noteworthy that the top 3 (Mongols, Spanish, Vikings) are all extremely aggressive tribes .....

	16-08-2001 14:56									#32
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Arabs 20
Spanish 20
Mongols 20
Celts 20
Vikings 20
Inca 20
Maya 20
Finnish 20

	16-08-2001 17:18									#33
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My left 5 votes:

Poland +5

To Locutus:

Netherlands could be expansionist as they participate in the age of imperialism and founded colonies (not only trade post) in America (north america and antilles), Africa (boers land), Asia (indonesia),... and they had one of the great navies of the XVII-XVIII century. Probably it was much more a "commercial expansionsit" than a "militar expansionist". Anyway, I agree with you that scientific could be also apropiape.
What I can´t understand is why in Civ 3 romans are not "expansionist", probably we must first agree about the meaning of "expansionism" in Civ3.

	16-08-2001 21:56									#34
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Also notable about the top three is that they were all in Civ II

Changes to my votes:
Arabs -5 (to 15)
Byzantines +5 (to 20)

Assyrians +5 (to 20)
Spanish -5 (to 10)

Hebrews -5 (to 10)
Incas -5 (to 5)
Hittites +10 (to 10)

(My original post was in the second thread.)

Looking at this, it seems what I really want is an ancient modpack/scenario, since there's not much point in Hittites and Assyrians if there's only 18 25- and 50-year turns between 1100 BC and 600 BC.

	17-08-2001 02:33									#35
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Here are my votes:

Spanish 20
Vikings 20
Monghols 20
Arabs 20
Turks 20
Celts 20
Israelis 10
Portugese10
Hittites 10
Phoenicians/Carthagians 10

	17-08-2001 04:14									#36
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Kalispera Amsterdam!
Good Afternoon Amsterdam!

Here are the results of the greek jury

Mongols 20 points / Les Mongoles 20 points (Ghenkis goes crazy)

Serbians 20 points / Les Serbes 20 points (Yugo flags fly in the stadium)

Spanish 20 points / Les Espagnoles 20 points (the stadium nearly collapses from screams of enthusiasm)

Celts 20 points / Les Celtes 20 points (people in funny skirts start dancing)

Hebrews 20 points / Les Hebrew(?) 20 points (Eli breaks down and cries)

Ottomans 20 points / Les Ottomans 20 points (guys with big mustaches weaver red flags with the islamic symbol and smile)

Belgium 20 points/ La Belgique 20 points (Paiktis22 winkes )

Vikings 20 points / Les Viking 20 points (the stadium is covered with flags with asymetrical crosses, people scream)



And this concludes the voting of the greek jury

Last edited by Bereta_Eder on 17-08-2001 at 04:20

	17-08-2001 04:51									#37
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Hello, here are my votes:

Maya - 20 points
Inca - 01 point
Portuguese - 20 points

Thanks, keep up the good work.

	17-08-2001 07:00									#38
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1 Scandinavian 20
2 Arab 20
3 Mongol 15
4 Spanish 15
5 Lithuanian 15
6 Zimbabwe 10
7 Armenia 10
8 Polynesian 10
9 Ottoman 10
10 Hebrew 10
11 Thai 8
11 Phoenicians 5
12 Kazakh 5
13 Dutch 3
15 Vietnamese 2
16 Uzbek 2

Here are my votes for what their worth. However, an expansion pack limited to just 16 new civs would have limited value. I would propabaly still buy it, but would like to see at least 64 if not more.

	18-08-2001 01:02									#39
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My 16:

Inca
Spanish
Songhay
Swahili
Askum
Pheonecian (sp?)
Maya
Khmer
Arab
Dutch
Mali
Uzbeks
Kazakhs
Polynesians
Swedish
Poles

	18-08-2001 02:26									#40
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ok here we go

1 Vikings 20
2 Spanish 20
3 Polynesians 20
4 Mayans 18
5 celts 15
6 Aborigines 15
7 huns 15
8 Arabs 14
9 Bysantines 13
10 Hebrews 13
11 Siamese 12
12 Eskimos 11
13 Mongols 10
14 Georgians 9
15 Tibetans 2
16 Poles 1

	18-08-2001 15:06									#41
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My list o' civilizations:

Incas 20
Mongols 20
Vikings 20
Phoenicians 20
Mayans 15
Spanish 15
Ethiopians 15
Khmer 15
Inuit 10
Polynesians 10

	18-08-2001 15:28									#42
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20 for each:

Arabs
Canadians
Ethiopians
Khmer
Koreans
Malian
Portuguese
Spanish

	18-08-2001 18:46									#43
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Vikings 20
Inca 20
Maya 20
Celts 20
Sioux 20
Assyrians 20
Byzantines 20
Spanish 20

	19-08-2001 00:41									#44
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quote: cuz the Americans (the whole continent) love themself soooo much.... They can't get enough from their own continent, so they forget that there is a world outside.

What the hell are we thinking, I mean we shouldn't even include civs from the western hemisphere. Plus a lot of Europeans might get mad if we don't have at least 3/4 of the civs being European. Having two civs from North America and one Central Ameirca civ is an outrage, only having six European (including Russians even though they are more less Euroasian) civs is not enough. Europe is a small land mass so they should have more civs than the North America land mass that is big. Europe rules all and we always rule all. While we're at why are people even voting for Asian civs or for that matter why were Asian civs included in the first place. From now on we can only vote for Europeans, we need to be ripped of our opinion so some of the Europenas won't get upset that all of their civs aren't getting voted for.

	19-08-2001 08:30									#45
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Yes hell. Why is everybody so negative about America, the USA and the Americans?? I love them. If it hadn't been for them (maybe) my country and many others would still be ruled by nazi minihitlers :banned: . Nooorgeee! So quit being so damn eurocentric you guys.










edit: smileys.

Last edited by Gangerolf on 19-08-2001 at 19:18

	19-08-2001 10:11									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Gangerolf Yes hell. Why is everybody so negative about America, the USA and the Americans?? Hææ? I love them. If it hadn't been for them (maybe) my country and many others would still be ruled by nazi minihitlers. Nooorgeee! So quit being so damn eurocentric you guys.

	20-08-2001 04:45									#47
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Most people identify a civilization with a nationality; I'm not against a national element in the game, but everyone should understand the enormous difference separating these concepts.

Here is a list of civilisations one could defend as reasonably accurate -though still a matter of opinion:
1. Sumerian/Babylonian
2. Egyptian
3. Indus/Dravidian
4. Chinese
5. Greek
6. Roman
7. Mayan/Meso-American
8. Inca/Andes
9. Byzantine/Orthodox
10. Latin/Catholic
11. Islamic/Near Eastern
12. Germanic/Protestant
13. Russian/Slav
14. Indian/Hindu
15. Japanese
16. Tibetan
17. South East Asian
18. sub-Saharan civilization??

Of course every list is open to debate. As one should acknowledge its religion that identifies all civilizations! One could still argue the existence of a Celtic, Persian or Turkish civilization. But that would be the limit. McNeill, the authority who more or less introduced the concept of civilization in historiography, recognizes even less: Mesopotamian, Egyptian, merging into Near Eastern, (3)Indian, Chinese, Japanese and (6)Western, which he only divides into Greek Orthodox and Latin Catholic.
Those asking for Hunnish or Mongol civilazations absolutely miss the point: those were the barbarians!

I would gladly have given all my 160 points to the Sumerians, who were definitely 'THE CIVILISATION'! Or have split them equally between the Indus, Byzantine and Sumerian civilisations. Yet I will abide with the rules -though it's a complete waste of time of course!

My points:
Sumerians 20
Indus/Dravidians 20 (Important: this civilisation is not identical to the Indian civilisation. It was in about 1500BC destroyed by charioteering Aryans. Ribannah will explain why they didn't invade on horseback, though they had mastered Horseback riding)
Mayan 20
Inca/Andes 20
Byzantine/Orthodox 20
Latin/Catholic 20
Islamic/Near Eastern 20
Tibetan 10
South East Asian 10

I would like to draw attention to the fact that I supported almost exclusively non-European civilisations. Nor did I support my 'own' nation, because there never was a 'Dutch civilisation'! Yet I live in Europe and am a real snob.
Some people's emotional stability seems at stake when these issues are discussed....

	20-08-2001 16:57									#48
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Locutus, can I (slightly) change my vote?
Apache -5
Sioux -5
(only one native american civ is enough)
Inca +10

Sorry for your extra work.

	21-08-2001 02:40									#49
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Here is my list
Mayas 20
Spanish 20
Incas 20
Caribbeans 10
Esquimos 10
Vikings 10
Mongols 10
Persians 10

	21-08-2001 03:25									#50
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Scots -5

Inuit +5

	21-08-2001 06:00									#51
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Swedish-20
Viking-20
Byzantine-20
New Foundland!-20

	21-08-2001 18:56									#52
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Mongols 20
Spanish 10
Vikings 20
Arabs 15
Turks 20
Thai 10
Incas 15
Sioux 10
Ethiopians 20
Poles 20

	21-08-2001 21:12									#53
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160 points total?

If so, here's my list

Arabs 20
Incas 35
Etruscans 20
Mayans 35
Khmer 30
And for my own people, for never getting any votes in the EuroVision song contest : Finns 20 points

	21-08-2001 22:50									#54
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My votes !

I don't used "historical accurancy" to the names to make them easier:

- Catalans (The Crown of Aragon) 20
- Incans (The Birú) 20
- Castillians/Spanish (Castilla/Spain) 20
- Ethiopians (Ethiopia) 20

- Siamese (Siam Empire) 10
- Portuguese (Portugal) 10
- Malians?? (Mali) 10
- Polynesians (Hawaii) 10
- Swagilians (Nigeria) 10
- Mayans (Maya Empire) 10
- Arabians (Arabia) 10
- Turkish (Otoman Empire) 10

	22-08-2001 04:09									#55
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Please fix:

Khmer -5
Ethiopians +5
Etruscans -5
Hittites -5
Polish -5
Mali +15

	22-08-2001 10:09									#56
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quote: Originally posted by laurentius 160 points total? If so, here's my list Arabs 20 Incas 35 Etruscans 20 Mayans 35 Khmer 30 And for my own people, for never getting any votes in the EuroVision song contest : Finns 20 points

Max 20 points per civ.

	23-08-2001 00:04									#57
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quote: Originally posted by hetairoi22 Max 20 points per civ.

ooops

Arabs 20
Incas 20
Etruscans 20
Mayans 20
Khmer 20
Finns 20 points

	24-08-2001 15:35									#58
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Dutch 20
Spanish 20
Incas 20
Goths 20
Vikings 15
Mongols 15
Phoenicians 10
Arabs 10
Huns 10
Burgondians 5
Vandals 5
Ethiopians 5
Sioux 4
Texans 1

	24-08-2001 19:47									#59
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quote: Originally posted by S. Kroeze Most people identify a civilization with a nationality; I'm not against a national element in the game, but everyone should understand the enormous difference separating these concepts. Here is a list of civilisations one could defend as reasonably accurate -though still a matter of opinion: 1. Sumerian/Babylonian 2. Egyptian 3. Indus/Dravidian 4. Chinese 5. Greek 6. Roman 7. Mayan/Meso-American 8. Inca/Andes 9. Byzantine/Orthodox 10. Latin/Catholic 11. Islamic/Near Eastern 12. Germanic/Protestant 13. Russian/Slav 14. Indian/Hindu 15. Japanese 16. Tibetan 17. South East Asian 18. sub-Saharan civilization?? Of course every list is open to debate. Those asking for Hunnish or Mongol civilazations absolutely miss the point: those were the barbarians!

I agree with almost all of Kroeze accurate post, with the only exception IMHO about the need to have the Mongols *in* the game, because they are the true barbarians, but they don't played a rule as limited as Civ III will reduce barbarians in game.

My vote:

Mongols 15
Sumerian 15
Mayan/Meso-American 15
Inca/Andes 15
Byzantine/Orthodox 20
Latin/Catholic 15
Islamic/Near Eastern 15
Tibetan 20
South East Asian 15
sub-Saharian 15

	25-08-2001 02:10									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Adm.Naismith I agree with almost all of Kroeze accurate post, with the only exception IMHO about the need to have the Mongols *in* the game, because they are the true barbarians, but they don't played a rule as limited as Civ III will reduce barbarians in game.

Dear Admiral,

Thank you for your kind words and moral support!
Are you sure the wings of the barbarians will be clipped?
It was my impression they will have more importance than in CivII, at least I hope so.

Sincere regards,

S.Kroeze