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Leonidas
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If this is true, then it sounds like the game is being "rushed" to meet a deadline date, rather than it being polished to include all the "extras", one would expect in a strategy game of this type.
A chill runs down my back every time I hear a game is being released on a certain date because of a deadline.
What else will be missing from this game? What type of bugs are we likely to encounter? I for one am tired of downloading patch after patch for a game, that should have been made to work properly in the first place.
Who's going to pay full price for the Special Edition now that we have suspicions about it missing some game features?
The more I hear about this game, the more worried I become.
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Nemo
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of no one.
Apr 1999
time: 23:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Rhysie
People saying they are going to download it just because it doesn't have MP support are cheap idiots. |
If someone d/l's it with intent on buying it when MP comes out I think that that is not being cheap, but a want to not get ripped off and have to buy the SP 2 times. If there is no intent on buying it, then I agree that they are cheep idiots 
quote:
Originally posted by Rhysie
Don't use this issue as a cover up to hide your low morality. |
If a company purposely leaves a critical aspect of a product out with intent to make more money at a later time, then who really has the low morality? In times like this I think that the companies who cry out "they infringed our copyrights ..blah, blah, blah, by downloading a warez" are only being hypocritical, because they do not see the rights their customers have...the right to not be conned, to not be ripped off, the right to not have their hard earned money taken from them twice for the same product. 
Imagine if you paid for a fully loaded car, only to get a stripped down model, and have the dealer tell you, "you can get all the extras in 6 months, we just didn't have time to put them in right now. we are too busy" then in 6 months you go back and they say "oh, yeah, you'll have to buy a whole new car of the same make and model, but this time we'll give you the extras." I will guarantee that if this happened, car vandalism would sky rocket, too! People don't like being conned out of their hard earned money , the government already does it once each pay check  So, if this gamed gets its profits cut due to warez, I think they have Infograms' marketing department to thank for it. And I would feel bad for Firaxis for picking the wrong publisher, a publisher which seems to have shafted them on their reputation for producing quality games.
If MP is truly being released separately, then I will only blame Infograms, they are the decision makers here. And Firaxis should think about their reputation (so far, it's good) next time they pick a publisher.
Last edited by Nemo on 09-09-2001 at 22:27
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ProfessorPhobos
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Let's think about Firaxis for a moment. They have stated that they feel the Single Player component of the game is finished, and it's pretty darn good. So for the sake of argument, let's assume that's true.
Now, this rumor says that Firaxis might not have full multiplayer support ready by their Infogames deadline, probably forcing them to release it later in an expansion pack. (Certainly containing extra goodies to make up for the extra money)
Now, let's say Firaxis does what the screaming in this forum suggests- and keeps the incomplete multiplayer in the first release. Now they are damned by complaints anyway- you'll ***** and moan about the crappy multiplayer.(Which probably means "Online play", not PBEM or Hotseat.)
So they can either release a working multiplayer later, with lots of extra goodies to soften the blow, or a non-working multiplayer at first, thus slamming them with accusations of "incompleteness."
Reviews will be harder on games with bad multiplayer than with games without multiplayer at all.(Again, this probably means online play. PBEM shouldn't be affected, I think.)
Personally, I'd rather wait for working multiplayer+extra goodies, than get a game with good singleplayer+terrible multiplayer+no extra goodies.
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dainbramaged13
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Dumbass
Mar 2000
time: 00:15
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quote:
Originally posted by reds4ever
it's not like Civ depends on impulse shoppers, people have been waiting for 6 years for this game, theres a commited community, sales don't depend on o load of spotty 8 year olds going "gee mom, that looks neat! can i have it for christmas?" |
thats how i got civ2!  of course i was 10, but... 
quote:
If a company purpos++++leaves a critical aspect of a product out with intent to make more money at a later time, then who really has the low morality? |
DO you really think firaxis/infogrames is doing it ON PURPOSE!?!
I think firaxis had the deadline, so they made a desicion at some point that they couldn't finish both parts by the deadline in full, so they decided to make SP complete by the deadline, and release multiplayer later, also complete, instead of releasing a half-baked/incomplete version of both on the deadline. The option was NOT there for them to release both at a later date.
Another thing, kind of related to the above staement, is that while everyone here at apolyton and other gaming sites love to trash deadlines, they are important in the world of business, finance, and economics, and you really cant be so selfish as to ask firaxis to follow your orders as opposed to their bosses.
Also, i think that the points I am making have already been made a thousand times, in slightly different ways, and the same thing for the points those opposed to me. We just keeping being lured to pressing that 'reply' button one more time because we believe were going to change someones mind. And so far, i havent seen anyones mind changed. so essentially, after the first page of presenting opinions and backing each other up, this thread is useless. I feel like im reading the same thing over and over again.
just my $0.02
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ProfessorPhobos
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<<<,Polite request to Firaxis.
Finish the ****er before you sell it. Thank you.>>>>>
Sorry, but Firaxis isn't selling Civiliazation 3. Infogames is. And Infogames is going to sell it when Infogames wants to sell it, even if Firaxis isn't ready.
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Rhysie
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England
Jul 2001
time: 05:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Nemo
If someone d/l's it with intent on buying it when MP comes out I think that that is not being cheap, but a want to not get ripped off and have to buy the SP 2 times. If there is no intent on buying it, then I agree that they are cheep idiots |
Sure, you're right. BUT, if you don't think the SP is worth buying, why don't you just wait for the MP version and buy that? Then you have only paid for it once, and haven't downloaded anything.
And if you think the SP is worth buying but you don't think its fair to pay twice for MP, then buy the SP and then make the decision to download or not when the MP comes out. It will probably be free anyway!
quote:
Imagine if you paid for a fully loaded car, only to get a stripped down model, and have the dealer tell you, "you can get all the extras in 6 months, we just didn't have time to put them in right now. we are too busy" |
This is a totally different situation. For a start, you haven't paid for the game yet. If you want the 'fully loaded game' and they are offering you a 'stripped down model', then simply don't buy it! Tell them you'll come back in six months. No one is forcing you people to own a copy of the game, if you don't want to pay for it without MP, then _PRETEND THE RELEASE WAS DELAYED_ and just buy it when the MP version comes out...
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ProfessorPhobos
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quote:
Originally posted by Bugs ****ing Bunny
Cheers, Phobos. It's always refreshing to encounter people who aren't afraid to exercise their pedantry within seconds of joining.
Feel free to substitute "Infogames" where appropriate. |
I only joined to offer a more moderate, calm, viewpoint in the face of all this screaming.
I do think it's an important difference- personally attacking the Firaxians solves nothing. If you want to get something done, Infogames is the root of the problem, I think.
Personally, I'd mostly play Single Player anyway, so Multiplayer isn't a big deal. I'd give it a shot though. I think it's telling that 6 months is what's required to get multiplayer done- obviously it's not even close to ready now. I'm willing to wait. Patience, is, after all, a virtue.
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Leonidas
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Firaxis should have stood up to Infogrames - Sid's name has to mean something in the gaming world.
Ensemble stood up to Microsoft when it wanted Age of Empires released early. Ensemble convinced Microsoft that they had a hell of a product, but they needed more time and money to finish it properly. And the rest is history. . .
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Leonidas
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No one is saying anything about the development team or even Firaxis.
Infogrames has set the deadline date. Period.
In turn, the people at Firaxis have had to decide what they can or cannot implement in the game by that deadline date.
Will things be left out of the game? Duh. . .
Will a series of patches be released to fix all the things the in-house testers did not find or have the time to fix? Duh. . .
Will an expansion pack be put out 6 months from now that will include many of the things that didn't make it into the game because of this release date? Duh. . .
Last edited by Leonidas on 10-09-2001 at 22:26
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Mergle
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Well, I never play multiplayer (I simply don't have the time), but this scenario has got me very worried. The point (as many are saying) is that it suggests many other things are being left out.
Those who are saying "don't blame FIRAXIS, blame infogrames for setting the deadline" are missing the point. FIRAXIS should have negotiated a contract that they could fulfill. If they failed to judge how long it would take them to code their game, that's their lookout.
I will say I am dismayed by FIRAXIS' failure to confirm or deny this rumour. It would be so easy to deny, so I suspect it is true. It's a bit shoddy of FIRAXIS not to come clean with us now the cat's out of the bag, if it's true.
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09-09-2001 15:58
You pay a reduced price for a great Civ-3 expansion-pack with all kinds of cool stuff, where complete multiplayer-support is only one added feature amongst other things. 
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