15-09-2001 20:10									#1
	Turks/Ottomans Remove this text

As Locutus changed the style of his poll a while ago to not separate the same civ in different names we need to select the best name for the top 16 civs with more then one suggested name. I choose top 16 as an Expansion most likely not will include more civs then the game itself and because the differences between the civs are lower under that. (Actually the top 16 may still change, but I don't think that any of the double named civs will drop out of the top.)
This thread is made for the Turks/Ottomans civ, currently on sixth position.

We should also try to describe the Civ, and find possible Unique Units and leaders.

For some reason the Yes! post a poll unmarked when I submitted, so I post again.
I'll edit the old thread later, and ask Mark to close it.

Other POLLs in the series:
Phoenicians/Carthaginians
Hebrew/Israelis
Ethiopians/Aksumites

Last edited by Gramphos on 15-09-2001 at 21:09

	16-09-2001 00:38									#2
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The Constantinople/Bursa-based Ottomans are more interesting than their Samarkand-based progenitors.

	16-09-2001 00:39									#3
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Who could possibly be voting Turks? Ottoman empire's important...

	16-09-2001 02:00									#4
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The Ottoman Empire should be its name if the Sejuilk Turks are in the game, however, if the Sejiulk turks are not in the game, then they should group the empires into the same civilization- the Turks.

	16-09-2001 17:29									#5
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Who is voting for the Turks.
IIRC, the Turks have only been a nation for about 80 years. (By far the shortest span of time for any civ in the game). The Ottomans ruled the Bosphorus for hundreds. They were a true empire. I would even vote for the Byzantines ahead of the Turks....

	16-09-2001 18:31									#6
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Actually I am surprised anybody votes for Ottomans. Ottoman Empire took its name from its legendary founder, Ottoman. The people were always referred to as Turks (even during the Ottoman Empire).

However there is simple solution to this problem - the civilisation should be called Turks, and the state - Ottoman Empire.

	16-09-2001 18:40									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Martinus However there is simple solution to this problem - the civilisation should be called Turks, and the state - Ottoman Empire.

Exactly. That was never a problem for me. Even during the grandest days of the Ottoman Empire, the civ was always reffered as Turkish in all its socio-economico-cultural essence.

	16-09-2001 22:44									#8
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Leader: Suleyman the Magnificent
Unit: Janissary (a special of musketman)
Civ. Abilities: Militaristic and (perhaps) Religious

What do you think?

	16-09-2001 23:59									#9
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We dont need another civ in that area. Theres already the Greeks, Persians and Babylonians. We need 2 more Asian civs (Mongols, Aboriginese (sp?)) and 2 more American civs (Incas, Inuits)

And maybe the Vikings and/0r Fins

	17-09-2001 00:07									#10
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Turks includes a lot more that jsut the Ottomans

	17-09-2001 00:57									#11
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Ottomans is better to clarify the difference from the people of Central Asia. Yes I know that the Ottomans were referred to as Turks. Whatever we do it will be confusing.

	17-09-2001 11:44									#12
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This is a trivial naming convention. Turks is a broader or more restricted name, depending on your point of view, while Ottomans limit the civ to a better defined people/era. I abstain from the voting.

As long as they finally get in Civilization!!!

	17-09-2001 16:50									#13
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Seeing as how the average uneducated consumer will hear "Turks" and think of some pidling (though not so pidling) middle eastern/aegean country, but when they hear "Ottoman Empire" they are more likely to either think "Large Mediteranean/Balken Empire" or "That sounds cool and fascinating, Ill look into that," so I vote Ottoman Empire.

	18-09-2001 04:30									#14
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"Turks" is too vague if you're going to include everything from the Seljuks to modern-day Turkey.

	18-09-2001 07:09									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola Turks includes a lot more that jsut the Ottomans

Isn't it the Ottoman Empire that included many more peoples than just the Turks?

Ottomans just seem more impressive. I think of harem girls and hookah pipes and the Hagia Sophia. (Though I suppose this all pertains to the Turks as well) The Ottoman Empire just sounds more exotic and intriguing than Turkey.

Lawrence of Arabia- This isn't about whether or not they should be included, this is about what they should be called.

	18-09-2001 15:10									#16
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They should be called Turks, but I guess I am not that bothered with it. Ottoman empire would confuse ordinary public.