04-05-2001 17:50									#1
	Do You Play SP or MP ? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I keep finding myself having to specify if I mean single player or multiplayer.

To the people who ONLY play SP, why?
This is assuming you have MGE.

Why would you have MGE, and evidently an internet connection, and only play SP?

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It's In The Way That You Use It
Tuatha De Danann Tribe

	04-05-2001 18:19									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I don't have MGE so I play SP I won't play MP till Civ 3 comes along I think.

	04-05-2001 18:22									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I figured there were some like you around, but is it a time issue with those who DO have MGE?

It's like 2 completely, yes completely, different games.

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It's In The Way That You Use It
Tuatha De Danann Tribe

	04-05-2001 18:46									#4
	Suffering from ads?

Yes, a time issue. I rarely have an uninterrupted block of several hours I can devote to Civ. The computer is happy to play 30 minutes or an hour at a time, but not many humans are. MP is unquestionably a better game than beating up the AI, but it takes (at least) two to tango. I'm hoping Civ III has a good implementation of PBEM.

	04-05-2001 19:03									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I agree with Dave. I rarely have more than an hour at a time to play civ. I play CTP and SMAC PBEM games and I hope Civ3 will have a working PBEM option. You can play PBEM if you have 30 or so minutes per day (much less in the earlier turns, but later in the game you will need more time).

	04-05-2001 19:19									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I've seen reference to PBEM before but have no idea what it stands for or how it works.

	04-05-2001 19:31									#7
	Remove this text

Me either.

Believe me, I recognize about time, and what that can lead to.
Just was curious.

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It's In The Way That You Use It
Tuatha De Danann Tribe

	04-05-2001 19:35									#8
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

EST: PBEM = Play By EMail. You play your turn, send the save file to the next guy, who plays his turn and sends the save to the next guy...

Civ 2 was not really designed for PBEM, but it can be done if you're willing to work around the bugs. Other big problems - everyone has to wait for the slowest player in the group; start is kind of a problem (PBEM games I'm involved in either used accelerated start or an online kickoff session to get past the early game when your entire turn consists of "press ENTER"). I'm hoping Civ III has a better (more even, at least) accelerated start and/or the capability of starting everyone with, say, five settlers.

Edit: an alternative, which several people have tried, is to use a scenario (like the Rome scenario, anyone ?).
[This message has been edited by DaveV (edited May 04, 2001).]

	04-05-2001 20:05									#9
	Inflate your Upload Space

Thanks, DaveV.

Sounds a bit like postal chess. I must try it some time, I think (and the times I've seen references people seemed to think it is good), but I harbour a doubt as to whether I have the patience.

	04-05-2001 20:26									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I only have SP. This PBEM sounds more convenient than trying to get everyone on line at the same time though.

EOL

	04-05-2001 20:57									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I only play SP, because I don't have MGE and I don't want to tie up the lines playing civ all day

	05-05-2001 09:40									#13
	Increase Your PM Length

PBEM games can certainly take a long time. That also depends on how many players you have in a game. Games with more players take longer. In games with less players you can sometimes get to a turn per day, but in games with the maximum number of players that hardly ever happens.

One of my CTP games (originally 8 players) is new almost finished after 240 turns in 18 months and there are even slower games. But I have also had 3-player SMAC games finished in about 3-4 months.

	05-05-2001 09:50									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I think I'm correct in stating that PBEM is another way to label "succession" games as they are know here.

To the question at hand... I have MGE but only play SP. I only have one phone line and MP would tie that up. Plus, I recently changed to a non-unlimited access rate for my internet connection. All things considered, however, someday I will play MP. The interaction with the AI is great but real people contact would be better.

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Frodo lives!

	05-05-2001 09:59									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Donkeys years ago we used to play Diplomacy by post. People diplomed away and then sent their moves to a guy who published them in a sort of magazine. That then triggered the next diplomatic round.

Folk got up to all sorts, even travelling to call on you and pretending to be one of the other players!

But the games never finished because too many would lose interest along the way or were just too disorganised.

	04-05-2001 22:45									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I play SP but own MGE. I got MGE to be able to play many great scenarios that require it. I simply don't have the time to play MP, altho it sounds very appealing to me. The occasional half hour before going to bed is usually the best I can do, hardly adequate for a game.

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"There is no fortress impregnable to an ass laden with gold."
-Philip of Macedon

	05-05-2001 00:04									#17
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I only play SP. I have MGE but that's because I bought it when CompUSA had a promo to buy the game for $20 and get a $20 rebate -- sure got my money's worth on that deal.

I avoid multi-player PC games for two reasons. (1) Like others who responded, I would have trouble getting a totally free block of time at home. Even when I play Age of Kings, my index finger is always poised over the PAUSE key, awaiting the inevitable "Honey, can you open this jar for me?" (I do what I can to avoid the equally inevitable "You care about your game more than you care about me.") (2) I fear that if I were to become involved in MP, my competitiveness might get the better of me and lead me to get even more obsessed about the game than I already am.

	05-05-2001 00:07									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

PBEM is not the same as Succession - although they have much in common...

In PBEM each player controls their own empire and it is a v slow variant of MP, in a succession game each player takes their turn in controlling the one empire - a v slow SP game.

I SP - possess MP - would like to MP, but am concerned about time!!! MWHC too and we have to keep our masters happy don't we...

Hey DaveV, I'm up for a PBEM Rome Scenario - as long as you promise not to conquer the universe in 43 years - bet we could interest LaFayette and I shall see if I can get SG2 interested this evening ...

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Scouse Git[1] -- git1@scousers.net

"Staring at your screen in horror and disbelief when you open a saved game is one of the fun things of a succession game " - Hueij
"The Great Library has been built!"
"A short cut has to be challenging,
were it not so it would be 'the way'." - Paul Craven

	05-05-2001 01:13									#19
	Suffering from ads?

I SP. Have considered but not bought MGE because I have a wife and she thinks we have a life. So yes, Slowhand, it is time. Also, I get the impression that to the MPers, Civ is a wargame, who can conquer all the rest first. While I can play that way, the game seems to me to be so much more than that. about building, managing, and succeeding as a civilization -- a culture -- in a multi-cultural world. The wargame part might be as well (dare I say better) fulfilled in a session of AOE II.

	05-05-2001 02:19									#20
	Tired of ads?

I play SP and probably wont play MP. I've had my fill of "other people" within MMORPG games . Competiveness is ugly

	05-05-2001 02:28									#21
	Put an end to popups!

SG1DaveV - I have SG2's arm twisted up his back and he says he would be delighted to try the Rome Scenario by PBEM ...
SG2[Edit] Why not Red Front?
SG1Lord!! the man is a sadist!!!!
_______________
The SGs in red wine and dialogue mode

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Scouse Git[1] -- git1@scousers.net

"Staring at your screen in horror and disbelief when you open a saved game is one of the fun things of a succession game " - Hueij
"The Great Library has been built!"
"A short cut has to be challenging,
were it not so it would be 'the way'." - Paul Craven

	05-05-2001 02:46									#22
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

It may not we the answer for you SP people, but I got given time to play, without being griped at, if I limited to 2 nights a week.
From there it became, "just leave me the weekend nights".
Yes!

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It's In The Way That You Use It
Tuatha De Danann Tribe

	05-05-2001 12:36									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I exclusively multi-play. SP is so easy its boring.

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Founder, Dear Leader and Great Helmsman of PROT -the People's Republic Off Topic www.delphi.com/prot1

	06-05-2001 17:56									#25
	Increase Your PM Length

Oh good. I thought all MP people had been taken by a UFO.
I hate SP. Bor-ing.

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It's In The Way That You Use It
Tuatha De Danann Tribe

	07-05-2001 18:55									#26
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Put me on the same list as Ah and War Sloww. My days of playing the retarded at best computer are over. There's no glory in beating a helpless AI.

Like Ozzy said in another thread, SP is like masturbation and MP is like sex.........

	07-05-2001 22:14									#27
	Inflate your Upload Space

kcbob - you can find several active PBEM games on the Multiplayer forum:
http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum2/HTML/002177.html?46 http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum2/HTML/001922.html?63 http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum2/HTML/002145.html?6 http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum2/HTML/001871.html?12

	07-05-2001 22:35									#28
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Saying "SP is like masturbation" is an insult to masturbation. One can provide limited amusement and the other can't.


MP only.

The only SP games that I've played in the last three years were amusing challanges, like the nomad challange.

RAH
[This message has been edited by rah (edited May 07, 2001).]

	07-05-2001 22:41									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

You're right Rah...........lets find a more appropriate comparison.......

How about TBall and Professional baseball

	07-05-2001 23:26									#30
	Remove this text

DaveV,

Thanks. Those are interesting. But was I on track with my supposition about starting a new game as a 'Hotseat' game?

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Frodo lives!