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n.c. is offline n.c.
Emperor
North Carolina, best state in the union
Jul 1999
time: 00:16
  Old Post 11-11-2001 21:46
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The irony of whining about &quot;whiners&quot; &amp; what it reveals Suffering from ads?

At first I was frustrated about the insults and being told to shut up. But when I realized the amusingly ironic nature of the whiners, I decided to have fun with them.

Now I have a theory of why they are so upset. The stated reasons don't hold water (too many threads or Victor's hilarous "bandwidth" comment). Let me explain what is probably the real reason.

When I hear a negative movie review before seeing the movie it often shapes the experience; problems I would not have noticed stand out. The Firaxis fundies must be having a similar experience: when they come to these threads their eyes are opened to the game's many failings.

The problem is that they have a lot invested in Civ III being the ultimate experience. Our bubble-bursting is painful, since they now are aware of flaws they did not see before. Perhaps another analogy is the child learning about Santa Claus.

Now I am fully aware that there are many informed, intelligent mature people who love the game. I am very happy for them. This thread is about another group- the people who are inexplicably angry at those of us who make critiques. Inexplicable, that is, until perhaps now.

d_dudy is offline d_dudy
Prince
MO
May 2001
time: 23:16
  Old Post 11-11-2001 21:56
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this is a good point, imho

squid is offline squid
Warlord

Aug 2001
time: 05:16
Post  Old Post 11-11-2001 22:10
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I don't mind people who find bugs and submit them to Firaxis and post them here. I like that.

I dislike it when people stay around here (trolls!) and complain all the time, insisting that everyone who likes the game and does not see it as seriously flawed is somehow stupid or thereby bribed by Firaxians.

That being said, I really do like Civ3, and the bugs will be corrected. I do not see any major gameplay or process flaws, and if people don't like these aspects -- well -- what are they going to do about it? This may not be the game for them. However, the insistance that everyone must be unhappy is equally absurd as saying everyone must likewise be happy.

Anyhow, I will leave you with Murphy's law of software development lifecycles: there will always have to be a patch.

Relax.

GodSpawn is offline GodSpawn
Prince
Scotland
Oct 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 01:54
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That's not half as ironic as whining about people whining about whiners...

Green Giant is offline Green Giant
Warlord

Sep 2001
time: 23:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:01
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quote:
Originally posted by GodSpawn
That's not half as ironic as whining about people whining about whiners...


LMAO Oh so funny, yet oh so true.

n.c. is offline n.c.
Emperor
North Carolina, best state in the union
Jul 1999
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:15
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quote:
Originally posted by GodSpawn
That's not half as ironic as whining about people whining about whiners...
That would be- have you found any examples?

GodSpawn is offline GodSpawn
Prince
Scotland
Oct 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:16
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Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Well...

n.c. is offline n.c.
Emperor
North Carolina, best state in the union
Jul 1999
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:18
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Perhaps I need to explain my point agin . . . .

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

Immortal
I owe..I owe..it's off to work I go
Jul 2000
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:18
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Re: The irony of whining about &quot;whiners&quot; &amp; what it reveals Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by n.c.
At first I was frustrated about the insults and being told to shut up. But when I realized the amusingly ironic nature of the whiners, I decided to have fun with them.

Now I have a theory of why they are so upset. The stated reasons don't hold water (too many threads or Victor's hilarous "bandwidth" comment). Let me explain what is probably the real reason.

When I hear a negative movie review before seeing the movie it often shapes the experience; problems I would not have noticed stand out. The Firaxis fundies must be having a similar experience: when they come to these threads their eyes are opened to the game's many failings.

The problem is that they have a lot invested in Civ III being the ultimate experience. Our bubble-bursting is painful, since they now are aware of flaws they did not see before. Perhaps another analogy is the child learning about Santa Claus.

Now I am fully aware that there are many informed, intelligent mature people who love the game. I am very happy for them. This thread is about another group- the people who are inexplicably angry at those of us who make critiques. Inexplicable, that is, until perhaps now.



What about Santa Claus

I am in Total agreement with you NC, not just because I am over in Onslow County.. but because in business, you H-A-V-E 2 H-A-V-E Thick skin, and part of growth is pain, plain truth pain!

CIV III is a great game, but still room for improvements,

As for whiners, often people "Express" in a way that vents to the extent of whining, much like the new Toby Keith song, SOMETIMES..I wanna talk about me..funny how people want to view their own viewpoints as pertinent or important, believe in them staunchly, but when someone come sthrough OVERBEARINGLY, they become chastised, thus the CHASTISEEE now becomes a whiner himself...



Ya'll have a great day!!

Yours in Civin

Troll

Libertarian is offline Libertarian
King

Nov 2001
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:19
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Got spare money?

You nailed it, squid. We all know there are some problems with the game. And we all know the difference between reporting a problem and holding your breath until you turn blue.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 02:46
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Whining about the whining of the whiners perhaps reveals that that some people just can't come to the realization that some people actually love the game.

Admiral PJ is offline Admiral PJ
Prince
Southeast England , UK
Dec 2000
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:07
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Get a bigger avatar today!

I love whiners.. actually no i don't, no one likes whiners so just stop it !

DaddyCool is offline DaddyCool
Chieftain
Ontario, Canada
Oct 2000
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:08
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How about whining about whiners who whine about whiners of whiners of the game? This is...umm...starting to get philosophical, or stupid....one of the two anyway.

Pembleton is offline Pembleton
Prince
Cyberspace
Apr 1999
time: 23:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:09
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Tired of ads?

quote:
Originally posted by Admiral PJ
I love whiners.. actually no i don't, no one likes whiners so just stop it !


Stop whining!

Zylka is offline Zylka
Prince
sure
May 2000
time: 05:16
Cool  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:09
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Perhaps Imran should learn to post something more insightfull and original than that trite snoozing emotican and a one line quip.

We're not whining here, I'd describe it more along the lines of patronizing, pointing and laughing, making idiots of others, etc. etc. We're not asking anyone to shut up and leave. We're voicing our complaints, which are relevant, truthfull, and quite obviously hurtfull. I love the analogy of Santa Claus, my man

Oh hey, Imran. Do I need one of these?

Zylka is offline Zylka
Prince
sure
May 2000
time: 05:16
Angry  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:11
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Tired of ads?

P.S. Anyone who complains about civ3 just bores me so much



Cuz I like dem game and haff no time to hhear criticism GO AWAY WE WERE HEA R FIRST dar dar.

n.c. is offline n.c.
Emperor
North Carolina, best state in the union
Jul 1999
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Troll
I am in Total agreement with you NC
Why thank you!

quote:
Originally posted by Zylka
I love the analogy of Santa Claus, my man
I'm happy to oblige!

quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
some people just can't come to the realization that some people actually love the game.
I wonder who those people are. As I said in my last paragraph (which I'm sure you read) I am happy for those who are satisfied with this effort. Heck, I really wish I was as well. Far more fun that way.

GodSpawn is offline GodSpawn
Prince
Scotland
Oct 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:33
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[Stack overflow]

zapperio is offline zapperio
Warlord
Halifax, NS
Nov 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:39
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I don't think the emperor from nc is wearing any clothes. But then, I'm young.

Zap

splangy is offline splangy
Prince
of my own little kingdom...
Jun 2001
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:50
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Remove this text

I like civ3. Many others do. Many dont. Just like religions we are gona clash, acomplish nothing, clash even harder, acomplish nothing-loop. Its gona happen and threads like this are proof of that...

n.c. is offline n.c.
Emperor
North Carolina, best state in the union
Jul 1999
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 03:51
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zapperio- Anything substantive to add to that attempt at cuteness?

zapperio is offline zapperio
Warlord
Halifax, NS
Nov 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 04:06
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Nah.
Attempting to be cute has always been enough for me.
Wish you could say the same.

Zap

TCO is offline TCO
Emperor
Richmond, VA
Jan 1970
time: 00:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 07:37
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Imran,

stop whining about N.C's whining about whining about whiners.


(And I claim "infinity +1" levels about whining about whining...so don't try to top me...)

LaRusso is offline LaRusso
King
appendix of Europe
May 2001
time: 06:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 12:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Whining about the whining of the whiners perhaps reveals that that some people just can't come to the realization that some people actually love the game.


n.c. = troll

CyberShy is offline CyberShy

Emperor
Delft, The Netherlands
Mar 1999
time: 06:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 13:32
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It's not that I can't stand critics that are right.
It's more that people are complaining about game features that rock.

I have so much fun with the resource concept.
It really rocks the game if you understand it, and if you're a good diplomat with the AI. Then it REALLY sucks when you find many threads overhere with people 'demanding' Firaxis to change the resource concept.

Same with culture and combat.
Complain about the interception and the coastal fortress stuff.
Those are bugs ! Complain about the animated enemy moves you can only skip by pressing 'shift' all the time. (civ3-hand after 1 year)

complain about missing mp and scenario tools (I think it 's a pitty, but has nothing to do with the game itself)
But leave the great new concepts alone !
They rock !

CyberShy

Dev is offline Dev
Warlord

Nov 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 13:55
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quote:

I have so much fun with the resource concept.
It really rocks the game if you understand it, and if you're a good diplomat with the AI. Then it REALLY sucks when you find many threads overhere with people 'demanding' Firaxis to change the resource concept.


What makes YOUR cake doesn't necesarilly make mine if you know what I mean.

Most of the issues people complain about could have been avoided if Firaxis had made the game more customizable i.e. sliders for resources and corruption level etc.

Personally I hate corruption because it completely kills my _preferred_ playing style and I will whine about it untill F comes up with a solution if I so please.

/dev

LaRusso is offline LaRusso
King
appendix of Europe
May 2001
time: 06:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 13:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Dev
Personally I hate corruption because it completely kills my _preferred_ playing style


ICS?

Earthling7 is offline Earthling7
Prince
of pop
Jul 1999
time: 06:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 13:58 Visit Earthling7's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Dev
Personally I hate corruption because it completely kills my _preferred_ playing style and I will whine about it untill F comes up with a solution if I so please.


And what is your "preferred" playing style? Civ2? It's available in the shops, get it.

Resources and Culture are great additions to Civ. The problem I see is how rushed it was.

Dev is offline Dev
Warlord

Nov 2001
time: 05:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 14:04
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I don't want to do away with corruption but simply make it customizable so what's your ****ing beef ?

FIRAXIS PLEASE DONT CHANGE IT SO THAT EVERYONE CAN ENJOY THE GAME....

Buy a friggin clue.


/dev

CyberShy is offline CyberShy

Emperor
Delft, The Netherlands
Mar 1999
time: 06:16
  Old Post 12-11-2001 14:05
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

THAT's the point.
people already had ideas on how they will play civ3.

The resource system works great if you understand it.
Sometimes you need to start a war to get a resource, sometimes you wno't have all resources. Of courste that's a pain, but what do you want ? A game that's easy and just does what you want.

That's like playing Quake and requesting all enemies to tab you on the shoulder like "Hey, I'm behind you" so you have time to turn around and kill them

 
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