04-12-2001 03:50									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L From the Guardian.

The Guardian... like hell I would believe that liberal newspaper. More uncredible sources.

Ethopia only has a capacity of having up to 320,000 especially when their military budget for 2000 is only $168 Million according to the CIA Factbook.

	04-12-2001 03:51									#32
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http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/2000may...ia_eritrea.html

600,000 troops deployed

http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/2000may...a_ethiopia.html

ethiopians outnumber eritrians 20 to 1

http://eri24.com/Commentary_T16.htm

total number of troops in the millions.

	04-12-2001 03:54									#33
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Again I don't listen to overbloated statements made by the Guardian or any other liberal news paper.

And how the hell could ethiopia have a 1 million men army when it only has up to 600,000 are fit for service?

	04-12-2001 03:55									#34
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From CIA:

Military manpower - military age: 18 years of age
Military manpower - availability: males age 15-49: 14,537,884 (2001 est.)
Military manpower - fit for military service: males age 15-49: 7,581,815 (2001 est.)
Military manpower - reaching military age annually: males: 703,625 (2001 est.)
Military expenditures - dollar figure: $138 million (FY98/99)

Note that the expenditures are figures from years ago. Also, it doesn't cost much to call up some civilians afghanistan-style. I won't be surprised if most young men have been called up in Ethiopia to fight.

	04-12-2001 03:56									#35
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quote: And how the hell could ethiopia have a 1 million men army when it only has up to 600,000 are fit for service?

The CIA says it has 7 million fir for service

	04-12-2001 04:00									#36
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Just curious, why would the west knowingly give $3b to a part in an obscure war in Africa?

	04-12-2001 04:05									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L The CIA says it has 7 million fir for service

I meant men reaching military age... only 700,000. So how could 6 million be possible. 7 million cannot be deployed because it is not fiscally possible, because $3 billion is not even close to enough to arm an army of 400,000.

	04-12-2001 04:13									#38
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Wouldn't be the first time the west would do something like that. Though I believe that money is from foreign aid, since the countries are so damn poor. Of course, they buy weapons and not food.

quote: I meant men reaching military age... only 700,000.

That's still 100,000 more than you claimed. PLus, what does this have to do with the total size? Or are you suggesting Ethiopia gets more than 700,000 soldiers killed every year and have to be replaced?

quote: So how could 6 million be possible. 7 million cannot be deployed because it is not fiscally possible, because $3 billion is not even close to enough to arm an army of 400,000.

$3,000,000,000
400,000 troops
$7500 per soldier
Average yearly wage, per capita: $600
Total money left for weapons: $6900

More than enough to buy some crap cheap russian-made rifle.

	04-12-2001 04:15									#39
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You still have no credible evidence to prove any of this.

	04-12-2001 04:16									#40
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Plus the money recieved illegally and through looting. More than enough.

BTW, where are your sources? I think giani's posts here are of the same level as his claims that the usa supported franco in the spanish civil war, that cloning hitler would be dangerous somehow, and that giani isn't gay.

	04-12-2001 04:18									#41
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quote: You still have no credible evidence to prove any of this.

I posted several independant sources. You posted none.

	04-12-2001 04:25									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L Wouldn't be the first time the west would do something like that.

But WHY?

	04-12-2001 04:29									#43
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Because there is a famine. People are dying. People are hungry. People are poor. West feels sympatetic. West sends money. Leaders there buy weapons. Leaders there don't buy food for the people.

Classic story.

	04-12-2001 04:31									#44
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Giani's claims:

1. Ethiopia's army is "probably" 100,000 big
2. Ethiopian army is twice as big as Eritrea's
3. Ethiopia's army is smaller than 320,000
4. Ethiopia has 600,000 men fit for service
5. 3 billion USD isn't enough to arm 400,000 troops

No sources at all. Other sources give completely different figures:

1. Ethiopia's army is between the 600,000 and 6,000,000
2. Ethiopia's army is 20 times as big as Eritrea's (which would make sense, since the country is about 20 times as big)
3. Ethiopia's army is between the 600,000 and 6,000,000
4. Ethiopia has 7,581,815 men fit for service

And simple maths shows:

5. 3 billion USD is more than enough to arm 400,000 troops.

	04-12-2001 06:21									#45
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Gianni you need to chill out.

Ethiopia has one of the best airforces in the world.

When I said WW3 I mean WW3. Its simple logic...if we are taking all these actions.....something is gonna give. The assyrians and iranians might as well join in the frey aswell......or they themselves will be next!

We will see......but remind me to bump this thread when Syrian and Iraqi tanks roll into Turkey

	04-12-2001 07:02									#46
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The World Alamanac, 2001 says that Ethiopia has 120,000 active troops. If they had 3.5 million that would be something like 5% of their population and would mean that the military budget was about 5 dollars per soldier. I suppose they could have a lot of irregular fighters, but they'd probably be part time and probably shouldn't be considered soldiers for these purposes unless you count every armed man in Egypt as well and all reservists . . .

	04-12-2001 07:10									#47
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Natan:


Ethiopia has SU-27's and SU-34's. They have some of the best pilots and aircraft in africa.

The effectiveness of there ground forces are debatable. 150,000 troops.....500 tanks. If I had to guess these tanks are old T-55's and T-62's. But its possible theres new stuff thrown into the equasion.

During the war with Eritrea the country did spend almost everything on military equipment... So the encarta/FAS facts are without of doubt: Out of date. Ethiopia armed itself to the teeth during the war..

	04-12-2001 07:16									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L Wouldn't be the first time the west would do something like that. Though I believe that money is from foreign aid, since the countries are so damn poor. Of course, they buy weapons and not food.

Most of Ethiopias FA comes from Israel and Denmark. (I think)

quote: 1600 tanks

This figure is incorrect. Tons of Ethiopian tanks were lost to Eritrean guerilla's and later during the Somali/Eritrean Border wars.

	04-12-2001 15:55									#49
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Oh I provided sources, but this jackass markl didn't even bother:

http://mylima.com/airforce
and the Library of Congress

First off, he has provided me nothing but liberal newspapers that bullshit all the time.

Faded, Ethiopia's airforce sucks. Egypt has the best airforce with 200 F-16s, and other nice stuff.

	04-12-2001 18:08									#50
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quote: The World Alamanac, 2001 says that Ethiopia has 120,000 active troops. If they had 3.5 million that would be something like 5% of their population and would mean that the military budget was about 5 dollars per soldier. I suppose they could have a lot of irregular fighters, but they'd probably be part time and probably shouldn't be considered soldiers for these purposes unless you count every armed man in Egypt as well and all reservists . . .

Please remember that Ethiopia has fought a war not very long ago. When a third world country is at war, every man (or boy) who can carry a gun is considered a soldier and is sent to the front. Hell, the total number of killed soldiers of the whole ethiopian-eritrean war is more than 120,000.

And of course 99% of those troops are poorly armed, poorly trained, and poorly paid. But it's a third world country after all.

quote: During the war with Eritrea the country did spend almost everything on military equipment... So the encarta/FAS facts are without of doubt: Out of date. Ethiopia armed itself to the teeth during the war..

My thoughts exactly.

quote: http://mylima.com/airforce

Why would I need a link about airforces when I'm talking about manpower?

quote: and the Library of Congress

Link? Hard for me to check from the other side of the pond huh?

And where are links of the total manpower of ethiopia? No links at all. Nothing surprising of course, since they don't exist

And then kiddo giani comes with the standard "that's a commie/liberal/whatever source and I won't accept it".

	04-12-2001 18:13									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L And of course 99% of those troops are poorly armed, poorly trained, and poorly paid. But it's a third world country after all.

If six million did deploy, five million of those would have to be armed with homemade weapons. Most of which probably will be armed with homemade pistols.

quote: Why would I need a link about airforces when I'm talking about manpower?

It was for others.

quote: Link? Hard for me to check from the other side of the pond huh?

Go to yahoo and do a search on "Country studies", the first link should be it.

quote: And where are links of the total manpower of ethiopia? No links at all. Nothing surprising of course, since they don't exist

**** you, do a ****ing search in yahoo on country studies. You will notice not even the Mengistu regime could maintain an army over 320,000. That number then collapsed to 140,000 by 1999.

quote: And then kiddo giani comes with the standard "that's a commie/liberal/whatever source and I won't accept it".

Because the Guardian is some shitty media source, that is runned by people who know nothing about military.

	04-12-2001 18:16									#52
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quote: http://mylima.com/airforce

Those are stats from 1998/99...almost 3 years old.

	04-12-2001 18:21									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L Those are stats from 1998/99...almost 3 years old.

I am not going blind... it says 1999/2000... dumbass.

	04-12-2001 18:40									#54
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quote: If six million did deploy, five million of those would have to be armed with homemade weapons. Most of which probably will be armed with homemade pistols.

Obviously. Point is? I never said Ethiopia's army is well armed, I said it was the biggest in Africa. And it is.

quote: Because the Guardian is some shitty media source, that is runned by people who know nothing about military.

And you do?

Also, what on earth do you know about the Guardian?

	04-12-2001 18:44									#55
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L Obviously. Point is? I never said Ethiopia's army is well armed, I said it was the biggest in Africa. And it is.

It is not. Not the largest standing peacetime army. I stand by my correctness.

quote: And you do? Also, what on earth do you know about the Guardian?

Yes I do because I use the following sources:

http://www.army-technology.com
http://www.airforce-technology.com
http://www.naval-technology.com
http://www.fas.org
http://alphalink.com.au/~bjordan
http://www.hazegray.org
http://www.warships1.com

Next time you make assumptions look about anything having to do with military equipiment look at these sites because you know nothing about it.

	04-12-2001 18:56									#56
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http://www.geocities.com/~dagmawi/News_Background.html

This source reports that Ethiopia had an army of 320,000 active troops in 1999, which is two years ago.

quote: It is not. Not the largest standing peacetime army. I stand by my correctness.

Ethiopia isn't exactly at peace. Still a lot of tension in the area.

quote: http://www.army-technology.com http://www.airforce-technology.com http://www.naval-technology.com http://www.fas.org http://alphalink.com.au/~bjordan http://www.hazegray.org http://www.warships1.com

hahaha. I use those sites all the time! Point is, they don't give numbers on the number of troops each country has! It's only equipment, and some have stats on airforces and navies, but they don't show how many troops there are in the country.

	04-12-2001 19:03									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L http://www.geocities.com/~dagmawi/News_Background.html This source reports that Ethiopia had an army of 320,000 active troops in 1999, which is two years ago.

320,000 is the maximum. 6 million isn't. 6 million could, technically but it would cause massive economic collapse.

quote: Ethiopia isn't exactly at peace. Still a lot of tension in the area.

I know but its regular army, not possible conscripts, is not the largest. Actually, the Nigerian Army could be the largest... if it was at war... by far, if it called up all of its men to duty. No country does that because it could cause collapse though. You don't see China calling up 140 million men for duty, unless it is at war and it would impossible to arm them all.

quote: hahaha. I use those sites all the time! Point is, they don't give numbers on the number of troops each country has! It's only equipment, and some have stats on airforces and navies, but they don't show how many troops there are in the country.

I was making the point whenever you make assumptions on military equipiment you should look at those sites. You obviously know nothing about military equipiment.

	04-12-2001 19:13									#58
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quote: You obviously know nothing about military equipiment.

Funny since I didn't say anything about military equipment in this thread

You're so funny kiddo! Keep it up

	04-12-2001 19:16									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Mark L Funny since I didn't say anything about military equipment in this thread You're so funny kiddo! Keep it up

Yes you did, you often referred to it. You said how many old tanks the Ethiopians had. Yet, you don't realize it costs a hell of a lot to maintain them and find spares.

	04-12-2001 19:21									#60
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quote: you often referred to it

quote: You said how many old tanks the Ethiopians had.

And what does that have to do with the sites you posted? Sure there is information on those tanks there, but not how many there are in ethiopia.

quote: u don't realize it costs a hell of a lot to maintain them and find spares.

And where on those sites of yours can you find the maintainance cost of old soviet style tanks?