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Do you agree with the EU educational policies? (Time out:0 days after 10-12-2001, 22:56)
I live in the EU and I agree.
I live in the EU and I disagree.
I live elsewhere but I agree.
I live elsewhere but I disagree.
I don't care 'bout no ee-dy-catian in Yurop! Duh!
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axi is offline axi
Prince
Athens Greece
Sep 1999
time: 07:16
  Old Post 10-12-2001 22:49
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Call for an EU-wide pupil- and studentstrike Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

This is the text written by the students of Dortmund, who are calling to an EU wide educational strike, during the EU summit in Brussels, against the common educational policies of the EU.

We are planning to participate in this strike and general student assemblies are held in most university faculties of the country, so that the Greek students may participate in this strike. Some of us are planning to travel to Brussels to protest.

quote:
call for an EU-wide pupil- and studentstrike

Study-fees, cuts in budget, privatisation of schools and universities... Education´s aims are rapidly changing, are more and more going to serve private, economic interests. All around Europe students are facing similar problems. The reasons can be found in EU-policy. For this reason students from Dortmund (Germany) are calling for an EU-wide pupil- and studentstrike from December 10th to December 14th 2001. During the first days of this strike actions in European cities, universities and schools are due to take place. A huge common march at the end of the EU summit in Brussels(Belgium) is scheduled for December 14th.


National education policy is a fiction


Since we suppose that around the EU students are facing the same problems, we are calling for an EU-wide strike. In Germany study-fees for so called long-term students have been allowed, general study-fees are being discussed, universities are turned vom state-run institutes into autonomous private foundations. In Austria study-fees have been introduced this summer. In Holland the education minister has announced that Netherlands` universities are due to be increasingly commercialised...There must be numerous examples all around Europe. By icident? No! Students in each country must think their national educational politics are unique and customized to the respective national situation. But a quick look around Europe reveals: National politics are neither unique nor customized to the local situation but are instigated by a systematic EU-wide policy. In fact the way national educational policy within EU-states takes is entirely predetermined by already negotiated treaties - especially the GATS-treaty. So, who wonders about similar problems in different European states. For educational policy is yet decided about on international grounds, we think it is about time for European pupils and students to protest and speak out internationally.


Just one example: German universities are prepared for privatisation


Germany´s "No" to study-fees, a long-time guarantee for Gemany´s comparably high degree of equality of chances, is no longer untouchable. As a result the indirect universitiy-educations´s rise in price through increasing re-enrolment-fees and insufficient student-grants is mirrored in a current study about students´social situation published by "Deutsches Studentenwerk": Enrolment-figures are falling especially with children from poorer families ie. working-class families whose students are often forced to work for money during their studies and therefore are entitled to become so-called long-term-students. It is easy to recognize: Student-fees of what kind ever will only aggravate this situation. As a consequence Gemany´s in international comparison low number of university men and women will never be increased. While a reform of student-grants has failed, the German ministry of education is spending more and more money on the research-sector.


Spending more money on research to empty Germany´s overcrowded lecture halls or why universities are economised to be ready for sponsorschip
Because of the German minister´s, sudden change in her attitude towards study-fees after long years of rejecting those one has to ask why. The reason is quite simple: For some time now education and university policy does no longer lie in the hands of German politics. There is no other explanation of such inconsitencies. And watching closely the national situation, one finds the key to ministerial electorial lies in Brussels, in the hands of the European Union und furthermore in the hands of the WTO (World Trade Organisation). By means of the international trade agreement GATS (General Agreement of Trade in Services) started in 1994 the WTO has begun to lay the educational sector in the hands of civil economy.
By means of GATS state services like educational services and healthcare are declared a tradable commodity. Under the auspicies of the WTO, beyond democratic control of national parliaments, GATS is designed to give companies the opportunity to take over the biggest part of state services like public transportation, tourism, healthcare, telecommunication, water supplies etc. not only on national but international grounds.
European states have acceeded GATS under the umbrella of the European Union, punishing member states in case of inadequate openening of their markets - here the services sector - to foreign companies. Sooner or later any sector - if not monopolistically state-controlled - has to be opened like the German educational sector where a number of private institutions is yet established. By means of the GATS discipline of equal treatment foreign companies are enabled to sue their way into the public sector of nations. At this moment the liberalisation of educational and healthcare sectors are discussed under the umbrella of GATS. Simultaneously Germany is yet paving the way for foreign companies to enter the educatinal sector. Not only by approaching study-fees German universties are prepared for market competition. By turning state owned universities into foundations German universities are enabled to collect more sponsorships and act company-like themselves. It is not by chance that since the middle of this year a private university, the University of Witten/Herdecke, experienced in collecting sponsorships and making profits, is represented in the German Conference of University Rectors (Hochschulrektorenkonferenz) for the first time. By means of a decree of the ministry of education state universities are urged to sell patents more profitable now. A new law about universities` autonomy giving universities greater freedom in selecting students and creating curricula - probably according to economic needs - is brought on the way. Of course study-fees for everybody are highly likely in private foundations. The opening of markets according to GATS is nothing less than privatisation yet negotiated and only to be realised on national basis. A return of a privatised educational sector into state hands is actually impossible according to GATS.
In expectation of a strong competition for sponsorships and profitable coalitions with private companies the ministerial strategy of increased spendings on research while spending on education is reduced for sponsorship becoming more acceptable makes sense in order to increase the attractivity of German universities.


Human resources - how human beings are becoming natural resources


For quite a time now in international treaties as well as in the EU pupil and students are referred to as human resources. A revealing term: since today´s education´s main aim is to produce human resources for companies. Private capital trying to impose its aims and priorities on education according to market priciples is no surprise. Education is turned into a market sector. Politicians are deliberately accepting a market orchestrating educational aims and organisation. Even the in its biggest parts still state-run German educational sector is more and more turned into a supplier of made-to-measure human resources. Unneccessary burdon like general education and social skills are consequently removed from the curriculum.
Education is turned into a "place" where war-rules are applied. Destinction between winners and loosers is made between owners of more and more expensive education and widely uneducated human resources. Despite of many educators` efforts selection of the best is becoming more and more important. Development of the individual and his skills is restrained. The establishing of elité-institutes and the year long disapproved of special education of highly talented pupils have become fashionable again. According to neo-liberalism´s monotonously repeated justification, knowlegde has become the most important resource of the so called "New Economy", where companies and no loger schools are the place where development of the individual takes place, where economy and no loger a collective consensus about what is desirable skills is deciding about organisation, production, upvalue and spreading of "knowledge that counts". Education is more and more submitting under technology. More and more education is being instrumentalised to enhance enterpreneurship and economical use in research and education.


Stop EU´s education-policy!


If the Europeans want to avoid the aforementioned development "they certainly must not follow the guidelines fixed by the 15 European heads of states at the extraordinary conference of European ministers in Lisbon in March 2000, later specified by means of an action-plan created by the European ministers in Feira in June 2000", warns Riccardo Petrella, advisor of the European commission and professor at the Université Catholique in Leuven (Belgium). Further he explains, that according to this guidelines Europe´s main effort was to build up "e-Europe" in order to turn Europe into the worlds most potent "e-economy" by 2015. The main aim of educational policy was to give all Europeans at the age of pre- and primary school access to digital education " in order to allow production of competitive human resources - especially competitive in regard of Northamerica´s human resources, who are supposed to be 10 years ahead", Petrella reports.


Neo-liberalism - a solution or the chosen few


These guidelines of neo-liberalism are postulated as the way to full employment and social justice. What a mistake. Drastically the U.S. example reveals, where this way will lead to: In spite of an ecomomic boom in the 90´s, in spite of low unemployment rates, in spite of the worlds most developed information and communication technologies, in spite of first-class universities the average level of education is miserable. In the following society is falling apart in productive and unproductive "human resources". A neo-liberal caste system with no escape for the uneducated new proletariat is developing. Since the caste of the educated just needs restricted human resources access to this class has to be elité. "Modern" foreigner-policy shows where this way is leading to: Green-cards for the caste of the educated, deportation for useless human resources.


International actions are more useful


Until now students only have operated on national grounds. Since national influence on education policy is declining it is neccassary to act internationally against the "dictatorship of international trade-treaties". Action is neccessary right now, since the WTO has just started another round of GATS-talks after the failure of the Seattle negotiations. Healthcare and education are on the agenda this time. Since the European Union officially advised by an international lobbygroup of service providers is taking part in GATS-talks it is absolutely neccessary for European students to fight in joint operations against this liberalisation of uncontrollable outcome while all around Europe the preparing mechanisms of the opening of markets are already at work.


European students willing to strike?


While in austria this semester study fees are paid for the first time and Germany is developing in the same direction, privatisation of education in Great Britain is actually yet finished. Therefore the idea of an EU-wide pupil and student strike is well accepted. Presumably GRAS (Grüne und Alternative StudentInnen), inhabiting presidency of the austrian students, and AKS (Aktion kritischer SchülerInnen) will take part in the strike. In spite of holiday time positive reactions from Germany have yet arrived. It makes less and less sense to act exclusivly on national basis, since the most important decisions are made in Brussels by the EU. At the moment we are trying to get in contact with all European student organisations. Multilingual discussion and coordination will take place by way of our mailinglist.


Are you aware of the collective changes the EU has brought to the educational systems of it's memebr countries?

Do you agree or dissagree with the EU policies? (Vote!)

Are you a student or pupil in an EU-member country? If yes, do you feel affected by these changes? Whatare you doing about it?

Discuss...

edit: Here's where to find them...

Contact: eustudenten@gmx.net

Mailinglists:

English:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/inter...-studentactions

German:
http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/in...udentenaktionen

Dutch:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/int-s...studentenakties

Website:
http://www.studi-protest.de.vu or
http://int-protest-action.tripod.com

Attachment: euwidestrikelogo.gif
This has been downloaded 164 time(s).

Last edited by axi on 10-12-2001 at 23:00

Paul Hanson is offline Paul Hanson
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Aug 1999
time: 05:16
  Old Post 10-12-2001 23:20
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Although they raise some valid points, they really have chosen the worst time (for UK students at least) to go on strike. I have a lot of college work (including vital coursework) that has to be finished before Christmas, and frankly I need the help of my teachers to do it to a high enough standard. If I were to go missing college for a week, I would miss out on a lot of that tuition and as a result, I would fare poorly in my A-levels. I should imagine that quite a few other people are in a similar situation to me.

If they had chosen to do this in February then I might have been more willing to listen to their reasons, but as it stands now it's not the best time.

Park Avenue is offline Park Avenue
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Oct 1999
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  Old Post 10-12-2001 23:26
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It's only fair that students pay their own way in education, either through loans from the bank, or parental contributions.

After all, it's the student who benefits from the education. Why should anyone else pay for it.

Education is a good just like your car or your house. You don't expect the taxpayer to pay for your car or your house, so why should you have your education paid for.

DanS is offline DanS
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I was in Munich a couple of years ago when the students had a strike. I couldn't help but think it was just an excuse to get piss drunk, skip school, and trash the commons.

Wernazuma III is offline Wernazuma III
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Aug 2000
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  Old Post 10-12-2001 23:46 Visit Wernazuma III's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
Education is a good just like your car or your house. You don't expect the taxpayer to pay for your car or your house, so why should you have your education paid for.


That's exactly the problem: education is like the car or the house, but it shouldn't be that way. After all, a society should be interested in having a strong basis of educated population, and even more important: it should be the most talented and not those already best well-off who get the best education. A social numerus clausus is not the way to get there.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
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Mar 2000
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  Old Post 10-12-2001 23:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
It's only fair that students pay their own way in education, either through loans from the bank, or parental contributions.

After all, it's the student who benefits from the education. Why should anyone else pay for it.

Education is a good just like your car or your house. You don't expect the taxpayer to pay for your car or your house, so why should you have your education paid for.


What a nonsense. Education is not a good, it's something that has brought mankind forward for thousands fo years. More education means more enlightened people etc. Since the Age of Reason education has been a value of societly as humanism is. I'm disappointed you want people with more money to be more educated than people with less money. Don't you see nonsense like that brings us back to the middle ages? Are you for a feudal system?

Park Avenue is offline Park Avenue
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 00:00
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quote:
What a nonsense. Education is not a good, it's something that has brought mankind forward for thousands fo years. More education means more enlightened people etc. Since the Age of Reason education has been a value of societly as humanism is. I'm disappointed you want people with more money to be more educated than people with less money. Don't you see nonsense like that brings us back to the middle ages? Are you for a feudal system?


I am for an equitable system. People aren't forced to pay for something that doesn't benefit them.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 00:08
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Care to elaborate? How do you want to find out whether education benefits someone or doesn't? Ah, I see, it only benefits those who can bring the right money... that's rather ignorant

Park Avenue is offline Park Avenue
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 00:16
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Suffering from ads?

What the heck are you talking about now?

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 00:23
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you troll Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

answer my question

*End Is Forever* is offline *End Is Forever*
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Infatuation,

As an economics student, perhaps you'd like to explain the concept of a merit good... and why such goods are underconsumed, and how you would ensure that, using education as an example, this market failure is redressed.

Provost Harrison is offline Provost Harrison
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The farce is strong with this one.
Feb 2000
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quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
It's only fair that students pay their own way in education, either through loans from the bank, or parental contributions.


Alright for a kid like you who's parents have considerable means, but not all have that capability. How the hell do you think I would have got to Oxford without government assistance and grants? Come down from your ivory tower and join the real world. Education should not be a province of the rich. If the talent is there, they should go to university, no exception depending on how rich their 'mummy and daddy is'.

quote:
After all, it's the student who benefits from the education. Why should anyone else pay for it.


Bull. I thought you were an economist. It is a means of increasing the attractiveness of your society to business by having a more skilled workforce. Think of all the investment it brings. It is a valuable investment in human capital. Don't oversimplify Stew, you should know better, and you and I have been here before, haven't we?

quote:
Education is a good just like your car or your house. You don't expect the taxpayer to pay for your car or your house, so why should you have your education paid for.


Nope, education is far more than that. A car or a house are just material possessions. A good education, a sturdy grounding and a keen intellect are far more valuable than any of those. Get real Stew, it is easy for you to say. It isn't just a matter of 'earning potential' but a matter of self esteem.

red_jon is offline red_jon
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Oct 2000
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 00:57 Visit red_jon's homepage!
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"What do you mean 'have I noticed Infat's swing to the extremely far right?'"


Women should stay in the home, the poor don't deserve education - has anyone noticed how this would all benefit HIM?

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
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quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
After all, it's the student who benefits from the education. Why should anyone else pay for it.



Er... no. Goverments, economies and science are what benefit most from educated citizens.

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 01:10
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Replied instead of edited.

Provost Harrison is offline Provost Harrison
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The farce is strong with this one.
Feb 2000
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Ignore Infant, he is just trolling as ever

Zopperoni is offline Zopperoni
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Dec 2000
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 01:22
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True, posting bullsh*t and then running away as always.

quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
It's only fair that students pay their own way in education, either through loans from the bank, or parental contributions.

After all, it's the student who benefits from the education. Why should anyone else pay for it.

Education is a good just like your car or your house. You don't expect the taxpayer to pay for your car or your house, so why should you have your education paid for.

Neither of my parents could go to university.
Why?
Because there was no money. (Only my mom's youngest brother could go to university.)

Now who benefits from such a situation in the end?
Right, absolutely nobody, while with scholarships both government and students benefit.

I am glad I can go to university. I get some money from the government, but it's not that much, but I can pay the greater part of my study from the money I earn working every Saturday.

DanS is offline DanS
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A good friend of mine is in debt $200,000 for his education. Probably the best money he's ever spent.

KrazyHorse is offline KrazyHorse
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS
A good friend of mine is in debt $200,000 for his education. Probably the best money he's ever spent.


That's a stupid amount of money to have to spend for an education.

DanS is offline DanS
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"That's a stupid amount of money to have to spend for an education."

Why? It's a pearl of great price. The most valuable asset he has in life.

Zopperoni is offline Zopperoni
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Dec 2000
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 01:44
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS
"That's a stupid amount of money to have to spend for an education."

Why? It's a pearl of great price. The most valuable asset he has in life.

But wouldn't it take forever for him to pay back his debt?

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
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quote:
Originally posted by Zopperoni
Neither of my parents could go to university.
Why?
Because there was no money. (Only my mom's youngest brother could go to university.)

Now who benefits from such a situation in the end?
Right, absolutely nobody, while with scholarships both government and students benefit.


You're wrong. Right-wingers do very well benefit from that. Rich people, middle class etc tend to be right wingers, and watching hoe poor people can't go to Uni confirms their thinking of being better... Only when seeing how only rich people like them can go to Uni makes them feel so special, confirms their way of thinking that only the amount of money you have makes you a good or bad person...

Of course it is all nonsense, and I'm surprised how a person like Spink can be against free access of education. :Q:

DanS is offline DanS
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"But wouldn't it take forever for him to pay back his debt?"

Sure. But once he pays off the debt, he'll still have an excellent education that he wanted and worked very hard toward.

And he'll know exactly what kind of resources went into providing for his education.

axi is offline axi
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Sep 1999
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Oh well... Remove this text

I kept a watch on this thread until Paul Hanson, Infatuation and DanS posted... and I felt like I fell from a different planet. 3 different people, 3 different views AGAINST what I am announcing here. It is interesting to have a brief look at them:

1. Paul Hanson: The subdued.
Kinda agrees, but, as he lives in an environment of intensive studies and high competition, cannot participate in any collective action that could harm his personal progress. In a world of worklessness, professional insecurity and fierce competition, he prefers to be a lonely traveller. If only we could do this strike on Febuary...

2. Infatuation: The indoctrinated.
Ideologically against the strike, he is at least more honest than the first specimen. Thatcherite, Reaganite, neo-liberal, conservative, fascist, or just a plain old troll, this type of guy just blatantly says to all European students, **** you, you're wrong, you are worth nothing, you should be crushed for the sake of marginal profits and the economic equilibrium. Well my friend, most people seem to think that education and knowledge, as a good, shares more common traits with the air we breathe, the water we drink, the love we get from our kin, rather than with the car we buy from our dealer. This means it should be free of charge, always in surplus, the more you get the better it is for all, when shared it augments, etc, etc...

3. DanS: The cynic.
Has seen some students on strike wasting their time. Believes that all that non-working students can do is waste their time. Well, since these people are wasting their time in the exact same way when they are on vacation, perhaps there should be no vacations at all. He cannot grasp the fact that if people want so desperately to have a vacation that they engage in this organised form of skipping school, then something's wrong with their daily routine, which is too intensified and leaves them no free time. This only is a valid cause for a strike and overworked people all over should do the same, since free time is the scarcest commodity of all, nowdays. And don't forget that a strike is supposed to be not only counter-productive, but so devastating to production (production of knowlegde in this case) that it can press the superiors to change their policies so that their "machine" starts working again. So the only fault with those kids mentioned is that they were not trying to convince more people to do the same as they did.

I have nothing personal with the guys, but it stroke me as 3 really characteristic attitudes, so I had to comment on them.

DanS is offline DanS
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 02:26 Visit DanS's homepage!
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Got spare money?

Cynic? Hardly.

Rather, since the community is paying for your education, the education system is answerable ultimately to the community as a whole, not you the students. Further, the students are answerable to the community, not the other way around. I think this strike should be broken and replacement students should be trucked in from Afghanistan.

If you're paying for your own education, you have every right to be vocal about the quality of education you believe you either are or are not getting. In that case, you can fire the administration for all I care.

Park Avenue is offline Park Avenue
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  Old Post 11-12-2001 03:01
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Tired of ads?

BOOHOO! I can't afford a personal jet...the government should buy me one!!



End is Forever,

quote:
As an economics student, perhaps you'd like to explain the concept of a merit good... and why such goods are underconsumed, and how you would ensure that, using education as an example, this market failure is redressed.


Good point. However, above a certain level (certainly before degree level) education ceases to become a merit good - think about it...if you entered the labour force as the only person with a degree standard education, your labour would be worth far more than now. As it is, tens of thousands get a degree and them getting a degree brings down your earnings by increasing the supply of people with a degree.

Rich,

quote:
Education should not be a province of the rich


Why not? It's a good/service just like a house or car is. Expensive cars are the province of the rich but I don't hear you railing against that and saying everyone should have a Jaguar.

quote:
the talent is there, they should go to university


Some might argue that it's only if the talent isn't there that the person should spend longer in education. Something to think about.

DanS,

quote:
A good friend of mine is in debt $200,000 for his education. Probably the best money he's ever spent.


This shows even if you don't have huge financial backing, you can still go to university.

What a bunch of whiners in this thread, demanding their government give them everything.

Paul Hanson is offline Paul Hanson
King
Dilbert
Aug 1999
time: 05:16
  Old Post 11-12-2001 03:05
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#27 Report this post to a moderator
Re: Oh well... Support Apolyton

quote:
Originally posted by axi
I1. Paul Hanson: The subdued.
Kinda agrees, but, as he lives in an environment of intensive studies and high competition, cannot participate in any collective action that could harm his personal progress. In a world of worklessness, professional insecurity and fierce competition, he prefers to be a lonely traveller. If only we could do this strike on Febuary...


I would hardly go that far, but I do believe that the students who participate in this strike will only harm their own chances in the long term; even if they are successful, they probably won`t be the ones who would benefit. If they are doing it for future generations, then to them; that would be very noble of them. But I have this feeling that they aren't.

Park Avenue is offline Park Avenue
Emperor
Liberal and defender of freedoms for the people
Oct 1999
time: 05:16
  Old Post 11-12-2001 03:08
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#28 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton

Paul Hanson's fact is right - these students protesting are greedy.

Paul Hanson is offline Paul Hanson
King
Dilbert
Aug 1999
time: 05:16
  Old Post 11-12-2001 03:14
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#29 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Just out of curiousity, are there any sort of figures avaliable as to how many people are taking part in this strike?

red_jon is offline red_jon
King
Uni of Wales Swansea
Oct 2000
time: 05:16
  Old Post 11-12-2001 03:19 Visit red_jon's homepage!
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#30 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote:
Originally posted by Infatuation
Good point. However, above a certain level (certainly before degree level) education ceases to become a merit good - think about it...if you entered the labour force as the only person with a degree standard education, your labour would be worth far more than now. As it is, tens of thousands get a degree and them getting a degree brings down your earnings by increasing the supply of people with a degree.


What about international competition?

quote:

Why not? It's a good/service just like a house or car is. Expensive cars are the province of the rich but I don't hear you railing against that and saying everyone should have a Jaguar.


God, you're actually making me sick - WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE'S LIVES AND THIER OPPORTUNITIES. Why the hell should you get them rather than someone else just because you have rich parents?

quote:

This shows even if you don't have huge financial backing, you can still go to university.

And end up in huge debt, which poorer people can't afford to pay off

quote:

What a bunch of whiners in this thread, demanding their government give them everything.


Rather than mater and pater? Snob.

 
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