03-02-2002 08:28									#1
	U.S. Ready for Pre-Emptive Strikes in Terror War Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: U.S. Ready for Pre-Emptive Strikes in Terror War By Anton Ferreira and Sayed Salahuddin Reuters WASHINGTON/KABUL, (Feb. 2) - The United States signaled Saturday it would take pre-emptive action in the next phase of its war on terror, ratcheting up the rhetoric that has set off alarm bells in Iraq and Iran. ''The best defense is a good offense,'' U.S. Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz told a security conference in Munich, elaborating on a theme set by President Bush this week when he called Iran, Iraq and North Korea the ''axis of evil''. ''Our approach has to aim at prevention and not merely punishment,'' said Wolfowitz, a hawk in the Bush administration. ''We are at war.'' Iraqi newspapers Saturday condemned ''the dwarf Bush'' as savage and aggressive and Iranian parliamentarians called him a threat to world peace and security. In Afghanistan, where the United States launched its war on terrorism after the Sept. 11 attacks on New York and Washington that killed about 3,100 people, fresh fighting erupted between factions scrambling for advantage in the vacuum left by the vanquished Taliban. About 40 men were killed in clashes in several parts of the northern Afghan province of Balkh, sources involved in the fighting said. The battles flared a day after a local Pashtun tribal council in the southeastern town of Gardez ousted the town's governor appointed by the interim government in Kabul.

	03-02-2002 08:33									#2
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I think that all those who invested in nuclear blast chambers during the cold war are thinking their spending was worthvile after 10 years when they tought it was all over...

	03-02-2002 08:36									#3
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Preventive targets? The Iranian Nuclear programme comes to mind. That has to go......


The buildings the silly Iraqi's rebuild over and over and over again at there chemical sites....some have been bombed 3-4 times. Yet for some ungodly reason, they get rebuilt.

	03-02-2002 08:43									#4
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I just hope that's all and that he will not start a true war with all of them.

	03-02-2002 08:47									#5
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We will. It must be done before these ****** get nuclear weapons and find ourselves 1 short of a city.

Then people will be asking themselves "Why didnt we stop them?"


So im afraid, its etched in stone. Not that I think we can lose, our military will route there armys with ease.

	03-02-2002 08:52									#6
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Weren't you the one pissing your pants with fear over a possible attack on Iraq, faded?

	03-02-2002 08:54									#7
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I'd rather see you taking their nuclear producing capabilities out somehow without getting into actuall war. I wouldn't be suprised if China came out against you. They are a communist dictatorship afterall.

	03-02-2002 08:54									#8
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not fear, but rather that the coalition would break up and it would be seen as more of a USA against Arabia. Now I see that it doesnt matter.....its a different playing field.


So I support this (see St. Marcus Axis thread for lightbulb moment)

	03-02-2002 18:20									#10
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That's called terrorism, you know. These 3 countries never threatened the United States. Yet you are continuously threatening them. If that's not terrorism, then what is?

Hypocrites!

	03-02-2002 18:30									#11
	Re: Preemptive strikes? Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by axi That's called terrorism, you know. These 3 countries never threatened the United States. Yet you are continuously threatening them. If that's not terrorism, then what is? Hypocrites!

In fact they are perfectly innocent nice little countries .

	03-02-2002 18:52									#12
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USA!

	03-02-2002 20:53									#13
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@ Thue

	03-02-2002 21:49									#14
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This was a mistake. They'd better not go after Iran or NK. Iran is/was heading moderate before we threatened to invade and bomb them, and NK will collapse within 10 years anyway.

	03-02-2002 22:25									#15
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Iran Supports Hezbollah, PFLP and Islamic Jihad.


The ****ers who bombed our barracks in 1983? And who were invoved in the Disco bombing in Germany?



Moderate? Ya right The show is run bye dinosaur cleric's. The president is a puppet....thats it. Moderates are jailed and the media is controlled fully bye the islamic revolutionary council.


There also devoloping a nuclear plant that is a big ****in threat to Israel,Europe and USA.

	03-02-2002 22:29									#16
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quote: Originally posted by axi That's called terrorism, you know. These 3 countries never threatened the United States. Yet you are continuously threatening them. If that's not terrorism, then what is? Hypocrites!

Dont be stupid. If you really have somthing contribute, say it. But your statement is completely false and you know it.


You forget the gulf war? You forget the Barracks bombing in 83? . You also forget Iranian clerics who said they would attack the USA with nuclear weapons if they ever got the chane? You forget 9/11.....oh wait,...umm.


go away moron.

	03-02-2002 23:57									#17
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In Iran, there is a struggle going on between the reactionaries and the conservatives. Right now, the reactionaries have the upper hand, and the conservatives (called moderates in our press) are walking on eggshells, slowly taking a little bit here and a little bit there, trying to bring Iran back to the community of nations. Attack them now and you will destroy the whole process and and had power back to the clerics for another generation.

BTW, the barracks in Lebanon were legitimate military targets. Hezbollah are guerillas, not terrorists.

A new Korean war would be a very bad thing. South Korea stands the most to lose, as its military is very nationalistic (Korean nationalists, not South Korean nationalists) and might turn on the Americans. I have been told be soldiers stationed in Korea that they were fully prepared to turn their weapons on the South Korean armed forces. I have also heard from Koreans who say that many of the people who are drafted into the South Korean Army are sympathetic to the North.

That leaves Iraq, and most of the Arab world has already said it will not accept an attack on Iraq. There is no evidence that Iraq has suported terrorism (I'm sure you'll bring up the faked story about the Iraqi assassins, but it was later admitted to have been a false story).

As for weapons of mass destruction . . . be real. Iraq had chemical and biological weapons in the Gulf War and it did not use them. Why? Because despite all the rhetoric, Hussein is not insane, and knows that using such weapons would result in massive (possibly nuclear) retaliation.

Faded, you think with your TV too much. Use your brain instead, sometime.

	04-02-2002 00:10									#18
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quote: Hussein is not insane

*cough* I feel that gasing the Kurds , and the Iranians can be considered a usage of unconventional weapons . He has already used them multiple times .

Saddam is bad . No doubt . But getting him out of there is a very tricky job, since he will launch all he can if he's threatened.

I won't cry when he's gone . I am sure you won't either , che.

Hezbollah: I consider them not less crazy than those ****ers in Algeria. These are the people I'd kill myself given the chance.... crazy bastards.

North Korea- errmm... nothing to say actually ( maybe you'll give them some food, and them look what they're, coz they're in bad shape. )

Iran: when will that regime die out? ( not change and open up to the west , ro something but decay and dissolve ) I hope sooner than later.

	04-02-2002 00:15									#19
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara In Iran, there is a struggle going on between the reactionaries and the conservatives. Right now, the reactionaries have the upper hand, and the conservatives (called moderates in our press) are walking on eggshells, slowly taking a little bit here and a little bit there, trying to bring Iran back to the community of nations. Attack them now and you will destroy the whole process and and had power back to the clerics for another generation.

The issue here is whether the Conservatives can take control before the reactionaries get nuclear weapons. If not, I think we have to take military action.

quote: BTW, the barracks in Lebanon were legitimate military targets. Hezbollah are guerillas, not terrorists.

No, they kidnapped a bunch of journalists and blew up a Jewish community center in Argentina. Still, they're better then most.

quote: A new Korean war would be a very bad thing. South Korea stands the most to lose, as its military is very nationalistic (Korean nationalists, not South Korean nationalists) and might turn on the Americans. I have been told be soldiers stationed in Korea that they were fully prepared to turn their weapons on the South Korean armed forces. I have also heard from Koreans who say that many of the people who are drafted into the South Korean Army are sympathetic to the North.

Interesting. I don't think it's a good idea to go after the North as long as it keeps its WMDs to itself, and I think (though I easily could be wrong) that Bush only mentioned North Korea for one reason - it's a non-Islamic country.

quote: That leaves Iraq, and most of the Arab world has already said it will not accept an attack on Iraq. There is no evidence that Iraq has suported terrorism (I'm sure you'll bring up the faked story about the Iraqi assassins, but it was later admitted to have been a false story).

Not clear which story you're talking about here. It seems Iraqi dissidents abroad have been assassinated, and Iraqi defectors claim that that there is a terrorist training camp in Salman Park north of Baghdad. Iraqi also supports the Mujahadeen Khalq in Iran.

quote: As for weapons of mass destruction . . . be real. Iraq had chemical and biological weapons in the Gulf War and it did not use them. Why? Because despite all the rhetoric, Hussein is not insane, and knows that using such weapons would result in massive (possibly nuclear) retaliation.

The issue is, if he ever feels that he's going down, he will use those weapons. We do not want a madman and self-described Stalinist dictator to be able to threaten us (or anyone else) with nuclear weapons.

	04-02-2002 00:23									#20
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The only country that has ever used weapons of mass destruction is the USA. So I propose a pre-emptive nuclear strike on Washington.

The South will rise again!

	04-02-2002 00:26									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Natan I think (though I easily could be wrong) that Bush only mentioned North Korea for one reason - it's a non-Islamic country.

That theory does have an aura of plausability to it...

	04-02-2002 00:26									#22
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara BTW, the barracks in Lebanon were legitimate military targets. Hezbollah are guerillas, not terrorists.

What about Buenos-Aires? Also guerilla operation?

	04-02-2002 00:27									#23
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Whining about a country having NBC weapons really doesn't mean much to me when the country doing the whining has stockpiles of the weapons, themselves.


I don't want the USA, Russia, Britain, India, China, ect... threatening anyone with NBC weapons anymore then I want Iraq to.

	04-02-2002 00:53									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Osweld Whining about a country having NBC weapons really doesn't mean much to me when the country doing the whining has stockpiles of the weapons, themselves. I don't want the USA, Russia, Britain, India, China, ect... threatening anyone with NBC weapons anymore then I want Iraq to.

Yes, but if you can prevent another country from getting them? Especially one so unstable as Iraq.

	04-02-2002 01:10									#25
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I'm no fan of any of these countries. But you can't launch "pre-emptive" strikes against countries unless you have extremely good reason to think that are about to attack you---imminently. Under the UN Charter we have a right to legitimate self-defense. But we can't just attack whomever we think might attack us.

The fact that it is politically convenient to do so now is not a legitimate justification. We are signatories to the UN treaty and we must abide by it. There is a lot of weasel room in the phrase "legitimate self-defense". But not this much.

Of course, if we have evidence that Iran or Iraq helped in 9/11, we can retaliate at will. But we will have to produce such evidence.

	04-02-2002 01:13									#26
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What about a country whose leaders promise to commit genocide when they get nuclear weapons?

	04-02-2002 01:19									#27
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Geocide is a crime against humanity. All nations are obligated to try to stop it. But saying "Israel must be destroyed" is not the same thing as saying you are going to commit genocide as soon as you get nuclear weapons.

	04-02-2002 01:31									#28
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What about a country whose leaders promise to commit genocide when they get nuclear weapons?

Israel is such a country. according to Torah they have to exterminate every non-jew in Israel.

So let's nuke BOTH Washington and Jerusalem and take out two terrorist nations that have weapons of mass destuction and have already used them.

	04-02-2002 01:43									#29
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Everyone:

What are the odds that Bush mentioned Iran simply to engender some intra-fighting there?

As Natan said, there is a struggle going on in Iran now between the conservatives and the clergy. Perhaps Bush was trying to sow a bit of "now's the time to make your choice" type of seed? For some reason, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if that were the case — and, perhaps, some sort of non-public support from Bush, et al., is going (or will be) to the Iranian conservatives (moderates in American parlance).

Haven't they been saying for years now that North Korea's communist government would collapse? Seems to be going strong to me, despite starvation among the people and crumbling infrastructure.

Iraq. Baghdad should have fallen to U.S. and Allied military forces in 1991. We had to stop because the mission was to eject Iraq from Kuwait, not to conquer Iraq and force Saddam Hussein out. I believe our Arab friends at the time were also instrumental in making sure Bush Sr. was aware of the mission parameters. The rest is history.

CYBERAmazon

	04-02-2002 02:09									#30
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quote: Originally posted by WFHermans Israel is such a country. according to Torah they have to exterminate every non-jew in Israel.

1) Modern Israel has never been committed to fulfiling Torah law.
2) The Torah actually says no such thing, instead it says "There shall be one law for the native and the stranger amongst you."
3) This is made even clearer in the other sources of the Jewish religion, such as the Talmud.
4) Where do you get these anti-semitic lies?

quote: So let's nuke BOTH Washington and Jerusalem and take out two terrorist nations that have weapons of mass destuction and have already used them.

Wow, I guess that the Israeli use of weapons of mass destruction was covered up by the Zionist controlled media, so we can only read about it on jewwatch.org?