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OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 01:52 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
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So because some muslim extremists took the lives of 3,000 innocent americans we are justified in taking away the civil rights of 10 million or so innocent muslim americans. Sounds like good logic to me.

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
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May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 01:54
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Yep, damn straight... the civil rights of all of those muslims doesn't amount to the life of one of my friends, who happened to die in the WTC.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 01:59 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBaggins
Yep, damn straight... the civil rights of all of those muslims doesn't amount to the life of one of my friends, who happened to die.


A very close friend/relative of mine was killed in a car accident. Cars kill way more people in an average year than are ever lost to Islamic terrorists. Perhaps we should make all cars illegal "because if it saves just one life...."

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
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May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:01
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Do the car manufacturers or these drivers have direct intentional motives for killing these people?

Jac de Molay is offline Jac de Molay
Prince
Detroit
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:02
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Baggins.

Suicide bombing is occuring in one small area of the world by people who share a religion and a viewpoint of occupied lands. Terrorist acts themselves span a wide variety of religious and political agendas. El Al's and IDF's "effective" tactics are a matter of debate when you consider the continuing pervasiveness of suicide attacks.

At the same time, who really suffers the most from profiling?

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:02
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBaggins
Do the car manufacturers or these drivers have direct intentional motives for killing these people?


Do muslims?

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:03
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not car victims but muslims do have intentional motives to kill "The Great Satan" ... yes...

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:07
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quote:
Originally posted by DetroitDave
Baggins.

Suicide bombing is occuring in one small area of the world by people who share a religion and a viewpoint of occupied lands. Terrorist acts themselves span a wide variety of religious and political agendas. El Al's and IDF's "effective" tactics are a matter of debate when you consider the continuing pervasiveness of suicide attacks.

At the same time, who really suffers the most from profiling?


El Al seems to be very effective now, don't you think?

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:09
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBaggins
muslims do have intentional motives to kill "The Great Satan" ... yes...


Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:09
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quote:
Christ on a pogo stick, people! Isn't it a little early to start scoring little political points with this, pro-gun or anti-gun, zero-tolerance or not zero-tolerance, ad naseum? Honestly, I expected better out of some of you.


You did? I guess I have less faith in Polytubbies that you do.

-

And yes, profiling only based on race is totally, 100%, just wrong.

And MrBaggins, your views that Muslim-Americans should be denied rights because a few extremists destroyed the WTC, is either a bad troll, or a very scary, prejudical statement.

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Osweld




how many non-islamic islamic terrorists were there?

You're not paranoid if they really are out to get you.

Jac de Molay is offline Jac de Molay
Prince
Detroit
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:16
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So the fact that one instance where it keeps control justifies instances where blatant racial profiling is used to keep track of undesireables? Driving while Black is a legitimate reason to be pulled over? How about being jailed indefinitely, without due process , by the INS for immigration violations because you fit the bill (read- are an arab).

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:18
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i should feel bad exactly, why?

Jac de Molay is offline Jac de Molay
Prince
Detroit
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:19
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You shouldn't feel bad at all. You should feel lucky.

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:20
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so you agree with me. Glad we cleared that up *winks*

Jac de Molay is offline Jac de Molay
Prince
Detroit
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:21
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Ignorance truly is bliss after all.

Jon Miller is offline Jon Miller
Emperor

May 1999
time: 23:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:22
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hey

you have something in your eye

Jon Miller

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:23
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No.. the fact that you didn't let a terrorist slip through your 'system' is bliss.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:24
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quote:
how many non-islamic islamic terrorists were there?


Hmmm, Timothy McVeigh
Baider Meinhoff Gang
Irish Republican Army
FARC (in Colombia)
etc.

Stereotyping is very nice and all, but usually wrong .

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
quote:
how many non-islamic islamic terrorists were there?


Hmmm, Timothy McVeigh
Baider Meinhoff Gang
Irish Republican Army
FARC (in Colombia)
etc.

Stereotyping is very nice and all, but usually wrong .


Well none of those are islamic terrorists... so they don't apply.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:27
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBaggins
how many non-islamic islamic terrorists were there?


Fatah and thier secular subsidiaries.

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:33
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quote:
Originally posted by DinoDoc


Fatah and thier secular subsidiaries.


thanks... so just to be on the safe side profile all muslims and arabs.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:36 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
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Well look at Israel, you prize some of their efforts to stop terrorism, which can be considered draconian by many, but they haven't done any good. People still blow themselves up on the streets of Israel.

With crime and violent behavior we cannot assume that treating the symptoms is enough. It never has been and never will be. We have to look at why people commit violent crimes. Only by addressing that can we stop violence. I'll bring this thread back to its original topic (I hope) to make this point.

School shootings are a hyped up occurance in not only this country, but apparently in Europe too. Profiling people who wear black, or imposing zero-tolerance doesn't stop these crimes. People say that police need to be stationed in every high school to prevent shootings. They totally blind themselves to the fact that in Columbine there WAS a cop in the building. There is much evidence out there to say that the only thing that cop did was kill an innocent student, NOT the shooters.

We have to address the root cause of these acts of violence. It is clear in my mind that the reason students act out like this is a sense of powerlessness. They have no control over their lives or their destiny. They feel as if they are imprisoned for committing no crime. Just close your eyes and picture yourself in a situation where no one listens to you. No matter what you say or do people look down on you and patronize you. You have no freedom, others are always controling you. You can't escape, you can't try to change things, and no one will even listen to you complain about it. It is like being in a room with no doors or windows, feeling trapped and alone.

When in a situation like that it is just human nature to explode. It is like a wild animal backed into a corner, it feels trapped with no alternatives so it becomes violent. So to do young people turn violent when they feel trapped by society. All these post-columbine measures only make the root cause for violence grow. Increasing the alienation, suffocation, and powerlessness that students feel. This is making things worse, not better.

Granting young people freedom is the only solution to stop these terrible mass shootings.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:37
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quote:
Well none of those are islamic terrorists... so they don't apply.


Now I know you are a stupid troll... thank you .

On the safe side we should profile all white people because of Tim McVeigh, the Unabomber, David Koresh, the KKK, and the Nazis .

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 02:41
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Well done Imran.

I was just taking a Time back page idea and seeing how far it would run...

connorkimbro is offline connorkimbro
Emperor
Seoul Korea
Jan 1970
time: 23:19
Arrow  Old Post 27-04-2002 03:17
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quote:
Christ on a pogo stick, people! Isn't it a little early to start scoring little political points with this, pro-gun or anti-gun, zero-tolerance or not zero-tolerance, ad naseum?


If it happened in the US, it wouldn't be. Whenever something like this happens in the US, the anti-gun people go nuts.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 03:18
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBaggins
Well done Imran.

I was just taking a Time back page idea and seeing how far it would run...


And only 3 posts by me .

Well, I alluded to it in the first post .

MrBaggins is offline MrBaggins
King

May 1999
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 03:48
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Imran> You didn't say Simon says first time around... too ambiguous...

Faeelin is offline Faeelin
Chieftain
Tau Ceti
Oct 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 03:52
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I thought guns were banned in Germany?

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 27-04-2002 03:56
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quote:
Originally posted by connorkimbro
quote:
Christ on a pogo stick, people! Isn't it a little early to start scoring little political points with this, pro-gun or anti-gun, zero-tolerance or not zero-tolerance, ad naseum?


If it happened in the US, it wouldn't be. Whenever something like this happens in the US, the anti-gun people go nuts.


As domenstrated by this thread it isn't when it happens in the EU, either - 'cause the pro-gun/anti-gun people still go nuts.

 
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