07-05-2002 03:55									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Carver Mr. Fun, I'm going back to grad school this fall to do a PhD in political science. I applied to the Univ of Iowa and was at their recruitment weekend in Iowa City back in March. That sure is a beautiful town, and cheap too. I decided to go somewhere else, but I think about U of Iowa often. And things don't look too bad financially either. The average full professor at a private institution makes $98,606. I think, with book royalties and speaking fees on the side, that's a liveable income.

Ok --- so why did I get different info from a source that says a professor usually starts out with $36,000??

But I plan to live somewhere else --- not in Iowa.

	07-05-2002 05:52									#62
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quote: Originally posted by *End Is Forever* Of course, the ironic thing is that, as an Economics undergraduate, Mr. Spink here is completing... an arts degree.

BScEcon.

I think not.

Economics could be an arts or a science degree, depending on the modules you take. Because I'm taking the Econometrics route, it's a science.

	07-05-2002 05:56									#63
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Evening Stew.

You probably know where I stand on this one being a science graduate. To me Stew, you are an arts student

Of course, that old classic which, of course, gets funnier every time it is told.

'What do you say to an arts graduate?'
'Big Mac please'

Curse this damn spacebar.

	07-05-2002 06:00									#64
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Science students tend to hold things constant which aren't actually constant in real life.

In biology, it's temperature, pH, density, concentration, quantities.

In economics, it's just the same.

	07-05-2002 06:04									#65
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Yeah, but there is more to economics than simple laws. That is the problem, the theories do not always hold true

	07-05-2002 06:58									#66
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I'm going to an art school after high school. Apparently grads from this school (Emily Carr Institute of Art and Design) lots o' job offers. But mostly out side of Canada.

	07-05-2002 07:14									#67
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Well I'll be getting two B.A.'s

Political Science
Economics

Econ is a BA here, even if you focus on Econometrics... as it should be.

	07-05-2002 07:18									#68
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High school?! Jesus, I feel so old...Metamucil, please.

	07-05-2002 08:47									#69
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Degree in Vocal Performance here. Job at a Manhattan recruiting firm here. Yeah, worthless (but I really enjoyed getting it)

Wow, Vocal Performance! It's great. But working at a recruiting firm makes you lose your calification. Don't you plan to look for some job which actually involves vocal performance? BTW, isn't your nickname related to your past role in the opera "Boris Godunov"?

	07-05-2002 09:01									#70
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"'What do you say to an arts graduate?'
'Big Mac please' "

Better then what you say to a certain sciences graduate:

"Here is your unemployment check"


Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

	07-05-2002 09:21									#71
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Arts graduates find it easy to get jobs because there are so many jobs which derive from it - teaching, journalism, clerical work, government policy, thousands of jobs.

	07-05-2002 09:23									#72
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Science graduates find it easy to get jobs because them and the blue-collar slaves are the only ones who do anything useful in this world.

	07-05-2002 09:26									#73
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quote: Science graduates find it easy to get jobs because them and the blue-collar slaves are the only ones who do anything useful in this world.

*cough* Provost Harrison. All science people don't have easy time finding jobs.

And useful things? People that serve you your food (which isn't blue collar) or stock supermarket shelves do something useful: FEED YOU! .

	07-05-2002 09:26									#74
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quote: Originally posted by Roland I'm always hoplessly confused by your academic system (or lack of system). The rather broad college degrees (arts bachelor) vs law or med school, for example.

Roland, I don't think anybody really answered your question so I'll give it a whack, if you may.

Usually, Law and Med schools are entered upon reception of the "broad college degrees" you refer to. If you don't have a B.A., B.S., or whatever, the odds of you entering law or med school are lessened...

[digression]
... Unless you actually have experience in the field and have entered it another way. For example, my sister never went to a four year school, instead opting to go to Crawford Long school of Nursing in Atlanta, Georgia. While there, a number of her professors saw that she could advance far beyond nursing and convinced her to apply to med school upon completion of her nurses training. When she was done with Crawford Long, she entered Duke University medical school (she didn't want to leave the south - she hates, HATES snow).
[/digression]

The same thing applies towards other degrees, such as MBA's or any PhD's - you generally get your four year "bachelor of whatever" (also known as "undergrad") degree and then go for the advance degree. Btw, here in the US you have a much better chance of getting in to an advanced degree program like an MBA or a PhD if you have a few years of experience in your chosen profession then you try to go straight from undergrad school.

	07-05-2002 09:28									#75
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond Wow, Vocal Performance! It's great. But working at a recruiting firm makes you lose your calification. Don't you plan to look for some job which actually involves vocal performance? BTW, isn't your nickname related to your past role in the opera "Boris Godunov"?

I still sing in my spare time on an amateur basis. Making money as a classical vocalist is extremely difficult, particularly enough money on which to totally support one's self.

Yeah, the nickname is from the opera Boris Godunov, which happens to be my favorite. I've never sung the role though, and likely never will, as I am not a bass but a baritone, I'm entirely too short and I have fair features that are utterly non-slavic.

	07-05-2002 09:29									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui And useful things? People that serve you your food (which isn't blue collar) or stock supermarket shelves do something useful: FEED YOU! .

I count service jobs as blue-collar. Most working-class families are now supported by them, after all...

	07-05-2002 09:30									#77
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quote: Btw, here in the US you have a much better chance of getting in to an advanced degree program like an MBA or a PhD if you have a few years of experience in your chosen profession then you try to go straight from undergrad school.

Unless you were really good in school .

	07-05-2002 09:32									#78
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quote: I count service jobs as blue-collar.

Most people would not.

Heh, that would mean I was a blue collar worker .

Oh, and what about Government people that make legislation that (sometimes) help people. They surely do something useful, when they, say, allow unions, or such.

	07-05-2002 09:36									#79
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Government occasionally manages to do something useful. Most of their time is spent chasing after interns, covering their asses or making themselves look good, though. Almost identical to average upper-management's day. Lower-management spends less time chasing interns and more time covering their asses. Between that and trips to the coffee machine their work week hovers somewhere around an hour...

	07-05-2002 09:40									#80
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quote: Between that and trips to the coffee machine their work week hovers somewhere around an hour...

At least it is better than the half-hour that science types spend doing work .

If you can make unfair generalizations, so can I.

	07-05-2002 09:51									#81
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Science types do something original in their half-hour of work per day. Management's hour a week consists of rubber-stamping documents...

Science people don't go into management because it would bore them to tears. Management people don't go into science because it requires something between the ears.

	07-05-2002 10:35									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison Of course, that old classic which, of course, gets funnier every time it is told. 'What do you say to an arts graduate?' 'Big Mac please'

We have a slightly different version...

'What's the most common phrase uttered by an arts graduate?'
'Do you want fries with that?'



[Edit: Ooops]

	07-05-2002 10:37									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Heh, that would mean I was a blue collar worker .

If you're going to law school you're probably destined to become an orange-collar worker.

	07-05-2002 10:45									#84
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Thanks for your answers, Boris Godunov. Well, I am quite impressed by the fact that we have a clasical baritone vocalist here on Apolyton.

	07-05-2002 10:55									#85
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quote: Science types do something original in their half-hour of work per day. Management's hour a week consists of rubber-stamping documents... Science people don't go into management because it would bore them to tears. Management people don't go into science because it requires something between the ears.

Of course the management people make the money and tell the science people what to do .

Know your role

	07-05-2002 10:55									#86
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse Government occasionally manages to do something useful. Most of their time is spent chasing after interns, covering their asses or making themselves look good, though. Almost identical to average upper-management's day. Lower-management spends less time chasing interns and more time covering their asses. Between that and trips to the coffee machine their work week hovers somewhere around an hour...

I spent 1.5 years working for the U.S. Federal Government. This is blatantly not true. The vast majority of the people I worked with were extremely diligent, competent people who cared about their work and worked hard. I drove one guy home who had spend 36 hours straight at the building on a software release because he was too tired to see straight.

Much of the government stereotyping and bashing is unsubstantiated hyperbole. And the rest is exaggerations based on isolated incidents.

	07-05-2002 12:55									#87
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JohnT:

Thanks.

"If you don't have a B.A., B.S., or whatever, the odds of you entering law or med school are lessened..."

There is an incredibly bizarre reform draft here. All studies would be devided into bachelor-master-doctor. The bachelor (no german title for this!) would be "BA" - and the field of study. So a BA arts (BAA ?), a BA law (BAL), MA med (BAM ?) etc. Some bureucracy clowns think this is soooo international - I just think it would cause way more international confusion than our current system....

"Btw, here in the US you have a much better chance of getting in to an advanced degree program like an MBA or a PhD if you have a few years of experience in your chosen profession then you try to go straight from undergrad school."

Understand that for the PhD, but for the MBA ?

	07-05-2002 13:04									#88
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actually more the reverse, roland.

MBA classes include a lot team problem solving of business cases. People with less real world experience have less to contribute to the team here.

Many Ph.D. programs (sciences, arts) have students who go straight from undergrad to grad school.

	07-05-2002 13:08									#89
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun BA degrees are definitely not worthless. I'm going for a BA in History, then later, go for a Phd in graduate school to work towards my goal of becoming an underpaid professor and teach undergrad students U.S. history.

You SHOULD be underpaid - there's no more than 250 years of it to teach

	07-05-2002 13:47									#90
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quote: There is an incredibly bizarre reform draft here. All studies would be devided into bachelor-master-doctor. The bachelor (no german title for this!) would be "BA" - and the field of study. So a BA arts (BAA ?), a BA law (BAL), MA med (BAM ?) etc. Some bureucracy clowns think this is soooo international - I just think it would cause way more international confusion than our current system....

Any chance of this succeeding? That does sound confusing.