06-06-2002 01:44									#1
	Are there enough "quality" civs left for Firaxis to eventually release another XP? Put an end to popups!

Taking into acocunt that the game can support up to 31 civs (32 if you count the barbs) then Firaxis could easily release another XP with seven new civs and other new features. The question now becomes whether or not there are enough interesting civs which could be included without having to resort to the likes of the Jamaicans. In my opinion, I would say yes. Out of the three major contenders for the last spot in PTW (inca, korea, Israel), at least two of them would be good additions to a future XP.
Let's see here if I can rattle off a decent list of 7 civs without going into too much study.
1.Inca/Korea/Israel
2. Inca/Korea/Israel
3. Portugese
4. Dutch
5. Ethiopia/Mali
6. Mayans
7. Poland? Polynesia?

Hmm, do you think such a set of civs would be "marketable" enough? There are a few big names on there....

	06-06-2002 01:58									#2
	Re: Are there enough "quality" civs left for Firaxis to eventually release another Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by monkspider Taking into acocunt that the game can support up to 31 civs (32 if you count the barbs) then Firaxis could easily release another XP with seven new civs and other new features. The question now becomes whether or not there are enough interesting civs which could be included without having to resort to the likes of the Jamaicans. In my opinion, I would say yes. Out of the three major contenders for the last spot in PTW (inca, korea, Israel), at least two of them would be good additions to a future XP. Let's see here if I can rattle off a decent list of 7 civs without going into too much study. 1.Inca/Korea/Israel 2. Inca/Korea/Israel 3. Portugese 4. Dutch 5. Ethiopia/Mali 6. Mayans 7. Poland? Polynesia? Hmm, do you think such a set of civs would be "marketable" enough? There are a few big names on there....

hi ,

yep , why not , .......

and it would be nice if they went to a total of 32 civs , playable and lets say 48 - 64 to chose from , ........

have a nice day / night

	06-06-2002 02:05									#3
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Poland- definately.

As usual I agree with your picks for civs (politcs is another story entirely ) I think that Poland is an especially worthy civ, more so than some of those included in this XP. There are large group of people in the U.S. that are of Polish descent, and would please many if included. I would add another Native American tribe (Sioux, Cherokee, or Cheyenne), along with a Polynesian civ. The Phoenicians would be a good choice if the Carthaginians weren't included. However, your list pretty much includes most of the "worthy" civs.

	06-06-2002 02:22									#4
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The khmer and the tibetanians miss

	06-06-2002 02:22									#5
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Not difficult to think about any missing civ from the past, Native american or Middle-East, and why not the Neanderthals or the Martians ? Seriously, it's highly unlikely to anticipate a second XP. When the time should come to that, it would be the time to start the Civ 4 project instead.

	06-06-2002 02:31									#6
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Nat- Thanks for the kind words!

Marcus- Well Marcus I don't think it's so unthinkable at all that there would be a second XP, especially since this one focuses mostly just on multiplayer features. Civ 2 had a number of a expansion packs, and Civ 4 is quite a ways off, at least based on the precedent of the length time between the current Civ incarnations. Even if some of complications that were involved in the making of Civ 3 aren't in place I still don't forsee Civ 4 in the foreseeable future in any event. Moreover, XP packs are all the rage these days, look at how many the Sims has received? Since Civ 2 recieved quite a few XPs, I see us probably getting at least a second for Civ 3.

	06-06-2002 02:32									#7
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BTW, just between you and me, Infogrames seems like the type of comany that would milk a game franchise for all it's worth.

	06-06-2002 02:36									#8
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quote: Originally posted by monkspider BTW, just between you and me, Infogrames seems like the type of comany that would milk a game franchise for all it's worth.

hi ,

yep , read the thread "price" , ..........

have a nice day

	06-06-2002 02:37									#9
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Leaving out the Portuguese and the Dutch is an unforgivable sin so, yeah, there should be a second XP!

	06-06-2002 04:14									#10
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Very good list Monkspider. The only thing lacking is a SE Asian Civ (Khmer, Thai, Javanese or something).
I think all these Civs are marketable except the African ones, about which most gamers know nothing :
- Inca, Maya : their biggest achievments are well known, plus a bunch of American students go to Yucatan on vacation.
- Dutch, Portuguese : quite important in European history, and major colonial powers. It would please buyers from both continents.
- Korea : Becomes the country in fashion. Especially for (on-line) gamers, as they're first in the online gaming domain. The world cup also boosts Korea popularity.
- Israel / Hebrews : many poeple would want them, at least to play an ancient Mediterranean scenario, or to play a war against the Ararbs.
- Ethiopia, Mali : currently not famous, but they could become more known among Civers if included (ie : if Civers play against them repeatedly)
- Poland : ditto to Nationalist. Would also be useful in European scenarios (middle ages -> late 1700's, WW2, cold war)
- Khmer, Thai, Indonesians : interesting for Asian scenarios (incl. colonization). Thai risk to make it over the 2 others, as Thai culture is well known among tourists, and because Thailand is currently the richest country among the 3.

	06-06-2002 04:21									#11
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

They... could just... start on IV you know...

	06-06-2002 06:02									#12
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Well, don't get me wrong, I'll be happy to see a second XP and even a third - like all of you wanting the skipped civs - especially Incans, Dutch, Portuguese, Thai, Indonesian, Sioux. It's just how I doubt they repeat Civ II's agenda about XPs and patches, but who knows...let's say again 5 full years of patching before a new civ project? Hmmmm...the market has changed a bit, but we can't read what on Sid's mind and his team...

Moreover I wish that Firaxis can upgrade the pathfinding on larger maps ( speeding up between turns ) , it's more important to me than 32 available civs.

	06-06-2002 07:32									#13
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[monkspider] Dan, does Firaxis have any intentions of ever releasing a second XP in the future that you know of?

[DanMagahaFIRAXIS] monk, nothing on the radar yet, but my guess would be Infogrames call, if PTW does well it would seem like a good likelihood

Yay!

	06-06-2002 08:19									#14
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I think that the world map is running out of space to put all of these civs. Maybe space for 2 civs in south america (Incas and one other) also maybe Inuit in Alaska/Siberia. And also space for a West African civ. After that, the map will be too crowded.

	06-06-2002 08:51									#15
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A few there.

Mali, Ethiopia, Korea/Incas/Hebrews (depending on which ones don't make it first time around), Australia, Aborigines, Canada, Portugese, Dutch, Poles, just to name a few.

Anyway, I don't really care that much about overcrowding on the world map. You could just disable who you'd think are the less significant civs of a particular area. Most games I play aren't even on the world map (way too slow on my PII 350).

	06-06-2002 09:31									#16
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I would love to see Poland created. Poland has a big cultural and langauge spread in Central/Eastern Europe. Not to mention Civ 3 lacks in Eastern Europe. Sid gave us only Russia and there are plenty more interesting contries in East Europe. Would love to see the historicle leader as Pilsudski and maybe the 1918-1939 Ulan as UU.

	06-06-2002 13:09									#17
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Vote for Central-Asian Civ. May be Uzbeks/Kazakhs/Turkuts.
Imagine: War For Caspian Oil.
Real History:
Huns Kaganat(Empire)
Turkut Kaganat
West-Turkut Kaganat
Turgesh Kaganat
Karakhanid's Khanat
Kimak's Kaganat
Khazar's Kaganat
Kypchak's (Coman's) Kaganat
Roaming Uzbek's
Kazakhstan

	06-06-2002 14:25									#18
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Apart from Korea/Hebrews/Incas, I would love to see the following countries:

1. Poland
2. Sweden (in 17-18th centuries Sweden was a great power in Europe and certainly deserves inclusion)
3. Byzantines
4. Armenia (although nowadays it is a small trans-caucasian republic, it is a very ancient culture, and at one time spread from Caucasus to Mediterranean, also was the first nation to adopt Christianity as official religion)
5. Ethiopians (ancient culture, uncolonised until 1935, so one of the few African countries to stay independent for a very long time)
8. Australians or Aborigines ( so that there is some civ on that continent)

Also more Asian civs would do, - maybe Thai, Khmer, Tibetans,
and some more Europeans - Portuguese, Dutch, Scottish, Hungarians, Romanians, Serbs. Other African civs could include Ghana or Mali.

So I think there are more than enough civs which could be included in future XPs.

	06-06-2002 14:55									#19
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http://www.geocities.com/kaganate/khazmape.html

	06-06-2002 14:59									#20
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You can always, with a little research, find cultures with enough unique (or useful) attributes to make a game of it. Even the Goths - I could think of a UU, some city names and civ traits. And they were just nomadic Barbarians to begin with!

	06-06-2002 15:20									#21
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Spreading of Kypchaks

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	06-06-2002 15:27									#22
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Sun symbol of God Tengri. VI-VII AD. Dagestan

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	06-06-2002 15:28									#23
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The who what now?

Ahh, one of those Mongol spin-off Civs. It could be good though, one of their attributes: natural mutual dislike of the Mongols, or maybe naturally inclined to be allies. Whichever you want.

	06-06-2002 15:40									#24
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1) Incas
2) Timurids
3) Khmer
4) Tibetans
5) Mayas
6) Polish
7) Malis
8) Ethiopians

	06-06-2002 16:00									#25
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quote: Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt The who what now? Ahh, one of those Mongol spin-off Civs. It could be good though, one of their attributes: natural mutual dislike of the Mongols, or maybe naturally inclined to be allies. Whichever you want.

spin-off? what it means? This nations aren't Mongol. They are Turkic. Don't mistake with both turks seljuks and osmans (ottomans). Distance between turkic and turks are as between germanic and germans

	06-06-2002 16:09									#26
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Whoops. Forgive my ignorance, Montezuma - that period of history is not my strong point. But that is one of the peoples that came from East of the Black Sea and expanded over a huge terrain that had very few cities, and they likely lived on horseback - very similar to the Mongols, Huns, Parthians etc.

	06-06-2002 17:11									#27
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armenians!

	06-06-2002 21:35									#28
	Inflate your Upload Space

hi ,

guys , having all these civ's is fine , but how about the colonial period , if one plays on a worldmap , very soon there is nothing left to take , ....

have a nice day

	06-06-2002 22:37									#29
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Considering the Expansion Packs listed here on Apolyton, I easily see enough for 24 more civs without even trying.

As to what decides "quality civ", that is a personal choice issue for us, marketing issue for Firaxis. Just look at the civs that aren't in Civ 3, but were in Civ 1, Civ2 and its various offshoots, CtP, and CtP2.

Also, consider the good mods made here, at CivFanatics, 1BC, and other places. With C3PTW or Wiwi's ModManager, you can switch and choose if Firaxis doesn't add anymore later.

	06-06-2002 22:49									#30
	Put an end to popups!

hi ,

with all these civ's , ....we need a bigger map ,.......

have a nice day