16-06-2002 00:11									#1
	The Senate Increase Your PM Length

Do we need one?

What would it do?

How many senators should there be if a senator could chuck wood?

	16-06-2002 00:14									#2
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We should elect 100 senators just like the U.S. We could have two senators from each country. It would be really fun. Why did you start this thread? Trying to keep all of Panag's senate coments in one place?

	16-06-2002 00:18									#3
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And what about the polling then?

	16-06-2002 00:19									#4
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I don't think we need a senate. It just adds another layer, making the game even more complex. IMO, the demo game will function like the classic Greek democracy, where every citizen gets a direct vote, so representation (in the form of a senate) is not needed.

	16-06-2002 00:19									#5
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I wanna be a senator. Don't wanna be a minister. I'd have to do something if I were a minister. As a senator I could be lazy and complain and get drunk on general principle. Of course, I can do that as Joius Blowius citizen too, but I'd rather do it as a senator.

It might also be good for there to be a 'chamber of sober second thought' from time to time.

	16-06-2002 00:33									#6
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither I wanna be a senator. Don't wanna be a minister. I'd have to do something if I were a minister. As a senator I could be lazy and complain and get drunk on general principle. Of course, I can do that as Joius Blowius citizen too, but I'd rather do it as a senator.

Boy, sounds like a useful addition.

	16-06-2002 00:34									#7
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Just ask a Canadian. We're experts at useless Senates.

	16-06-2002 00:35									#8
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Look at the bright side Trip. If people can be senators, then maybe they don't feel any great need to run for higher offices, like yours.

	16-06-2002 00:37									#9
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I don't care about that though. I'd actually rather have some competition even. I just feel adding more offices and posts whenever ANYTHING arises is a waste, and will only clutter the game up past recognition and beyond the point where it's able to function as designed.

	16-06-2002 00:42									#10
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I'll nominate you and myself as senators and any one else who cares to join. Our responsibilities will include starting polls, spamming the boards, Impeaching ministers, and living off the govt. ***.

Sounds like a plan.

	16-06-2002 00:43									#11
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Trip,

You may have a point. However, a senate with 5 members would not be too many. Also, being a senator does not have to preclude being a minister if the empire is in peril.

	16-06-2002 00:44									#12
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I second those nominations.

	16-06-2002 00:51									#13
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither You may have a point. However, a senate with 5 members would not be too many. Also, being a senator does not have to preclude being a minister if the empire is in peril.

Yes, but it seems like offices are growing out of the ground now. Next thing you know, you'll have people running an election to have some say in running each individual unit in the game. It's just the more we add, the more that OTHERS will want to add as well... it's a chain-reaction.

Besides, so far the only people who I've heard support it are people who want to be IN it. I have to admit that I don't mind being in charge of this whole thing, but I really want to make this game good, and do what's right for the community, not elevate my own power. Do you really think having a Senate would improve the game that much?

	16-06-2002 00:58									#14
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Well. The response to this Demo game is quite impressive. Over 100 citizens and growing.

Many will want to lurk, as citizens. Some will want to be a bit more active, without making the commitment required of being a minister. Frankly, I lack the time even if I wanted to do the politicing.

I think that a little variety can spice things up. And besides, what's the harm if ThePlaugeRat starts a poll to name himself the dog catcher?

The Senate doesn't have to be anything that interferes with the day to day functioning of the executive branch. But it might be good to have some experienced players 'warming up' in the bull pen of the senate. In other words, more experienced people stay interested for longer. The community is larger. It attracts more people, and so on.

	16-06-2002 01:10									#15
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Well, i'd rather be the Cat Catcher. No such intentions, though...

	16-06-2002 01:11									#16
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We're all the Senate.

	16-06-2002 01:16									#17
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I would like to say for the record...

I am totally opposed to some of the suggestions being floated in other threads. Suggestions that a Senate should be closely involved with the executive, and in many cases superior to it in decision making. The people elect the President and his ministers. The Senate has no business interfering with the will of the people.

However, sometimes the people may seek the advice of a body of experienced people. Or the Constitution may develop in a way that having a Senate could be useful from time to time, in rare cases.

Other than that. The Senate would be useful as I have previously outlined. As a way to keep more people interested longer and as a good excuse for a drinking club.

	16-06-2002 01:21									#18
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither I wanna be a senator. Don't wanna be a minister. I'd have to do something if I were a minister. As a senator I could be lazy and complain and get drunk on general principle. Of course, I can do that as Joius Blowius citizen too, but I'd rather do it as a senator. It might also be good for there to be a 'chamber of sober second thought' from time to time.

hi ,

yes we need a senate , and you should get the job for the armed forces , ......

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 01:23									#19
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quote: Originally posted by ThePlagueRat Well, i'd rather be the Cat Catcher. No such intentions, though...

hi ,

the office of internal control , and foreign , ....

allas , ya wanna do it , ....



who say's yes , ....

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 01:34									#20
	No Senate Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Personally, I don't see why we need a Senate. Surely any issues should come up & be dealt with in the chats? Isn't that the real Senate, & the point of this game. Why add another layer of "bureaucracy"?

	16-06-2002 01:37									#21
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the people are the senate.

it's a direct democracy

	16-06-2002 01:38									#22
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither And besides, what's the harm if ThePlaugeRat starts a poll to name himself the dog catcher?

The harm is when people who create such positions try to have an official say on what occurs with the game.

quote: I am totally opposed to some of the suggestions being floated in other threads. Suggestions that a Senate should be closely involved with the executive, and in many cases superior to it in decision making. The people elect the President and his ministers. The Senate has no business interfering with the will of the people.

Well then what would it do? I feel that a body such a an official Senate would need more rules and regulations than the current government in place. Certainly more than "be[ing] useful from time to time, in rare cases." So far I haven't heard any good reason to have a Senate. If people want to be involved, then holding a title like 'Senator' is just as meaningless as being a regular citizen, unless they have some power. And why should they have power? What makes everyone thing we need a special office or committee for each and every function in the game? The only reason for its creation so far is to give advice (do we really need an official body to do that?), and to give positions to people so they can feel important...
Unless someone comes up with a good reason to have a Senate, and acceptable powers for it to have, I give the creation of such a thing a firm .

	16-06-2002 01:39									#23
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Uber, says the guy who has a job to keep him interested...

Proserpine, there is no permanent log of chat that can be reviewed. There is one, but it is only available to Markos and his minions.

	16-06-2002 01:43									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Proserpine Personally, I don't see why we need a Senate. Surely any issues should come up & be dealt with in the chats? Isn't that the real Senate, & the point of this game. Why add another layer of "bureaucracy"?

hi ,

to prevent for example wrongful impeachment of our beloved president , ......or any other member of the government .

to control certain "subversive" individuals , ...

to see if the government is doing a good job

to be a watchdog

to check that some people dont smoke cigars while in office , ........

to advice the president and the vice-president what to do when certain people become a nuisance , .......and start to do certain things

to check , recheck , and double check certain actions from our nation , ...

to check on the minister's that they do what the where going to do

to see if there is not to much spending

etc , ....

big CAT , care to put something else with it , ....

ah , yes , the senate goes for a drink ones in a while , the money goes to charity , ....

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 01:49									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Trip The harm is when people who create such positions try to have an official say on what occurs with the game. Well then what would it do? I feel that a body such a an official Senate would need more rules and regulations than the current government in place. Certainly more than "be[ing] useful from time to time, in rare cases." So far I haven't heard any good reason to have a Senate. If people want to be involved, then holding a title like 'Senator' is just as meaningless as being a regular citizen, unless they have some power. And why should they have power? What makes everyone thing we need a special office or committee for each and every function in the game? The only reason for its creation so far is to give advice (do we really need an official body to do that?), and to give positions to people so they can feel important... Unless someone comes up with a good reason to have a Senate, and acceptable powers for it to have, I give the creation of such a thing a firm .

hi ,

remeber what you told an hour ago , ...

just imagine that because of some hearsay or lobbying half the government is impeached , .....
or that this or that person in the government does this or that , but in the intrest of this or that , the person can explain his or that , .....

anyway , the senate is a body that listen's to the people and at the same the government , ......

an ones in a while could act when its needed as a judge , however with so many qualified people in office , this shall not happen to much , ..........

and it would be great for the game , rules , that would take 5 min to make , and the senators are people with a gut feeling for what is right and wrong , ..

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 01:53									#26
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The senate could settle issues about whether a poll is legitimate or not.

	16-06-2002 01:53									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Trip The harm is when people who create such positions try to have an official say on what occurs with the game.

Mr. President. I surely agree on that subject!
Such a position could never be approved by this great people, and one should always listen to the intellect of the people.
I think you know that. The example stated above is not to be accounted for by the ThePlagueRat. It's a terrible example stated by a drunk senator, whose intention is rather unclear...
NB: I represent a philosophic society, and I do like cats!
Preferrably black ones.

	16-06-2002 01:58									#28
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quote: Originally posted by ThePlagueRat Mr. President. I surely agree on that subject! Such a position could never be approved by this great people, and one should always listen to the intellect of the people. I think you know that. The example stated above is not to be accounted for by the ThePlagueRat. It's a terrible example stated by a drunk senator, whose intention is rather unclear... NB: I represent a philosophic society, and I do like cats! Preferrably black ones.

hi ,

a drunken one , all ready , sjeee , put him in the tank , ....wait a minute , where is the evidence , present it on the floor , or thou shall not speak bad , ....

max number of senators , 5

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 01:59									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Moral Hazard The senate could settle issues about whether a poll is legitimate or not.

hi ,

for example , .......
and the same for impeachment , ....

have a nice day

	16-06-2002 02:10									#30
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Moral Hazard,

That's a good one.