21-06-2002 02:56									#31
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Gott in Himmel!

See!! I knew you were a no good Nazi .

	21-06-2002 04:09									#32
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I agree with Lincoln. Their hearts are in the right place but their target was not legitimate. After all, wood is a great renewable source of material, and as long as the trees are replanted and allowed to regrow, that is fine with me, it shows that we can integrate with an ecosystem constructively for once.

	21-06-2002 06:10									#33
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I think the logging company and the city have a right to sue for damages. It is one thing to protest and another to inflict harm on a private company and a city.

	21-06-2002 07:12									#34
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i say we just kill all humans. VMHET or whatever has it right-- without people, the world would be a better place. :doitnow:

	21-06-2002 07:17									#35
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If these environuts got there way in 1800s we all would living in a wild west scenario... 90% of the economy dependent on agriculture.

If they get there way now, they could wipe out millions of jobs and not to mention wipe out future advancements like fuel cells because they want to destroy companies.

I say they all should be locked up for the sake of everyone.

	21-06-2002 07:17									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Ned I think the logging company and the city have a right to sue for damages. It is one thing to protest and another to inflict harm on a private company and a city.

I agree, protesting is no excuse for unlawful behavior.

	21-06-2002 07:19									#37
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Fez, remember what we said about you posting idiotic comments?

	21-06-2002 07:21									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Fez, remember what we said about you posting idiotic comments?

Nothing idiotic 'bout my opinion.....

And your post is:

	21-06-2002 07:27									#39
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How about environuts being around in the 1800s?

And the wild west only existed in the wild west. We all wouldn't be living in it.

Protecting the environment is not akin to hampering scientific progress or modernization.

	21-06-2002 07:29									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov How about environuts being around in the 1800s?

I was just making a note of it. If policies like their's were inplace then the economy would stay independent on agriculture.

quote: Protecting the environment is not akin to hampering scientific progress or modernization.

I disagree. And that is all I am going to say because I don't feel like arguing with somebody who calls my opinion idiotic. Later dude.

	21-06-2002 07:33									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Fez I disagree.

Without an environment, there won't be any scientific progress. Think about it a little bit... *squeeze those brain cells hard....you can do it*

quote: And that is all I am going to say because I don't feel like arguing with somebody who calls my opinion idiotic. Later dude.

I didn't call your opinion idiotic, just the statement.

And running away never solves anything, dude.

	21-06-2002 07:36									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Without an environment, there won't be any scientific progress. Think about it a little bit... *squeeze those brain cells hard....you can do it*

Without companies you might aswell find a cave to live in. You think about a little bit... I am in favor of companies and always have been.... Sorry.

quote: I didn't call your opinion idiotic, just the statement. And running away never solves anything, dude.

Then be more clear... when you say it....

I don't even argue with somebody I know who is not going to change their mind.... duh...

	21-06-2002 07:57									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Fez Without companies you might aswell find a cave to live in. You think about a little bit... I am in favor of companies and always have been.... Sorry.

1. Protecting the environment isn't anti-company. It's anti-companies-destroying-the-environment.

2. Would you rather...live off the land...or be extinct?

You're establishing a false dichotomy here, anyway.

quote: Then be more clear... when you say it....

I was clear, you were not.

quote: I don't even argue with somebody I know who is not going to change their mind.... duh...

Yet you continue to argue...

And I can use smileys, too:

	21-06-2002 08:04									#44
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quote: Originally posted by Fez I don't even argue with somebody I know who is not going to change their mind.... duh...

I have never argued to change somebodies mind. I'll argue to let somebody know that there are other opinions and ideas. Sometimes I'll argue just to irritate someone.......




I can use smileys too!

	21-06-2002 08:27									#45
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while waiting for a more democracy friendy government

There in lies the problem, che. What is democratic about hijacking a truck to tie it down? I mean at least in Palestine you can argue that the Israeli government perpetrated the violence first, and this is just a response. That logging company never did anything to these enviornmentalists.

As for being "effective," I bet the cops had to spend a lot more money than the logging company, which just had to lose the services of a truck for 4 hours. Big deal.

This is capitalism. What will get things done is money. If you really care about the enviornment, spend your time getting a lot of money, and then use it to buy up a whole lot of land to set aside for no development. Now there can be occasional problems (eminent domain, revolution in country you bought land from and then "land reform"), but on the whole it's a pretty good technique. I contribute very little money to any cause (due to the lack of a job until recently), but that's the one cause I actually have contributed a semi-reasonable amount to, buying land in- drat, I can't even be sure which Central American country it was now. Oh well.

	21-06-2002 08:33									#46
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quote: Originally posted by SnowFire I contribute very little money to any cause (due to the lack of a job until recently), but that's the one cause I actually have contributed a semi-reasonable amount to, buying land in- drat, I can't even be sure which Central American country it was now. Oh well.

I have some land in "East Scatalonia" that I want to set aside for development.

Interested?

	21-06-2002 08:37									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Fez I am in favor of companies and always have been

You are welcome to take your companies and leave for the moon any time you like.

	21-06-2002 10:00									#48
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Thanks to the enviromentalists in Arizona and Colorado there are 100,000 acres currently burning and the little fuzzy nutted tree squirrel they were trying to save by allowing no forest management has it's nuts also frying. Nice job.
Support the environment. Bah!
Last time I checked it was here before humans came and it'll be here after we're gone. What's the Earth going to do, turn into a black hole?
en·vi·ron·ment Pronunciation Key (n-vrn-mnt, -vrn-)
n.
The circumstances or conditions that surround one; surroundings.
The totality of circumstances surrounding an organism or group of organisms, especially:
The combination of external physical conditions that affect and influence the growth, development, and survival of organisms: “We shall never understand the natural environment until we see it as a living organism” (Paul Brooks).

	21-06-2002 10:30									#49
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"Our lumber company has made great progress in Finland"

Attachment: finland.jpg
This has been downloaded 38 time(s).

	21-06-2002 10:33									#50
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Time for some strip mining

	21-06-2002 15:32									#51
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quote: Originally posted by cia Thanks to the enviromentalists in Arizona and Colorado there are 100,000 acres currently burning and the little fuzzy nutted tree squirrel they were trying to save by allowing no forest management has it's nuts also frying. Nice job. Support the environment. Bah! Last time I checked it was here before humans came and it'll be here after we're gone. What's the Earth going to do, turn into a black hole? en·vi·ron·ment Pronunciation Key (n-vrn-mnt, -vrn-) n. The circumstances or conditions that surround one; surroundings. The totality of circumstances surrounding an organism or group of organisms, especially: The combination of external physical conditions that affect and influence the growth, development, and survival of organisms: “We shall never understand the natural environment until we see it as a living organism?(Paul Brooks).

Amazing. This is a prime example of not understanding the concept.

	21-06-2002 16:46									#52
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The problem with environmentalists is they have no $$$. If they have deep pockets they can buy a few lackeys in Capitol Hill to push legislature in their favour.

	21-06-2002 18:17									#53
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The difficulty I have with environmentalists is twofold:
They ignore the fact homo sapiens are PART of the environment, NOT existing outside of it. That's why I included the definition.
The second issue is that the law of unintended consequences exists. A full 97% of my state is federal or state land no private groups are allowed to build on, and yet the management of the land is hampered by environmentalists. The previous fire we had was in an area the Forest Service marked for cleanup and controlled burn, and the environmentalists filed an injunction and halted it. Later that summer the brown bear the environmentalists said would be disturbed by the cleanup lost 90% of the female population in one of the largest fires in state history which started there. I believe in conservation, not environmentalism.
BTW, we always got a laugh in engineering school when anti-nuke power environmentalists would protest because the put a picture of a cooling tower with the ban symbol over it, which as engineers we agree with. Dump the hot water right into the lake or river

	21-06-2002 19:02									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov 1. Protecting the environment isn't anti-company. It's anti-companies-destroying-the-environment. 2. Would you rather...live off the land...or be extinct? You're establishing a false dichotomy here, anyway.

No wrong. What else is new? He is criticising me for something I didn't say. I want advancements. Go ahead and steal money away from companies in lawsuits... they won't have any R&D money to invest for the future.

You rather are insulting my beliefs and trying to give them a bad picture. Well that is not the way it is.

quote: I was clear, you were not.

OBVIOUSLY NOT. You were not clear. I was.


Yet you continue to argue...

	21-06-2002 19:04									#55
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I have to agree with Fez on one point. He is more clear than anybody else on these boards. He clearly states his ultra-conservative views. You can accuse him of being evil, greedy, immoral, incompetent, wrong, etc, but you can't say he isn't clear about his points.

	21-06-2002 19:06									#56
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I am not ultra-conservative. This is getting stupid... why do I even share my views if I am insulted by Sava or anybody else? I am not going to anymore.

	21-06-2002 19:08									#57
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I wasn't insulting you... I was just laying the groundwork for what people could call you and what they couldn't. You may not consider yourself ultra-conservative, but compared to the majority of America, you are.

	21-06-2002 19:11									#58
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Bah! I don't even consider myself ultra-conservative in Europe.

I affiliate myself with this party: http://www.pp.es - Aznar's party. He is starting a major water project that will get the usual criticism from environuts...

	21-06-2002 19:12									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Fez No wrong. What else is new? He is criticising me for something I didn't say. I want advancements. Go ahead and steal money away from companies in lawsuits... they won't have any R&D money to invest for the future.

So let's not hold any companies accountable for destroying the environment. Brilliant. What planet are you from? Well, the planet you will end up being on is going to be a barren rock if you had your way. What good will all that R&D do you if you have to suit up like an astronaut to go to the corner store for milk?

The only think more disconcerting that environmental extremists are anti-environment extremists like you.

quote: You rather are insulting my beliefs and trying to give them a bad picture.

Don't need any help from me, they did that on their own!

quote: OBVIOUSLY NOT. You were not clear. I was.

What wasn't I clear on? I think every one of my statements was clear. Yours about environuts in the 1800s was not, as you yourself admitted.

quote: Yet you continue to argue...

I'm not the one who said I wouldn't anymore. You did. You liar you.

	21-06-2002 19:14									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I have to agree with Fez on one point. He is more clear than anybody else on these boards. He clearly states his ultra-conservative views. You can accuse him of being evil, greedy, immoral, incompetent, wrong, etc, but you can't say he isn't clear about his points.

He may have clear beliefs, but in this instance he didn't state something clearly, and then accused me of not stating something clearly. That was not the case.

Fez:

Stop being such a whiney brat. Just because people disagree with your opinions doesn't mean they are insulting you. Just because someone considers your beliefs ultraconservative and you do not doesn't make it an insult. If you're going to post your opinions, prepare to defend them. Don't complain when people comment on them. Grow up.