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Lincoln
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By William Marshall:
Based on the recent ruling of the Federal 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, the Declaration of Independence, signed July 4, 1776, is Unconstitutional, even though it is the very foundation document on which the United States exists. You see, the Declaration of Independence refers to God in the most respectful terms, without doubt declaring this new nation to have emerged under the authority and entitlement of none other than God. I quote various sections of the document.
"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them..."
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,..."
"We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, ..."
"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."
No matter what sentimental value we may place upon it, we must recognize that the Declaration of Independence contains grossly offensive language and is in clear, self-evident violation of the First Amendment to the Constitution which reads in part:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."
Of course, the Declaration does not "establish" or recognize any sectarian religion in particular (which considerable evidence shows is what the framers of the First Amendment meant), but it obviously shows religious overtones even when the author, in a rather sneaky way, tried to hide his religious references by using alternate words to refer to God. It certainly meets the 9th Circuit's test of the "endorsement of religion," as did the phrase "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance which the Court found to be equivalent to "establishment."
No right-thinking American should tolerate the inclusion of these words on public display, and in no case should they ever be allowed to be uttered in any public forum or government subsidized school. Every day that facsimilies of this document are allowed to be displayed or read in state institutions increases the chances that someone may be offended. Displays of the "Declaration" should be removed from all public buildings. Indeed, the document must be abolished or amended to erase any religious implications if we are to be the nation that the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals wants us to be.
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I think Mr Marshall is being sarcastic, or is their truth in what he said?
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Lincoln
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This is the best way I know of to celebrate the 4th of July until 1 o'clock when we get to eat.
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Lincoln
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Sorry I said "not anymore" in case anyone was wondering.
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Lincoln
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"embracing tolerance of belief"...
That's too long. You need to try something shorter. Like maybe "one nation without God" or something like that.
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DinoDoc
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AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:20
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Removed.
Last edited by DinoDoc on 04-07-2002 at 22:06
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Lincoln
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The Declaration is the foundation upon which this nation stands. That is why today is a national holiday. The fact is the great majority of the founders were theists and they formed the laws from that basis. In order to change the foundation it is necessary to have a revolution. It does little good to ignore history.
This thread is not about the pledge, by the way.
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Lincoln
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I was talking to Sava. He wanted to argue over the wording in the pledge. I think we did that before...
There is a relevance though, but I would like to discuss the Declaration and if it is in fact unconstitutional to have it read in school when the poor atheist kids might have to hear the dreaded 'G' word.
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Lincoln
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The foundation was laid long before the constitution was written. It is based upon the reasoning of men such as John Locke.
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Darkworld Ark
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of the Capitalists
May 2002
time: 05:20
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I wouldn't be amazed if the 9th Circuit did declare the Decloration unconstitutional, they'll declare anythiong unconstitutional, in fact, just last week they found my foot unconstitutional, now I've got this pirate peg-leg.
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Lincoln
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Excerpt from John Locke:
Lastly, those are not at all to be tolerated who deny the being of a God. Promises, covenants, and oaths, which are the bonds of human society, can have no hold upon an atheist. The taking away of God, though but even in thought, dissolves all; besides also, those that by their atheism undermine and destroy all religion, can have no pretence of religion whereupon to challenge the privilege of a toleration.
As for other practical opinions, though not absolutely free from all error, if they do not tend to establish domination over others, or civil impunity to the Church in which they are taught, there can be no reason why they should not be tolerated.
Letter Concerning Toleration, 1689
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Pythagoras
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Charlottesville VA
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Lincoln
The Declaration is the foundation upon which this nation stands. That is why today is a national holiday. The fact is the great majority of the founders were theists and they formed the laws from that basis. In order to change the foundation it is necessary to have a revolution. It does little good to ignore history.
This thread is not about the pledge, by the way. |
I dont care if 30% of them were islamic or if they were all atheists, or if they followed Belzor the Pizza God. The point is that little kids should not BE FORCED in a school that THE GOV'T REQUIRES THEM TO ATTEND to state a belief that the nation is founded under God, Ala, under a Godless Sky, Vishu, Barfo the Hamburger God, Ronald Macndonald the Hamburger Antichrist, Isus, that cow thing in "Ten Commandments", or anyone. The 1st ammendment exists solely independent of the popular religion of America. (or so I thought before that sellout in cali. gave into public pressure)
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Lincoln
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No one is forced to believe in God, nor are they forced to imply that they believe in God. In fact, they are not forced to even say the pledge. In fact they are not even forced to say the words "under God" even if they do decide to say the pledge.
The pledge itself, as it is written, does however tell the truth that the nation is in fact "under God" as the writings and the laws of the founders prove both before and after the constitution. Theism was a part of the foundation of the republic. Why would you want the kids to pretend that it wasn't? Are you afraid that the mere mention of the word 'God' would force a conversion?
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Lincoln
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I am just trying to prevent people from ignoring the foundation of this republic by pretending that the word "God" is unconstitutional. I lived in Thailand for 5 months and I did not feel forced to accept Budahism. It is a fact however that Thailand is a Budahist nation. It is also a fact that the United States was founded on the precepts of the Christian religion with the guarantee of freedom of worship for all. That just happens to be a fact. If you read the article from John Locke that I referrenced you will see that he agrees that religion should not be forced on anyone, but theism forms the basis of our laws.
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04-07-2002 20:19
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