07-08-2002 02:23									#31
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

except for that about giving false CVs. I wouldnt recomend that

	07-08-2002 02:39									#32
	Re: Re: What Does It Take To Get A Job? Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by moomin It's difficult to tell, but here are a couple of things you should be doing unless you are already - take this form someone who sits on the other side of that interview table 2-3 times a month. 1) Is your Corporate Bullsh!tese up to scratch? No, really - it's not that anybody believes that you or they actually think anything you say in this mode, but it will show a) you're willing to play the game, and understand the rules and b) gives a fair bit of info on your actual abilities otherwise. A consumate CB:er will probably fit right in with the other important corporate decision processes: spin doctoring, blame shifting and backstabbing.A jerk who can't even get the simple protocol of "I'm interested in furthering myself in this field by meeting new challanges while applying my abilities to the benefit of this company" right will not be an asset to the group when the next round of cuts begin.

so f****** true

That is why capitalism sucks

life is a stage - and we are all the actors, :-/

oh I am ready for the jungle - I mean to go and live somewhere outside of this civilisation.

	07-08-2002 02:49									#33
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Listen to MikeH. I had three different resumes, and every cover letter was customized for the specific company. I am never out of work long. I got an interview out of every 2 or 3 resumes sent. (of course, I haven't looked since the economy tanked.)

Moomin, comes in a close second. But I'd still wear the suit. The trick is to look like you belong in it, even if you won't be wearing it on the job. It shows you have confidence and could be manager or better material later.

	07-08-2002 02:52									#34
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

actors or not actors. fook them all. just do your job well, take no sh!t from noone and that's that.

	07-08-2002 03:06									#35
	Tired of ads?

And be careful if you take an entry level position to prove yourself. Most decent sized companies, (in the US) do increases as a percentage of you current salary.
10% of nothing is nothing. And 5% of a lot is sweet. It's almost impossible to get it up where it usually belongs. If you're going to go that route, you'll probably have to change companies once you're experienced. The exception is if you intern. It's a trial for both sides. Make them start you at a decent salary if the decide to make you permanent.

	07-08-2002 03:22									#36
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by rah Listen to MikeH. I had three different resumes, and every cover letter was customized for the specific company. I am never out of work long. I got an interview out of every 2 or 3 resumes sent. (of course, I haven't looked since the economy tanked.)

What do you think I do...I am well versed on this kind of stuff too, tweaked CVs (although they are all pretty much the same kind of area of job so this isn't a big issue) and the covering letters are written for each, well maybe using paragrahs from previously written covering letters at templates. Most of the applications I have made are via application form which require statements, but these are tailored to the specific job...so still twiddling my thumbs...

	07-08-2002 03:31									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Tried the ones I mentioned?

	07-08-2002 03:37									#38
	Remove this text

It's not finding the places to apply so much, there seem to be enough around to keep me busy...for the time being I am going to go for something a bit more 'down to earth' and then think about stuff like emigrating

	07-08-2002 03:40									#39
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I am certain it is in being good looking. Sorry, Rich

	07-08-2002 03:42									#40
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Well prepare yourself for a life of unemployment Andy

	07-08-2002 03:44									#41
	Got spare money?

The have lots of good books about writing a good resume and improving your interviewing skills. Maybe a stop at your local library would be time well spent.

	07-08-2002 03:52									#42
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Don't emigrate - sell their stuff in UK, for example. Fermentas' clients are unis and research labs, and only someone who knows his sh!t can even attempt a sale. Biotechna is another matter, tho.

	07-08-2002 03:54									#43
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I really feel ambivalent about sales, at least at this point in my life...I'd rather have something that is a bit more 'hands on' at the moment...

	07-08-2002 03:55									#44
	Get a bigger avatar today!

There isn't much I can add to the advice above...

Don't forget to list and mention (if they ask) any extra curricilar activities (volunteering, organizing, studies etc...). In fact, try to get involved in some volunteer project. Helping to organize one is even better for your CV. It shows you have initiative and organizing skills. Plus it's a great way to find new contacts.

	07-08-2002 03:56									#45
	Support Apolyton

Just being nice. It's not that this city is devoid of people willing to drink beer with me or smth

	07-08-2002 03:57									#46
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

You could always move to Lithu and get a cushy job with Vemco or work for Saras as a nanny.



Are you following up your applications with phone calls?

	07-08-2002 03:59									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

He doesn't know jack 'bout electronic engineering. And I don't fancy a midget nanny

	07-08-2002 03:59									#48
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Following up my application with phonecalls? I have definitely never come across that being a standard practice before...

	07-08-2002 04:14									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison ...standard practice before...

very standard here, but so is tipping the barkeep, so... ??? anyone from the empire know?

(our nanny is hot - )

	07-08-2002 04:18									#50
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

our nanny is hot?

	07-08-2002 04:19									#51
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

their nanny is hot, paiktis.

	07-08-2002 04:20									#52
	Increase Your PM Length

Well, my wife is hotter

	07-08-2002 04:20									#53
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

My right hand is the hottest

	07-08-2002 04:22									#54
	Tired of ads?

That cannot be verified independently

	07-08-2002 04:26									#55
	Tired of ads?

Wanna bet?

Attachment: picture 037.jpg
This has been downloaded 98 time(s).

	07-08-2002 04:29									#56
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Print THIS on your resume

	07-08-2002 04:29									#57
	Support Apolyton

LoL @ PH (edit)

quote: Originally posted by Saras Well, my wife is hotter

well, yeah... but she's family so that doesn't count!


PH if you were hot you could get a job as a nanny, but that prolly doesn't help you much.

Forza Hull

	07-08-2002 15:04									#58
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by rah I got an interview out of every 2 or 3 resumes sent. (of course, I haven't looked since the economy tanked.)

Definitely a different world now. When i first moved to HK the economy was booming and I landed a job 36 hours after I got off the plane. With the economy in the dumps, I haven't found anything after six months of searching.

The worst thing is sending off resumes, doing follow-up calls and then not even getting an interview.

Luckily, I can do freelance work to pay the bills. Otherwise I'd be really screwed.

	07-08-2002 15:28									#59
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by OneFootInTheGrave You overclocker what do you do by the way, have any jobs down there in Reading

I'm a Lotus Domino Developer.

There are loads and loads of IT jobs in Reading. All the major US companies have UK or European HQs here. Oracle, MicroShaft, Sun + all the coms companies like WorldCom, Energis etc. Only problem is that a lot of the US based firms have recruitment freezes because the US bits aren't doing very well even though the UK/European arms are still doing well.

And there are a lot of support companies for them and smaller IT firms, I work for a very small one.

There are also a load of Insurance companies here, main one being Prudential.

'cause there are a lot of mid-high income youngish people around here there's also a high demand for service workers.

You can still get a job in a couple of days if you really want one, couple of weeks if you want something specific. Only unemployed people I know down here these days are students or people who want to be. Used to be a lot harder to find jobs.

Of course that's why the cost of living is so high.

	07-08-2002 15:45									#60
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison What do you think I do...I am well versed on this kind of stuff too, tweaked CVs (although they are all pretty much the same kind of area of job so this isn't a big issue) and the covering letters are written for each, well maybe using paragrahs from previously written covering letters at templates. Most of the applications I have made are via application form which require statements, but these are tailored to the specific job...so still twiddling my thumbs...

Well something must be going wrong. 1 interview per 12 to 25 applications shows that they are dismissing your CV/application too often for some reason.

We've been building a database for managing job applications for the last year or so, I've had a lot of exposure to the people who are doing the hiring to make sure the system will work for them.

Before we put our system in to make it more intelligent they basically get a big stack of CVs and glance through them throwing a load of them onto a reject pile based on anything from qualifications to it looking badly produced or unprofessional. You need to make sure that your CV doesn't get onto that auto reject pile and then once you pass that hurdle make sure that it is one of the ones they look at for an early interview. Which means your CV has to be good enough to stand out above 80% of the other CVs out there.

When I was applying I was lucky enough to be able to ask a friend of my mothers who works in the industry and does some recruitment to look over my CV and suggest changes which was very useful. Plus I found out from them exactly what they were looking for in candidates and worked on putting that across in interviews.

If you don't know anyone like that (anyone from uni courses gone into the industry that might be able to help?) you could try contacting someone at one of the companies and see if they'd help? It can't hurt and at you have a chance of making a contact and they'd see you were keen and proactive.

Before interviews I'd write out a page of questions about the company. Use as many as possible in suitable situations in the interview, and add ones if something came up in the interview. I approached the interview with the attitude that I knew they'd want me once they'd seen me (in a self confident way not in an arrogant way) and I needed to find out if the company was right for me. The more you ask them questions the more they are answering and the less they can ask you.