25-09-2002 13:50									#1
	The Apolytonian Republican Front (ARF) Get a bigger avatar today!

The time has come to begin the push to rid ourselves of the dreaded monarch and the petty nobility that follow him! It is time to end this putrid system of fealty to our supposed "lord and protector"!



For indeed, the monarch's claim to rule by the divine right of the Great Banana is FALSE! The Great Banana, in its infinite wisdom, has provided its blessing to all the citizens of Apolytonia and does not favor this one, this vile usurper, who would have us call him "king"!



Indeed, while Apolytonia has been a liberty-loving society from its very inception, it has unfortunately fallen to the siren's song of monarchism - a false truth which must now be expunged! For, as a recently assimilated American-Apolytonian has come to argue:



"The right to freedom being the gift of [the Great Banana], it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave."
--Samuel Adams



Indeed, we should not allow ourselves to voluntarily continue to be as slaves to this monarchic system. It is an intollerable afront to the native spirit of liberty which has long guided and protected our people!



Rather, we should embrace the TRUTH! The truth, given to us by the Great Banana, that the PEOPLE of Apolytonia are SOVEREIGN themselves, requiring no monarch to be sovereign for them!



The people of Apolytonia demand to be CITIZENS, not SUBJECTS! They demand the enshrinement of this principle in the formation a grand APOLYTONIAN REPUBLIC! Such a wondrous republic would have leaders who recognize the truth of POPULAR SOVEREIGNTY rather than the BLASPHEMOUS LIE of the "divine right" of kings! Though they would rule, they would do so at the behest of the people!



There are those who would claim that we should retain our monarch, that the prize may not be worth it, that they find some sick form of virtue in monarchism, or simply that they are cowards! Another assimilated American-Apolytonian provides them with the answer:

"What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty Great Banana! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!"



Should you need any more evidence of the sickness that has befallen Apolytonia due to this vile monarchy, see the report of the kingdom's own ministry of economics!

http://www.apolyton.com/forums/show...?threadid=62810

This corruption wll undoubtedly only grow worse if this wretched monarchy is allowed to continue!



For those that wish to band together, to begin the long struggle for our republic, now is the time to begin! The formation of this, the Apolytonian Republican Front (ARF), is but the vanguard for the larger struggle to come! Loyal republicans (small r, of course ) of all walks of life are free to join this cause, to join this struggle! Liberty is not free and the joint efforts of many will be needed if we are to succeed!

	25-09-2002 13:54									#2
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[/roleplay]

That was the most thoroughly enjoyable post to write I've done since I got here I was chuckling through much of it (especially when I interjected "Almighty Great Banana" in for "Almighty God" in Patrick Henry's quotation... it just turns the sheer passion of the line into something that can be VERY funny ).

	25-09-2002 14:53									#3
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I call upon the construction of Gallows immediately to deal with these "revolutionaries" who dare defy our King and threaten the security of our nation in a time of war. These "republicans" preach anarchy and greed driven by their own selfish desires of Power and Riches. Anyone who dares supports these petty peasants must be eliminated both swiftly and severely. We risk the disintergration of the Apolytonian Empire and our way of life if we allow these people to come to power after Our Great Nation has been at War, this concept of Self Rule will weary our people and bring with it certain DOOM.

To the gallows with these Heretics.

	25-09-2002 15:18									#4
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It is with heavy heart that I must now go to our rightful ruler, OPD, with news of this (b)ARF.

And from my own province!

Arnelos, when you return to the home that OPD granted me to give to you, you will find it in ashes. Such talk will not be tolerated in Pina Colada as it is a detriment to the Empire's war effort in Persia.

Ask not what the Banana can do for me, ask what I can do for the Banana!

	25-09-2002 17:06									#5
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Well I'm glad I abdicated before this happened when I was King.

	25-09-2002 17:53									#6
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SHORTEN YOUR KING WITH THE NEW GUILLOTINE Mark 1 !

IT MAKES WORK FAST AND EASY !

MORE AESTHETIC THAN GALLOWS, ITS SOBER STYLE IS WELL ADAPTED TO ANY ARCHITECTURAL SURROUNDING


Delivered with 1 spare blade to allow maintenance without interrupting the service.

	25-09-2002 18:01									#7
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Comes with a 5 Monarch guarantee...

	25-09-2002 18:06									#8
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quote: Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt Well I'm glad I abdicated before this happened when I was King.

I seriously doubt this will gain much momentum as the instant war weariness would reduce virtually ALL our cities to 1 shield and 1 commerce per turn. At that point the advocators of the Revolution would probably be banned from the Democracy game.

	25-09-2002 18:21									#9
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[roleplay]

I have, at no point, actually resided in Pina Colada province. Given this, the loss of a home I never occupied is of little loss, though it is sorrowful that I was unable to enjoy residing in it before it was destroyed.

Such are the burdens of the committed revolutionary, but they are burders I gladly bear. They are burders that all of us in the republican movement gladly bear, for we bear them for the Apolytonian people and in righteous defense of the true worship of the Great Banana.

The accusation by the vile monarchist that we in the republican movement wish nothing but power for ourselves is obviously a falsehood. You see, this being a *republican* revolution, sovereign power will be completely taken from the existing leadership of the state (likely through a process involving a guillotine) and vested in the people themselves. We do not wish sovereign power for ourselves, for our most sincere wish is but to remove it from the monarchists, not to have it for ourselves.

That the people, thankful for their newfound freedom, might be greatful enough toward the leaders of this transformation to delegate to them the powers of the state, as in any republic, would be but a potential perk for the successful revolutionary. There remains much struggle between these early days in the conflict and that hour when success will be ours.

But we know that the Great Banana is with us in this struggle. We are sure of the righteousness of our path. For the Great Banana, in its infinite wisdom, has bestowed its providence upon the whole of the people. Those few, the "monarchists", who claim that the Great Banana only provides the right to rule for them are blasphemers, afronts to the very worship of the Great Banana!

It is thus that the Great Banana is surely filled with righteous anger at these monarchist blasphers. They can only hope that before their unpleasant ends, they beg the Great Banana for forgiveness and hope beyond hope that the Great Banana may yet choose to show them mercy.

So all praise the Great Banana! For the Great Banana shows us the way through the dense jungle and brings us to paradise, a paradise of bananacopia. We praise the Great Banana, who in righteous anger, will aid us in defeating the enemies of the one true faith.

[/roleplay]

Hey, I figure with our civilization being religious and in the process of researching theology, the intellectuals (generally the group responsible for beginning the first stirrings of any revolution...) are especially focused on religion as well as republicanism right now - which would account for them justifying republicanism in religious terms.

	25-09-2002 18:27									#10
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb I seriously doubt this will gain much momentum as the instant war weariness would reduce virtually ALL our cities to 1 shield and 1 commerce per turn. At that point the advocators of the Revolution would probably be banned from the Democracy game.

Actually, I think it's rather clear that what's going on here is the start if a republican agitation movement... which would likely come to fruition at the close of the war. This makes sense, of course, as many a revolution has come at the close of a long war in which the populace bore many burdens.

Generally, a period of agitation must take place for quite some time before a revolution actually occurs and before it actually succeeds. We're just beginning the process here as a role-playing exercise .

In non-roleplaying terms, obviously no-one who has seriously evaluated our strategic situation in non-ideological terms wants to switch to republic until the war is over. That being said, part of the point here is that we *should* switch to republic as soon as it is.

	25-09-2002 18:35									#11
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[roleplay]

Although I share those republican feelings, and because I share them, my friends and me cannot accept for long that the state be more or less subordinated to any church. I tell you that the first thing we will do after the people has gained his freedom, is to DEMAND that the Great Banana leaves the Republic alone ; we want that the religion be separated from the state. This separation will be remembered as the Banana split.

[/roleplay]

	25-09-2002 18:42									#12
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quote: Originally posted by DAVOUT [roleplay] we want that the religion be separated from the state. This separation will be remembered as the Banana split. [/roleplay]

	25-09-2002 18:54									#13
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[roleplay]

DAVOUT,

If the banana split is taken too far, we risk an eventual Thermidorean reaction. However, such matters can be worked out between the republican banana-spliters and the republican banana-lovers after the more critical task of toppling the ancien regime is complete. Until then, we must remain focused on the fact that we are all good republicans and the monarchists are our common foe.

[/roleplay]

	25-09-2002 18:56									#14
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[roleplay]

When I visited the beautiful land of Germany while I was attending Berlin University, I was deeply moved by a speech given by a scholar by the name of Karl Marx... He proposes a such radical political system in which the worker class unite and dispose of ruler class and create a anarchy like state in which no one rules over us. How strange... I wonder if this ideal sytem will ever work in apolytonia...."
[/roleplay]

Go Democracy!~ Skip Republic.

	25-09-2002 19:10									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Calc II [roleplay] ... I wonder if this ideal sytem will ever work in apolytonia...." [/roleplay]

I wonder if that "ideal" system will ever work anywhere...

	25-09-2002 19:35									#16
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[roleplay]

We are in total agreement, and we remain focused on the fact that our common foe, the Monarchists, will leave an immense wealth ; we have to be extremely careful on the choice of the honorable and wise citizens whom will be entrusted with this wealth. As they are certainly in limited number, it cannot be excluded that the same reliable persons will be required to take care also of the treasures of the Great Banana, and we must provide them with a reasonnable time between the two steps for protecting national properties.

Vive la République !

[/quote]

	25-09-2002 20:16									#17
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hmmm, we have Republicans now... and apparenlt people who prefer to wait for Democracy, who can be called Democrats?

Republicans and Democracts have invaded our game!

whatever happened to the old parties of Warmongeres and PeaceBuilders?

Apolyton has lost it's way.


although republic looks good, we are awfully close to Democracy

however, we have the religious advantage of only losing one turn.

Soyeah, republic is looking good.

[roleplay] and we will forever be rid of tyranny![/roleplay]

	25-09-2002 20:30									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Arnelos In non-roleplaying terms, obviously no-one who has seriously evaluated our strategic situation in non-ideological terms wants to switch to republic until the war is over. That being said, part of the point here is that we *should* switch to republic as soon as it is.

Don't forget that Civ3 tracks war weariness for several turns and switching to Republic immediately after the war will still use the previous turns of war for computation of war weariness.

It might be wise to wait a bit for the War Weariness to work out of the formula before switching to Republic/Democracy.

However, for roleplay purposes we should have a few battles between the opposing forces before we switch.

I see the following groups: Monarchists, Republicans(support Republic, not the Capitalist Party of the US), Democrats(support Democracy, not the Socialist Party of the US), and Tyrants (want to go back to Despotism). If we can get people to state which group they wish to be in, we can have a few mock conflicts to add to our history.

	26-09-2002 03:56									#19
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As Lord Protector of El Nino Province I oppose this movement. These rebels will only bring strife and misery to our provinces.

PM me if you want to start a Royalist Legue.

	26-09-2002 03:58									#20
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quote: Originally posted by =OttomusCeasar= Republicans(support Republic, not the Capitalist Party of the US)

You see, this is why I made sure to make a parenthetical statement when referring to republicans, making sure people knew I meant republicans, small r

	26-09-2002 04:36									#21
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Is this an official new party?

	26-09-2002 06:06									#22
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no.. its not

[roleplay]
religion will never be seperate from our govt' nor will any aspect of our lives! go our religious zealots! go our religious crusade agst Persia!
[/roleplay]

	26-09-2002 06:10									#23
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It is a front for various independent parties and groups committed to the change to republican governance. Recognizing that many forces favor a switch to republic, a front is established in which all of them may gather their forces to contribute to this effort.

As with most such organizations, it likely will not survive its own success, the myriad groups which combined to bring about the change in regime splitting back to their independent and opposing positions once the previous regime has fallen.

However, for now, we can be united in this front, this opposition to the monarchy.

(in short, no - not really )

	26-09-2002 06:26									#24
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roleplay

A truly strong Apolyton requires what has been called Democracy *and* the seperation of church and state! And freedom! Freedom of, speech! All Apolytonians should be able to state whatever they want without fear of retribution!

Praise the (God you worship if any)!

no roleplay

Republic is not an option until we stop the war. Yeah, I want it for real, but I hate war weariness.

I think in CivIV there should be an option in Republic and Demo to spend any large amount of money to brainwash the public and thus significantly lessen war weariness.

	26-09-2002 07:14									#25
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Uhm... spending large ammounts of money to reduce freedoms and liberties?

wouldn't that just be monarchy, with a title change?

after all... making less overall money, and your people can't complain.

	26-09-2002 08:02									#26
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Not, necessarily...

I think what mrmitchell is getting at is "bread and circuses"

	26-09-2002 08:13									#27
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[OUT of roleplay for a moment here...]

Ok, given the recent poll by Duddha, obviously I need to explain this a bit further...

The ARF is *NOT* an electoral party and likely will not be putting up candidates for elections and participating greatly in electoral politics. Therefore, it does not exist in the same manner as the DIA or the Hawks (or that pointless little party known as the "ARE"... ). Rather, it is a single-issue advocacy group dedicated *solely* to changing the government to a republic. Once that goal is met, the ARF will no longer have its issue and will likely disband (unless it continues in the role of "Guardians of the Revolution" or other such fun ).

Members of ALL parties (and definately independents) are welcome to align themselves with the ARF in pursuit of a republican form of government. They can disagree on every other major issue before the people of Apolytonia, but *all* would agree on switching to Republic (even if that's the ONLY thing some of them agree on ).

I think that clears up the issue.

[roleplay]

Thank you, and may we soon have an end to this wretched monarchy!

[/roleplay]

	26-09-2002 10:05									#28
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quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell roleplay A truly strong Apolyton requires what has been called Democracy *and* the seperation of church and state! And freedom! Freedom of, speech! All Apolytonians should be able to state whatever they want without fear of retribution! Praise the (God you worship if any)! no roleplay

So, praise be thy Alf, the one and only true god

EDIT: just noticed. Alf is god

Arf is the name of the party

(chuckle)

	26-09-2002 23:46									#29
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Yes, I would be a part of this group, of course we need to wait until the war with Persia is done.

	27-09-2002 00:27									#30
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CITIZENS OF OUR FAIR LAND!:

OUR STRUGGLE TOWARDS FREEDOM MUST NOT BE DERAILED BY COUNTERREVOLUTIONARIES AND REACTIONARIES! WE MUST CALL FOR A NEW BREATH OF FREEDOM FOR OUR LAND, FREEDOM FROM LAZY LORDS THAT ABUSE OUR PEASANTRY, WHICH DIES DAILY FOR OUR GLORIOUS NATION! END THE FEUDAL DICTATORSHIP THAT SHACKLES OUR PEOPLE AND LOWERS THEIR ECONOMIC POTENTIAL!

DEATH TO THE KING! LONG LIVE THE REVOLUTION! LONG LIVE THE REPUBLIC!




GENTLEMEN!

A DANGEROUS NEW GROUP ARISES! THEY SEEK NOTHING BUT CHAOS AND VIOLENCE! THEY WOULD PLUNGE OUR FAIR KINGDOM INTO CRISIS AT THIS TIME OF NEED! YOUR NOBLE BROTHERS FACE VALIANT STRUGGLE WHILE THESE MONEY-GRUBBERS INSULT THE GLORY OF THE LORD AND HIS MIGHTY VASSAL OUR KING! WE MUST STOP THEM! WE MUST WIPE THIS SCUM BEFORE IT SEEKS TO DESTROY THE SOCIAL ORDER- TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE, ENOBLE THE MOB.

DEATH TO THE REPUBLICANS! LONG LIVE THE KING!