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MichaeltheGreat
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Apolyton Grand Executioner
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mooning the house that Ruth built.
Oct 1999
time: 21:22
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Frogger - LMAO, but I don't quite count Zylka when not on his meds. 
Gatekeeper - I wouldn't go quite that far, but...
There's a few interesting things going on, IMO.
In the present atmosphere, you can't make even legit criticisms of the administration without being branded as doing anything from politicizing the "war" or better yet, "the safety of the American people", to being outright unpatriotic.
The present crew in the national security apparatus doesn't compare at all well to Bush Sr.'s or Reagan's bunch. So far, I haven't seen anything redeeming about Rice, (especially compared to Scowcroft) Powell / Baker is a tossup, although Powell's not in the inner circle like Baker was.
Myers as Chairman of the JCS is out of his element - he's an ex-fighter jock, and an Air Defense Command / Space Command guy, perfect for missile defense, no experience in ground combat at all. Powell was a political general, but he was also an infantryman, and former NSA under Reagan. Service chiefs are more or less out of the advisory loop, unless brought in by the SecDef or Chairman of JCS. Back in Gulf I, we had Carl Vuono, a solid combat soldier with both combat and political commands, who went up the promotion ladder the old fashioned way. Now, we have Eric Shinseki, a political favorite of Clinton, who went from being a two-star division commander to a four-star awaiting his slot as Chief of Staff in only a couple of years. He's young, looking at a chance to replace Myers when Myers retires, and Shinseki isn't a boatrocker.
Tommy Franks is probably as capable a theater commander as Schwarzkopf, but he's got some problems - he's an old style no **** soldier in an era of managers, and he doesn't speak the same language as Myers - grunts just don't talk to airedales and vice-versa. Franks and Shinseki are not likely to be a very communicative combo, they've never had any real working relationship, and theater commanders never deal much with individual service chiefs.
The real kicker here is that Bush can't go thump Saddam's ass, *and* maintain an occupying force in Iraq, *and* keep troops indefinitely committed in Afghanistan, *and* keep up the tempo of SOCOM operations in Somalia, east Africa, the Philipines, and elsewhere. And then be ready for the next threat...
The Army and Marines just aren't big enough to be everywhere they might be sent for as long as they're needed, without stretching things dangerously thin somewhere. A good measure of thanks to Clinton for that, but blaming Clinton is so passé, and the failures on the logistics side go back to Reagan and Bush Sr. as well.
The defense budget has already been increased, but the grand pet prize of missile defense can't be sacrificed (still more money to be spent), so if anyone starts talking about unsexy things like reopening bases we just closed, and spinning up four or five new divisions, (lots more money, and years before they're ready) they're likely to be locked up in a looney bin, but that's what it would take at a minimum to accomplish Bush's statement (I wouldn't glorify it as "doctrine" since there's not yet any means to carry it out ) that the US will act preemptively all over the world.
IMO, Bush doesn't really want war - getting Saddam to back down would be the prize, (especially before the election), but improving control of the Congress would do nicely, too. Lose it, and Bush is screwed, gain it, and he has time to try to figure out some semblance of a real plan for Iraq. It's not a question of kicking the IRG's ass and winning the war, it's a question of WTF do you do with the place afterwards, and how much of a manpower drain does that impose there?
That's why I think Bush just wants to fight a war of words until November, with his proxies being the hardasses, and Bush coming out as the voice of statesmanship, blah blah - remember Agnew and the "new" Nixon? We just have a bunch of bit players taking the role of the big bad Greek.
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Ethelred
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Latest news 33 pounds has somehow gone on serious diet.
Try 5 OUNCES.
Link to Reuters article
http://www.reuters.com/news_article.jhtml;jsessionid=3OY1BI5MHSIZECRBAEKSFFA?type=topnews&StoryID=1510453
Sample
quote:
DIYARBAKIR (Reuters) - A Turkish police official said on Sunday the amount of uranium recently seized by officers was around 5 ounces and did not weigh 33 lbs as initially reported. |
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Jon Miller
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more beleivable
but shows the lack of knowledge that Turkey has
Jon Miller
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Ethelred
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I think it was more a matter of the police involved simply weighing the package, something is probably routine. Opening the thing isn't something any but the most foolish cop would do, I hope.
I think the reporting was lacking as well. Didn't anyone think to ask some simple questions. Like how much does the whole thing weigh and why did someone say Eastern Europe for a source when the labeling said West Germany. In English at that.
I took another look at the article. The suspects have been released pending trial. Such desperadoes.
quote:
Dilek also said police charged the two men in connection with the case but released them pending trial.
"These people said they believe that what was given to them was medical material," he said, adding police were now looking for two other suspects.
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Ethelred
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The metric mass is also mentioned in the article that I linked to, it says 100 grams towards to end, but thats less than 5 ounces. Kind of odd how European news agency like Reuters lead off with ounces instead of metric weights.
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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:22
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Black Dragon, 20%-25% of the Turkish population is Kurdish (according to the government, Mountain Turks). They have been part of the Turkish and Ottoman states for a long time, so the fact that there are numbers of Kurds in the Western industrialized cities is neither surprising nor eveidence that Turkey was not oppressing them. Up until a few years ago, the Kurdish language was outlawed, Kurds were not allowed to use their own names, but were assigned Turkish names (this may still be the case).
In the past two decades some, 25,000 Kurds have been killed by the governmet, 2,000 villages destroyed, toture and extrajudical executions is widespread in the Kurdish areas, there is massive forced relocation, and so on. The guerilla war was a response to the condistions under which the Kurdish people were forced to live, and the government responded by punishing the people (much like Israel punishes the Palestinian people for the actions of a few).
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GePap
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of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:22
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MtG:
great post about W's security team: well opinionated and informative.
I also agree that Bush is milking the situation for political capitol: He says the dems don't care about national security, and when the dems go ballistic, rightly, the republican say that they are politicizing the war!
I do disagree though on your call on the war: Bush wants war, he wants it badly, he wants it now. You can just feel how badly he wants this when he talks about Saddam's attept at his dad. I agree that the Army can't just do it all, which is why i think either all those SOCOM operations are just for press show, or, more likely, the admin. will do a halfass job in Iraq post Saddam, which is why they don't approach that subject at all: The most i have heard is that they want a democratic Iraq- they never stop to outline how they will do it. Just recently, Rummie says that it would be best if Udday didn't follow daddy... Not sh1t sherlock! Why does this statement even have to be made?
Ohh, and again, not surprised to see the amounts of the material drop sharply: Just simple press hysteria, and an overeager report to boost a policy.
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GePap
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of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
You my friend are a leftist and trying to degrade me won't work. Your own argument does not make sense. If these people were really brave they would go out their and fight Israeli soliders and not blow themselves up in cafes. |
Thank you for calling me a leftist -I am one, proud to be so, and far more capable of holding my own in a rational debate that you have ever shown the ability in these board to.
The wanted individual was in a home, obviously the israelis knew which. He was there with his immidate family and an aide. Around this house was a civilian neighborhood- with people living in their own homes, their property ( i though rightwingers like yourself belive in the sanctiy of private property, in the right of people to live as they wish in their own homes. I may be wrong about you in that respect). The brave Israelis came wih an F-16 ad dropped a 2000Lb bomb on the two story building to make sure they killed everyone in it: and in the process killed and injured dozens in all the private homes nearby. How brave of them..
Yeah, it cowardly to kill people, kids, in caffee's by killing yourself in the process. it is far more brave to kill people in their own homes with long-distance weapons: that the way of the warrior!
I won't defend suicide bombers, but no one, except someone as simple minded and shallow as yourself, can defend the israeli action either.
Oh, by the way, extremely fitting Avatar: one idiot deserves another
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Dr Strangelove
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Uhhhhh, guys. The article on the seizure of the uranium by the Turkish police posted on Yahoo claims that it was only 5 ounces.
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Ethelred
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
You my friend are a leftist and trying to degrade me won't work. Your own argument does not make sense. If these people were really brave they would go out their and fight Israeli soliders and not blow themselves up in cafes. |
They were sleeping in their own homes when they were killed. They were harming no one. They weren't protecting anyone either. They lived there and they were killed there because the Israelis wanted to kill one person.
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Ethelred
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
Uhhhhh, guys. The article on the seizure of the uranium by the Turkish police posted on Yahoo claims that it was only 5 ounces. |
Catch up. I posted that allready.
I still want to know this. Five ounces of what? Is really uranium? Is it really mostly U235? Why did someone claim it was bomb grade before testing? I understand the weight. Confusion can do that. I don't understand the Eastern Europe claim considering the thing is labeled W. Germany.
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Ethelred
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
I am sorry but I am pro-Israeli, gepap and everybody else. There is nothing you can do about that. I just don't want to side with terrorists.
And you insulting my avatar does nothing to deter me. |
There is a diference between supporting the existence of Israel and supporting the bombing of civilians. That is remarkably similar to bombing a pizza shop. In fact the only difference I can see is the fools bombing the shops kill themselves in the process. Risking your life is one thing. Suicide is another. I am not impressed by terminal stupidity.
No one can insult your avatar Fez. Tell the truth about it yes. Insult it no. Its incredibly stupid looking. Its amazing that one image could so encompass the full breadth and depth of stupidity that one does. Its truly a towering achievement in idiocy rarely approached even on American Network television.
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Ethelred
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
I support Israel completely in all of its efforts to preserve its democracy, freedom and dignity.
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I gather that includes supporting atrocities. That is what the intentional bombing of civilians is. A lot of Israelies want that to stop but good ol Fez thinks its OK.
Know thyself.
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Ethelred
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Yep this thread has been Fezzed.
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29-09-2002 12:51
You are an amusement, but your opinion carries no weight with me.
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