05-10-2002 18:08									#1
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Conquistador* (3/2/2) Explorer
Keshik (4/2/2) Knights
Berserk* (6/2/1) Longbowman
Gallic Swordsman (3/2/2) Swordsman
Numidian Mercenary (2/3/1) Spearman
Sipahi (7/3/3) Cavalry
Ansar Warrior (4/2/3) Knight
Hwacha (12/1/1) Cannon

* Spanish Conquistador unit doesn't need gunpowder resource, treat all terrain as roads, and doesn't replace anything. Berserk can launch amphibious attacks.

NOTES: berserk costs 70, Keshik are cheaper then normal knights.
edit: Gallic Swordsman costs 50 shields + Conquistador stats changed
edit2: saw on civfanatics chat log that Numidian Mercenary will cost more then hoplite.

Last edited by kolpo on 09-10-2002 at 13:33

	05-10-2002 18:14									#2
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I doubt between beserk and Sipahi(because calvary is already very good in attack) but beserk is my final choose.

	05-10-2002 19:23									#3
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I heard Conquistador is 3/2/2 treat all terrain as roads replaces explorer

	05-10-2002 19:26									#4
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they all seem pretty powerful, but the Gallic warrior will be invincible in the ancient ages

	05-10-2002 20:36									#5
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quote: Originally posted by jdd2007 they all seem pretty powerful, but the Gallic warrior will be invincible in the ancient ages

i agree, but i still want aphibious attacks in the mideval age

	05-10-2002 21:01									#6
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Damn, it's been a long time since I've been here. I wonder if anyone recognizes me?

Anyway, I figure the Sipahi. Why, do you ask? Well, I've noticed that once cavalry comes in everyone goes on the war path to gain as much territory as possible before riflemen apear and make everything stalemate until tanks arrive. I know the cossacks have given me a massive advantage in this era. It looks like the Sipahi could do the same.

	05-10-2002 21:49									#7
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a unit with attack of 3 and movement of 2 when the most likely defenders have a value of 2: the Gallic swordman will be very difficult to stop, and will still be useful well into medieval times, until gunpowder.

	05-10-2002 23:05									#8
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Is The Banana some kind of god and can it only be built by... the Apolytonians?

	05-10-2002 23:40									#9
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I chose the banana because nothing ever beats the banana.

	06-10-2002 00:34									#10
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quote: Originally posted by GePap a unit with attack of 3 and movement of 2 when the most likely defenders have a value of 2: the Gallic swordman will be very difficult to stop, and will still be useful well into medieval times, until gunpowder.

By the way, I found out from recent Apolyton chat, that Galic Swordsmen cost 50 shields, so it won't be that much game breaking.

	06-10-2002 02:18									#11
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quote: Originally posted by WarpStorm I heard Conquistador is 3/2/2 treat all terrain as roads replaces explorer

I like this version more because it really fits the spanish very well.

The spanish conquistadors where indeed very good in exploring the new world and beating the native tribes and 3 attack is enough to beat down a civ of the tech level the indians where. They can now really play there true rol of fast conquiring primitive tribes in new unpasable continents.

	06-10-2002 03:04									#12
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I can't see why the Gallic Swordsman should have faster movement than regular swordsmen. Btw. what is the movement of the Roman Legion? I think the Legion should be the fastest ancient unit without a horse. Maybe the Gallics could be just as fast moving.

I voted for the Viking Berzerk, because it's attack from a boat is cool and very Viking-like.

	07-10-2002 00:39									#13
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goto civ3.com thee is screenshot of galic being 3/2/2 next screen shot is gallic of 4/2/2........... now which one is final release?

PS I heard keshik repaces longbowman

	07-10-2002 03:05									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Hagbart I can't see why the Gallic Swordsman should have faster movement than regular swordsmen. Btw. what is the movement of the Roman Legion? I think the Legion should be the fastest ancient unit without a horse. Maybe the Gallics could be just as fast moving.

Have you never read Asterix? The MAGIC POTION!!!

	07-10-2002 16:56									#15
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quote: Originally posted by statusperfect Have you never read Asterix? The MAGIC POTION!!!

Yeah the Gallic Swordsman should be replaced with Obelix:
14/12/3 +100% attack vs legions and privateers(pirate ships )+10 bonus hitpoints and needs boar resource +heals when on boar resource. Still maybe too weak for him

	07-10-2002 19:21									#16
	keshiks vs. beserks Full PM-box? Change here!

I voted for the keshiks because at (IIRC) they will be about half the price of the normal knight and treat mountains like roads. But I hadn't heard that the beserk would be able to attack from ships... is that only attacking other ships or are they able to attack land targets? The cost is prohibitive early on, but with an attack strenght of 6, they will be able to hang around much longer and still remain effective. I love the idea of loading a caravel full of those and going on a joy ride.

	07-10-2002 21:03									#17
	Re: keshiks vs. beserks Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by ruby_maser I voted for the keshiks because at (IIRC) they will be about half the price of the normal knight and treat mountains like roads. But I hadn't heard that the beserk would be able to attack from ships... is that only attacking other ships or are they able to attack land targets? The cost is prohibitive early on, but with an attack strenght of 6, they will be able to hang around much longer and still remain effective. I love the idea of loading a caravel full of those and going on a joy ride.

From what I understand can they attack land units/cities directly from ships just like mariners in civ3.

	07-10-2002 21:22									#18
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Just wait for the howling when a viking beserk armed with an axe takes out a tank.

	08-10-2002 01:41									#19
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I voted for the Gallic Swordsman.....he looks So cool and useful, I am sure that my first PtW game will be with the Celts. Still, hoplites rock!

The Spanish UU is also an excellent choise, but I think the Carthaginians are overpowered, much like the Vikings.

	08-10-2002 02:29									#20
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GOOO HWACHA! WHOOP!

Is it actually 12/1/1? I heard 10/1/1. Anyways, if it was 12/1/1 and still only 40 shields, it would actually be pretty damn cool. I mean, you could make unstoppable juggernaught stacks with hwacha even more easily than you could with berserks. For practicality, sure, in MP every turn is going to count and their slow speed isn't gonna cut it... but for sheer coolness and power?

	08-10-2002 02:46									#21
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I believe Berserkers are greatly overrated. They still only have one movement. But we'll see when we've been through some MP games. Siphahi has to be the strongest. (A golden age couldn't be timed better.)

Last edited by statusperfect on 08-10-2002 at 04:10

	08-10-2002 03:10									#22
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Good point about the Siphahi. A stronger cavalary is just great.

	08-10-2002 17:28									#23
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I think the A/D strengths of some of these units are way out of line.

	08-10-2002 19:50									#24
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I think the Ansar Warrior seems pretty powerful, having 3 movement almost a full age before any other unit. I think it'll be nice for some quick sneak attacks.

statusperfect:
The power of the berserker comes mostly from the amphibious ability, IMO. When the berserkers are in a ship, their movement doesn't matter anyway.

	08-10-2002 23:22									#25
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quote: Originally posted by statusperfect I believe Berserkers are greatly overrated. They still only have one movement. But we'll see when we've been through some MP games. Siphahi has to be the strongest. (A golden age couldn't be timed better.)

I prefer the German golden age caused by Panzers, as it comes at the beginning of modern age (and thus enables you to quickly research Computers and build the INTERNET (in PTW)...

	09-10-2002 02:25									#26
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I also agree that berserkers are overated. I mean, everyone is cheering about that amphibious quality, but I can't remember the last time I used marines to do a major landing. By the time I'm ready to do that and continue the offensive I can just land tanks a few squares off and not have to worry about a beach-head. And attacking cities (walls and all) with marines is suicide.

I'll stick to Siphahi thanx.

	09-10-2002 02:27									#27
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quote: Originally posted by statusperfect I believe Berserkers are greatly overrated. They still only have one movement. But we'll see when we've been through some MP games. Siphahi has to be the strongest. (A golden age couldn't be timed better.)

In a ship they have a movement of 3-4!

	09-10-2002 13:34									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Athitis I voted for the Gallic Swordsman.....he looks So cool and useful, I am sure that my first PtW game will be with the Celts. Still, hoplites rock! The Spanish UU is also an excellent choise, but I think the Carthaginians are overpowered, much like the Vikings.

Saw on civfanatics chat log that Numidian Mercenary will cost more then hoplites. Firaxis said also that they have balanced powefull UU with there cost.

	09-10-2002 13:36									#29
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Hmm....Man-o-war.

	09-10-2002 13:53									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Random Passerby GOOO HWACHA! WHOOP! Is it actually 12/1/1? I heard 10/1/1. Anyways, if it was 12/1/1 and still only 40 shields, it would actually be pretty damn cool. I mean, you could make unstoppable juggernaught stacks with hwacha even more easily than you could with berserks. For practicality, sure, in MP every turn is going to count and their slow speed isn't gonna cut it... but for sheer coolness and power?

Remember that that 12 is bombard strenght, NOT attack strenght. But 12 or even 10 bombard strenght is still good in an age the defenders have a defense strenght of 4, but on the other hand do I barely build canons because they have only a rate of fire of 1, so even if the canon hits every turn will it only do 1 damage a turn unlike artillery who can do up to 3 damage a turn(and who I build often).

Maybe will that extra attack make there canons worth it to build, that has to be tested in PTW. But I actually think making the hwacha instead of 12.0.1 with firepower 1 to 8.0.1 with firepower 2 would be better and make it an actually usefull unit. If I see all those rockets on the image of it do I at least think that it must have a great firepower.