14-10-2002 13:14									#61
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by axi You have done a very bad selection of poll options. You should have split into generations with increasing size. <200 201-300

Not to mentions give the people with a 200 (300 in his case)MHz computer a place to put there vote.

	14-10-2002 13:22									#62
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quote: Originally posted by tinyp3nis I think you could get 12k easily with your stuff. Couldn't get to orb to see your results, onion is slow again

It's the Athlon that's holding it back (or rather its poor system/memory interface). A similarly equiped P4 would score higher, but this is as high as this baby will go.

I've tried tweaking lots of stuff. Even overclocking the video card yields minimal performance, it's CPU-bound on my system.

	14-10-2002 13:31									#63
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I'm currently posting from a PC with the raw processing power that can only be provided by:

Pentium P166 (with MMX)
80mb RAM
13.6Gb hard disk space
S3 Trio64 2mb
No sound card
4x CD drive

And for the record, it won`t run 3DMark2001.

Feel the power!

	14-10-2002 13:46									#64
	Re: How fast is your processor? Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Caesar the Great i'd like to see how outdated my 5 year old 300 Mhz p2 is

You have completely swallowed the Intel myth hook sink and line.

Processor speeds should not be measured by how fast the clock ticks but MIPS (millions of instructions per second) and MFLOPS (millions of floating point operations per second).

	14-10-2002 13:50									#65
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MIPS and MFLOPS aren't much better at all, UR.

They're very easily skewed. MIPS because not all instructions are created equal, and MFLOPS because...well, Apple claims 12GFLOPS for the G4 -- figure that one out yourself.

MIPS stands for, after all, Meaningless Indicator of Processor Speed.

They're generally worse indicators of true performance, truth be told. MHz is certainly not the full story either, but it's better than MIPS and FLOPS.

	14-10-2002 13:57									#66
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Maybe it's the case for you, but not for most other people who has an inkling of what's going on.

Now if you can put up a consistent argument on why MIPS and MFLOPS aren't better, I'm all ears.

	14-10-2002 14:00									#67
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For starters, Apple claims 12GFLOPS on the new G4s. That screams total bullshit to me.

Then you can compare the MIPS numbers for the Gekko CPU in the Gamecube (~1100) to the MIPS numbers for the CPU in the Xbox (~2000) -- but developers say the Xbox's CPU is only slightly faster than the Gamecube's CPU, and even then only in certain matrix ops.

MIPS, FLOPS, and MHz are all just as easily distorted. The difference between the three is MHz is what we use to adjust speed of our computers when we want to change it, so that's what's put on the sticker.

	14-10-2002 17:19									#68
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700 Mhz, 64 Mt, really crappy video card.

	14-10-2002 18:05									#69
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BTW, why does it seem to me that manufacturers always put too little memory into computers? Take a look at Paul Hanson's computer - 80 megabytes on a Pentium at 166MHz means that if any particular program can run at a bearable speed on the processor front, it will also run without swapping too much. That's what "enough memory" means to me. But I've seen ads on newspapers in the class of 128MB for a P4 at nearly 2GHz ! Are we expected to run only one program at a time and love the sound of thrashing hard disks?

	14-10-2002 20:51									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Asher For starters, Apple claims 12GFLOPS on the new G4s. That screams total bullshit to me.

Since I don't know how they tested it, it might be a biased benchmark. Nevertheless, RISC's are better at MIPS and MFLOPS than CISC's.

quote: Originally posted by Asher Then you can compare the MIPS numbers for the Gekko CPU in the Gamecube (~1100) to the MIPS numbers for the CPU in the Xbox (~2000) -- but developers say the Xbox's CPU is only slightly faster than the Gamecube's CPU, and even then only in certain matrix ops.

There are all sorts of ways to test for MIPS. Some may show the maximum speed by optimising everything into the cache and run tight loops, but those benchmarks don't mean anything. You need to run a large number of programs to come up with a better picture.

quote: Originally posted by Asher MIPS, FLOPS, and MHz are all just as easily distorted. The difference between the three is MHz is what we use to adjust speed of our computers when we want to change it, so that's what's put on the sticker.

MHz is only meaningful when you compare the same architecture. You can't use it to compare even P4's with Athlons.

	14-10-2002 21:00									#71
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I could really do with a new graphics card, but I keep waiting for the newest thing to come out. By the time it is affordable it is almost obselete and I am waiting for the next one.

What would you guys recommend for a value for money graphics card? At the moment I have a GeForce 2. (In a 1.5 GHz P3 with 512MB RAM.)

	14-10-2002 21:08									#72
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Nothing wrong with the GeForce2. If you don't need graphics card with gee whiz performances there are lots of choices.

	14-10-2002 21:24									#73
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I just blew up my Atholon 800 (it's being repaired right now)

I'm working on my PIII 500 right now.

	15-10-2002 03:01									#74
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i have a 950 mhz amd athalon

	15-10-2002 11:57									#75
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy I just blew up my Atholon 800 (it's being repaired right now)

Does that make you a cyber-terrorist?

	15-10-2002 11:59									#76
	Put an end to popups!

I am still running my P3 700. It is a little over 2 years old. I'll try to stretch it out to 3 years to get my money's worth.

Although once I upgrade I'll be using pieces of my old system to upgrade my mom's computer. And I'll have to upgrade eariler if hers doesn't make it. Her hard drive is about to bite the dust. It's 7 years old and been exposed to a dusty environment.

	15-10-2002 14:06									#77
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According to a neat utility called WCPUID, 996.76 MHz.

Last edited by Kepler on 15-10-2002 at 14:17

	15-10-2002 18:12									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Ari Rahikkala BTW, why does it seem to me that manufacturers always put too little memory into computers? Take a look at Paul Hanson's computer - 80 megabytes on a Pentium at 166MHz means that if any particular program can run at a bearable speed on the processor front, it will also run without swapping too much. That's what "enough memory" means to me.

...but 80 MB of RAM was plenty when 166MHz systems were anywhere near current, i remember trying to decide whether to put another 32 MB stick in my 133MHz system to take it to 64MB several years back. The stuff i was running the RAM wasn't that much of a problem.

	15-10-2002 18:18									#79
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quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh I could really do with a new graphics card, but I keep waiting for the newest thing to come out. By the time it is affordable it is almost obselete and I am waiting for the next one. What would you guys recommend for a value for money graphics card? At the moment I have a GeForce 2. (In a 1.5 GHz P3 with 512MB RAM.)

Either a GF4Ti4200 or ATI Radeon 9500 that is just about to come out now, it will be similarly priced and DX9 compatible... it will be announced on 18th this month.

So perhaps Ati Rad 9500 would be my pick... I assume between 120-150 £ when it comes out. GF4Ti4200 is between 110-140£ it depends which one you want, more RAM or less etc... (64MB/128)

edit:Well € are *1.5

	15-10-2002 18:26									#80
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[q]Good job aaglo. What video card did you get?[q/]

Nothing fancy, the standard/regular for that shops models: ATI Rage 128 Ultra 32 MB AGP (which is pretty decent IMO)

	15-10-2002 18:29									#81
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Desktop - 1.9 Ghz, 512MB of RAM

Laptop - 90 Mhz, 40MB

The laptop is collecting dust.

	15-10-2002 18:44									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Desktop - 1.9 Ghz, 512MB of RAM Laptop - 90 Mhz, 40MB The laptop is collecting dust.

ive got a desktop 1.7 Gig and a Laptop 120Mhz and i'd say i use one just as much as the other, theres plenty of times when i want to 'potter around' (ie Civ2, programming or writing stuff) but don't want to be stuck upstairs in what i laughingly call my 'study'.

I can put my feet up on the sofa, stick the TV on, crack open a beer and tap away!

	15-10-2002 18:47									#83
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quote: Originally posted by reds4ever ive got a desktop 1.7 Gig and a Laptop 120Mhz and i'd say i use one just as much as the other, theres plenty of times when i want to 'potter around' (ie Civ2, programming or writing stuff) but don't want to be stuck upstairs in what i laughingly call my 'study'. I can put my feet up on the sofa, stick the TV on, crack open a beer and tap away!

Yeah, I can get more comfy with the laptop. I used to use it a lot for playing civ2, but I havent played for a while now. Also I gave away the modem card to a friend who needed it more (my desktop has a cable modem), and it doesnt have a network card.

	15-10-2002 21:20									#84
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Do you want me to list all the processors I own, use or the one I currently use?

Oh well...

Now: 1050 MHz

	15-10-2002 22:42									#85
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Mine is only p3-500MHz, but 320MB RAM

	15-10-2002 22:53									#86
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I have no idea. How do find out? (I don't have manual)

I'm posting from an old Toshiba 430CDT laptop.

	15-10-2002 22:55									#87
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Hey, worst of the pack 233MHz PII, 64Mb of RAM. Pathetic, but mostly does its duty.

	15-10-2002 22:57									#88
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quote: Originally posted by Gangerolf I have no idea. How do find out? (I don't have manual) I'm posting from an old Toshiba 430CDT laptop.

Right-click "My Computer" and click on "Properties", you should see it then.

	15-10-2002 23:08									#89
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thanks zopperoni

I apparently got a Pentium(r) 48.0MB RAM.

Couldn't find anything about megahertz though

	15-10-2002 23:13									#90
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quote: Originally posted by Gangerolf Couldn't find anything about megahertz though

An Internet search on your model gave me: a whopping 120 MHz!