28-11-2002 10:40									#1
	What's the best starting position you've had? Tired of ads?

Mine was on a coast and I had a river, whale, fish, wine, and a Horse. Regent, standard size, 80% ocean Pangea, temperate, wet, 3 billion years old

	28-11-2002 13:03									#2
	Increase Your PM Length

I do not remember the details, but one game on Emp I had a great city with cow/river and at least one lux. Then I popped a settler out of the near by hut and the game was a walk over.

	28-11-2002 20:01									#3
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

There was one game where the starting position wasn't that good and the surrounding tiles were not much better (plains, desert and jungle mostly). The rest of the continent was kind of dire too - 40% jungle, 10% desert, 20% plains, 20% grassland, 10% other types and few rivers, resources or luxuries. But, it was a huge continent and I was alone.

That game's score is my highest ever, 8485 on regent (no score milking).

	29-11-2002 11:39									#4
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I once saw a screenshot in Apolyton, where the starting city (when all 21 tiles were worked) had 5 cows and a river close to the city...

[edit] here's the pic...
http://www.apolyton.net/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=1471914

	29-11-2002 23:53									#5
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5 COWS!!!

	30-11-2002 05:59									#6
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Not to be funny, but i once had 6 cows... ,it was with Rome, whenever i play i seem to break many wierd records, like having 20 great leaders in a game and stuff.

In my present game London has a 2 cows, 1 wheat,1 iron and a river - pretty good!

Derby is arguably better tho, 8 floodplain tiles, 3 with wheat on , an oasis in the desert and a horse in the plains at the other side.

	01-12-2002 06:27									#7
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I had once 2 cows, 2 wheat, iron, horse and a river- but I reloaded as the city was 1 tile off coast and that turns me mad!

	02-12-2002 02:58									#8
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Better than have a good start position is to have coal and iron in teh city radius af a city close to your capital, so you can biuld the IW on it. I usualy get one city with both in about 1 of 4 games ,but when it happens.....

	02-12-2002 07:47									#9
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My best was 4 cows and a luxury.

Umh except for a custom start (liberal use of map editor) with 21 cows which was just too much.

	03-12-2002 06:27									#10
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quote: Originally posted by peterfharris Umh except for a custom start (liberal use of map editor) with 21 cows which was just too much.

	03-12-2002 13:17									#11
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1 cow, 2 wheat, a single Flood Plain tile, a healthy mixture of plains, grasslands (mostly bonus!), and hills, no forests or jungle, access to one luxury (incense on a hill), two rivers (the one where the city was founded, and the one tangential to the flood plain just at the edge of the city radius), and iron. A few steps away from horses, not far from coal, and in the modern age, the city had aluminum!

Sadly, I wound up losing that game. Diplo.

	03-12-2002 14:10									#12
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

3 cows, couple of hills, flood plain, green terrain all around, city site 5 tiles away that gave Iron Works.

And all on a world that was 3 billion years old, cold and arid.

Attachment: 4000bc.jpg
This has been downloaded 143 time(s).

Last edited by star mouse on 03-12-2002 at 14:23

	03-12-2002 14:15									#13
	Put an end to popups!

I also kept the 4000BC save ... if anyone else wants to play this game here's the save. Difficulty level is Regent.

I think the game's played with my modified rules, which are as follows:


CITIZENS
========
Tax collectors Give 3 gold, require Currency
Scientists Give 3 science, require Invention


CIVILIZATION ADVANCES
=====================
Writing no longer enables Communications trading
Navigation enables Communications trading


DIFFICULTY LEVELS
=================
Chieftain - AI/AI trade rate = 105, barbarian bonus 400
Warlord - AI/AI trade rate = 110, barbarian bonus 200
Regent - AI/AI trade rate = 115, barbarian bonus 100
Monarch - AI/AI trade rate = 120, barbarian bonus 50
Emperor - AI/AI trade rate = 125, barbarian bonus 25
Deity - AI/AI trade rate = 130, barbarian bonus 0


GENERAL SETTINGS
================
Barbarian unit = Warrior
Barbarian advanced unit = Horseman
Barbarian sea unit = Privateer
Money Resource = Gold


GOVERNMENT
==========
Removed "Mr./Mrs." from Democracy titles


RESOURCES
=========
Horses give +1 shield and +1 commerce
Iron gives +2 shield
Game gives +1 food
Saltpeter gives +1 shield and +1 commerce
Dyes give +2 commerce
Incense gives +2 commerce
Gems give +5 commerce


TERRAIN
=======
Jungles also have Game, Incense and Oil (this ensures that Warm, Wet worlds always have Oil)
Plains also have Game and Oil
Flood Plains also have Game and Gold
Tundra turns into Grassland with global warming
Hills also have Uranium


UNITS
=====
Caravel moves 4
Frigate moves 6
Galleon moves 6
Ironclad moves 7
Transport moves 9
Carrier moves 9
Submarine moves 7
Destroyer moves 10
Battleship moves 10
AEGIS Cruiser moves 10
Nuclear Submarine moves 9
Man-O-War moves 6
Privateer moves 6
Destroyer detects submarines
Ironclad upgrades to Destroyer
Frigate upgrades to Man-O-War
Man-O-War upgrades to Destroyer
Swordsman upgrades to Legionary
Legionary upgrades to Immortal
Immortal upgrades to Marine
Longbowman upgrades to Marine
Workers can airlift
Submarines require Iron and Oil
Transports require Iron and Oil
Destroyers require Iron and Oil
Carriers require Iron and Oil
Battleships require Iron and Oil
Nuclear Submarines require Uranium and Aluminium
Bomber has lethal land and sea bombardment
Stealth Bomber has lethal land and sea bombardment
Cruise missile has lethal land and sea bombardment
Battleship has lethal land and sea bombardment
Carrier requires Flight as a prerequisite
Mech Inf costs 120 to build
Modern Armor costs 140 to build
Cruise Missile has a bombard range of 3
Barbarians may "build" warriors, archers and horsemen (this allows goody huts to produce these units)


WORLD SIZES
===========
Tiny: Min distance = 14, optimum cities = 16, science = 80
Small: Min distance = 16, optimum cities = 20, science = 100
Standard: Min distance = 18, optimum cities = 24, science = 120
Large: Min distance = 20, optimum cities = 32, science = 160
Huge: Min distance = 24, optimum cities = 40, science = 200

Attachment: japanese 2.zip
This has been downloaded 4 time(s).

	03-12-2002 20:58									#14
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Hmm, the very best? I had that Egyptian game on Emperor with 5 cows on a river (all on plains, with most of the city radius also plains... 1 hill, 2 or 3 desert).

I had a Regent level Iroquois game way back with 5 or 6 cows on a river, plus grassland and hills. That was probably my best, actually.

My girlfriend stumbled upon an insanely good start on Regent as Egypt: the Capitol had 2 cows on a river, plus some grassland/bonus grassland, forest and hills. The second city had a lake, a cow and 5 bonus grass, the third city had 5 or 6 bonus grass, more grass, two hills, and was coastal. Those three cities were production monsters right from the beginning. It was so amazing that I ended up "advising" on that game (read: half playing it). The wonder "race" wasn't a race: Pyramids (got to republic just in time to avoid despot GA), G. Library, Colossus, G. Lighthouse, HG, and everything from the middle ages on. Plus out-REXing the AI by a mile. We acquired 6 luxuries without firing a shot. Sometimes I miss Regent.

-Arrian

	04-12-2002 05:10									#15
	Increase the size of your Attachments

This is probably the best starting location I've had. Ended up getting a Settler from a hut about 3000BC next to a Cow and some furs, and overall was able to peacefully settle 7 luxuries along with Iron and Horses.

I ended up splitting the Cows (another just to the SE)between 3 cities though, as 2 is all a city really needs.

Attachment: terrible.jpg
This has been downloaded 105 time(s).

	04-12-2002 21:22									#16
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I've seen that screenshot before, I do believe. It's ridiculous. There is no other word for it.

-Arrian

	04-12-2002 21:40									#17
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I played on a giga archi map with 80% water. I was in the middle of a large cont that went generaly north to south, it was also sort-of shapped like a backwards "3". Although I was in a lot of Jungle, just east of my capital was lots of cows and gold. Just to the north was a 1 tile "land bridge" and to the south was about 3 tiles. So placing spearmen there to prevent enemy settlers from grabing any land helped a lot. In the end, it was a cake walk, but it was a very fun cakewalk.

I keep that original save, for kicks. It was one of the best computer generated maps I ever played on.

	05-12-2002 01:16									#18
	Tired of ads?

how about the best start I've ever seen?

This the link to Spiffor's thread is here