16-12-2002 22:57									#61
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Of course the Japanese commited horrible acts in Nanjing and in general many cities they occupied...but as has been said, they are not the only ones to have done such things.

On the other hand, from what i've read online, it's not that the Japanese don't mention these atrocities in their textbooks at all, just that they tend to downplay them somewhat or not specify all the details...A bit of revisionism perhaps but not total amnesia, from what I can tell.

For example, see this site.

	17-12-2002 09:20									#62
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quote: ur friend was gay?

I've spoken with gay Chinese guys who have visited Japan. They also attest to the unwillingness of Japanese gays to date outside of their race lines. Apparently many gay bars in Japan have "Japanese Only" signs at the door. In general, bars in Japan are highly specialized. There are special bars for Japanese who want to meet western guys, etc.

quote: Combine this with their strange brand of racism - worshipping Westerners while looking down upon other Asians - make all the neighbouring countries worry.

Sounds familiar: Shanghainese worship westerners while looking down upon all other Chinese! It's the number one complaint from my friends and students who are out-of-towners. In Shanghai, "out-of-towner" is a mild put-down, "countryside person" is an outright insult, akin to "hick" or "rube". Woops, sorry to swerve off-topic!

quote: The way I see it, if you're killing innocent people, then you're killing innocent people, and that's pretty much all there is to it.

I dont see it that way at all. Consider a bomber pilot who presses a button to obliterate a bona fide military target, knowing that some civilians will likely die. He may be repulsed by the death of of innocents, but considers it morally justifiable under the extreme circumstances.

Compare this with a two sword-weilding Japanese officers having a contest to see who can be the first to personally behead one hundred Chinese. The latter is a true story from Nanjing, reported in Japanese newspapers of the time, complete with grinning photos of the demonic officers.

Can you really consider those two equivalent?

	17-12-2002 09:40									#63
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo A Nazi businessman was the chief person who organized the safe zone.

Yes, that's John Rabe, who was repulsed to see the way the IJA was going about wantonly murdering and raping. He used his special status as a memeber of the Nazi party to help out the people of Nanjing. For this he was later commemorated as The Good Man of Nanjing.

	17-12-2002 09:48									#64
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk Is it because we won? Is that it?

Maybe that's part of the reason. Ever since Meiji Restoration, when Japan was able to rapidly industralise, the nation took on some strange mentalities. They would think themselves as a European nation, not an Asian nation, therefore they would be above the other Asian nations. Perhaps this was caused by their economic strength and imported Western ideas, I cannot tell.

	17-12-2002 12:37									#65
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quote: Originally posted by mindseye quote: The way I see it, if you're killing innocent people, then you're killing innocent people, and that's pretty much all there is to it. I dont see it that way at all. Consider a bomber pilot who presses a button to obliterate a bona fide military target, knowing that some civilians will likely die. He may be repulsed by the death of of innocents, but considers it morally justifiable under the extreme circumstances. Compare this with a two sword-weilding Japanese officers having a contest to see who can be the first to personally behead one hundred Chinese. The latter is a true story from Nanjing, reported in Japanese newspapers of the time, complete with grinning photos of the demonic officers. Can you really consider those two equivalent?

Perhaps not under those exact circumstances you describe there, but if the bomber pilot had been just dropping bombs all over a city without a care for who or what he hit, then yes, I really do consider those two equivalent. The only difference is that the Japanese officers made it somewhat more personal by actually facing their victims.