15-12-2002 18:46									#1
	Command Nexus: Operation Fallout Tired of ads?

Command Nexus members and other UN citizens hereby i present a plan [codename: Fallout] to take over the following of morgan bases:
*Morgan Mines
*Morgan Robotics
*Morgan Transport

this will have the following DIRECT concequences:
*war with Morgan
*less income because we will not be trading with Morgan
*no new techs that morgan will discover
*expansion of our faction

this will have the following INDIRECT concequences:
*need for military buildup
*will stop morgan apply pressure against our Eastern borders
*will stop morgan expand towards the west
*will increase our enegry supply

this is what i think is needed for this operation:
*missilelauncher tech
*1: transporter
*4: (6-2t-2) (rovers)
*6-8: (6-1-1) (infantry)
*1-2: formers
*save area in [30.102] (River north of Crystalis)
*save shipping lane from New Suez to [39.96] (beach between Morgan Mines and Morgan Transport)

the plan is this:

Our main force will be in [30.102](river north of Crystalis)
this will be:
*all infantry units
*2 rovers
*all formers

our secondary force will (probably) be in [35.95] just outside Morgan territory and beachlanding in [39.96] (beach between Morgan Mines and Morgan Transport)
this will be:
*1 transporter
*2 rovers
*any additional sea escort that is needed

when war is declared either by us or by morgan:
turn 1:
main force will move towards Morgan mines. the rovers that are with them will attack every hostile unit outside of the base.
secondary force will do nothing
turn 2:
main force will arrive at [33.101] (rocky tile SW,SW of Morgan mines)
Secondary force will land at [37.97] (fungus) or [36.98] (normal tile) and will attack any reinforcements or other units in the M mines, M transport, M Robotics area

turn 3:
main force will move in to the fungus SW of M mines. rovers first so that they can kill any worm that are there
secondary force will attack any unit outside the bases

turn 4-5:
main force infantry units will attack and take over M mines
one unit will stay behind as garrison

turn 5-6:
main force will rest in M mines until all units are 100%

turn 6-11:
main force will move towards Morgan Robotics

turn 11-12:
main force infantry will attack and take over M robotics

turn X:
main force infantry will attack and take over M transport

turn X+1:
peace will be sign with morgan

former orders:
they will make a road toward M mines and when that is finish will make one towards M robotics and so on
this is for the case that we need to send in reinforcements

additional plans:

*first turn of the war probe teams could attack several Morgan bases
*turn 4-5 probe teams could subvert M Robotics
*bring allong a probe foil to subvert M tranport in turn 2 and land rovers from transport there to attack any counter attacks or reinforcements for M mines and M robotics

to make this plan work i will need:
*probe units from the DEI
*building orders for the DIA
*majority of UN citizens to agree

This is my plan that i submit to the Command Nexus and the citizens of the UN. there is now room for debate.

Director of Peacekeeping Operations DBTS

[ooc]screenshot will follow| what do you all think[/ooc]

	15-12-2002 19:24									#2
	Got spare money?

* Lemmy thinks DBTS is bored

Don't you have any pencils to throw at the ceiling?

	15-12-2002 19:27									#3
	Put an end to popups!

hell i am bored out of my mind but still it is a real plan

	15-12-2002 19:28									#4
	Increase Your PM Length

Err... I don't think we should attack Morgan while we're at war with the Hive. Just a thought. Anyway, about military units. I usually do it the other way around than you propose: no armor on rovers, as they are pure attack units, and best armor on infantry, acting as all-purpose units. Thus 6-1-2s and 6-3-1s.

	15-12-2002 19:30									#5
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

do we have *-3-*? anyways....i use rover for defense in the openfield because they can retreat if need be.....so extra defense on then while i use most infantry as basebusters...but that can be debated over

	15-12-2002 19:32									#6
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

i dont think the hive cause us any problems for a long time....but i am starting to be annoyed by the new bases of morgan east of us next he will send CPs trough our territory so settle south of us

	15-12-2002 19:33									#7
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: i use rover for defense in the openfield because they can retreat if need be

That's an extra reason why they don't need armor.
The problem with not giving armor to infantry is they have only one movement and therefore need to stand one turn right besides the base before being able to attack. Which makes them very vulnerable.

	15-12-2002 19:36									#8
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that is way the rover go with them
....and because they can retreat you can use them next turn again as an attack unit....a defending infantry units can because it is lost....that is my strategy here....i dont want to strain our resource to much by building many armored infantry that is way i did it...

	15-12-2002 19:42									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

@ maniac and gave them armor mostly because of the 2 rover operating behind enemy lines....so that they can survive longer...

	15-12-2002 20:53									#10
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

if i was doing this, i'd send a few 6-1-2's (maybe with high morale) and some 1-3t+-1's (trance and ECM, both free. provided we have neural grafting of course) to defend the bases we take from recapture. that way we don't have to leave attack units behind or rush defenders in. i very rarely use attack infantry, too slow.

morgan is very poorly defended though, and should be an easy target

	15-12-2002 21:06									#11
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you are right that we could send some garrison with it...but i dont like the idea of rovers attack bases...infantry gets the bonus we could use....we could also make a landing from sea with infantry that way it would take 2 turns....but this is a dicussion thread so discuss about it you want because i want the best plan possible before i start a poll about it

	15-12-2002 21:12									#12
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

i heard alot of other ideas to do this war....and i will look it to them but do you support the general idea of attack morgan...?

	15-12-2002 21:22									#13
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

he'll probably declare war because of SE anyways, so might as well prepare now

	15-12-2002 21:24									#14
	Suffering from ads?

No, he is an ally!!! How can we justify it, he has commited no atrocities, nothing against our ethos, and nothing to provoke us!! We should worry about the Hive first, before we go starting any other wars. Even from a militaristic position, wouldn't this all be much easier after a switch to knowledge and taking the Command Nexus?

And even in war I didn't think the DPO got contol of DEI probe foils?

As a plan it is quite good, presuming the transport is not taken out by hive patrol ships. But really, how can we justify it, with our Peacekeeper ethos. it's just plain evil!!!

Peackeepers for Peace

Last edited by Drogue on 15-12-2002 at 21:30

	15-12-2002 21:28									#15
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quote: Originally posted by TKG he'll probably declare war because of SE anyways, so might as well prepare now

Then let him declare. We can prepare for war, to defend ourselves mostly, but wait for him to strike first (then we don't loose reputation either). 'Let he without sin cast the first stone'.

Are we, or are we not, Pacifist by nature? If we are, this would be hypocracy. If we're not, God help us all...

	15-12-2002 21:34									#16
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

you are forgetting one thing those foils are under your control because I gave them to you....they are my ships but as i said at the end i would need probe teams from you...they would still be under your control only used in a war...but the hive isnt a problem they are to far away and if we are going to take the command Nexus we will need to take other areas too...and because of the distance between the hive and us i dont believe in a major victory if we go off and take on the hive right now....some one we can take on right now is morgan.....he will eventually declare war anyways because we are in planned so why not use that and maybe speed things up a bit to take a large portion of his territory....tactically attacking morgan would be the best way to go and i am will to do it that is way i made this plan

	15-12-2002 21:36									#17
	Inflate your Upload Space

@drogue that is just ofcourse the idea to let him declare war....but this is what i want to when it happens.....but we can speed up the progress as soon as we have our military ready....i will come up pretty soon with buildingorders all over the faction to 'defend' against morgan

	15-12-2002 21:38									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue Are we, or are we not, Pacifist by nature?

technically, no. we're "erratic"

how 'bout we probe him into declaring war, or we say "remove your troops from our land". both methods piss the AI off, and IIRC dont tarnish our reputation (not entirely sur about probing)

as for the hive, we can worry about them later. once we get choppers and droppers. and lots of them. if the hive tries anything, it'll only be 1 transport with maybe 2 units. if we have a few missile rovers in reserve hanging around we should be fine.

	15-12-2002 21:40									#19
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I thought probe teams/foils were automatically under DEI control, becaused they are intelligence not military units, and it was exploration units that have to be assigned by the DPO, and even then, when assigned, they are under the control of the DEI until the DEI decides to give them back. Can I propose that the DIA (or governor) has control of which units they assigne to exploration or military uses?

It may be strategically easier, but remember Hitler trying to fight on two fronts, and loosing badly, if the Hive attack us while at war with Morgan, we have a problem! Also we won't get peace after taking a few bases, as in your plan. In my experience, they will only accept peace without us paying them when they are down to their last base or two.

Edit: DBTS: You still haven't put DEI back in the constitution. Can you do that ASAP, as technically I don't exist, and Lemmy wants his position back methinks...

	15-12-2002 21:48									#20
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if we dont get peace after taking the first 3 take a fourth and i my games peace will come...about the probeteams not really importent how has them under there control.....it is for the best intrest of the faction that they do it.....me thinks about the DEI will do...

	15-12-2002 22:02									#21
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Well, no it doesn't matter, but I have orders from the people that they are not to be used for anything other than infiltration unless we are already at war. So a pre-emptive probe assult won't be possible.

Are you intending to launch a surprixse attack or tell him of our intentions and declare war first.

he may declare on us, but ATM we are still Pact Brothers, so methinks that's a way off.

	15-12-2002 22:02									#22
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The DEI has full control over probe teams, exploration units however are loaned from the DPO, and the DPO can take over control whenever he needs them.

quote: Edit: DBTS: You still haven't put DEI back in the constitution. Can you do that ASAP, as technically I don't exist, and Lemmy wants his position back methinks...

	15-12-2002 22:08									#23
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Lemmy The DEI has full control over probe teams, exploration units however are loaned from the DPO, and the DPO can take over control whenever he needs them.

The consitution says

quote: *Giving back control of exploration units to the director of Peacekeeping Operations when the situation asks for it.

So it is not clear what 'the situation' means. Is it when the DPO or when the DEI or when the Commish says it is?

And isn't it GT's (as DFA) say if we go to war? I think we need a poll for it too.

Edit: DBTS: Thanks for adding DEI, but you've put it in the middle of the DoS part, and split that

	16-12-2002 07:01									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue It may be strategically easier, but remember Hitler trying to fight on two fronts, and loosing badly,

uhm, that may be, but i think that we have a few distinct advantages over hilter:

1. The Hive is stupid
   
2. Morgan is stupid
   
3. We have gatling lasers
   
4. We have little to fear of Morganite Winters

the list goes on

	16-12-2002 10:45									#25
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quote: And isn't it GT's (as DFA) say if we go to war? I think we need a poll for it too.

Yes it is, though some (including me!) have probably forgotten that recently, considering how little control I have over who we have to fight, and the lack of change in our foreign policy.

Anyway, why on earth should we attack Morgan? He has done nothing against us. He may disagree with our economic policy, but that is no reason to attack him. If he chooses to declare war, that is another matter, but if we strike the first blow, our reputation will be tarnished forever and for good reason.

	16-12-2002 14:02									#26
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Exactly

I agree with Lemmy, methinks DBTS is a homicidal maniac a bit bored

	16-12-2002 15:42									#27
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well the a big reson to attack morgan (or let him declare war on us) is that he is pushing against our borders and soon will send CP trough our borders and claim the area south of us......i want to stop him.....the problem of reputation can be handled with him declaring war on us....any other complaint is purely RP and it is up to the citizens to see how much value they give to that....

@Drogue yes i am a bit bored but that is not the reason

	16-12-2002 15:50									#28
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Command Nexus members and other UN citizens hereby i present a plan [Codename: Fallout] to take over the following of morgan bases: *Morgan Mines *Morgan Robotics *Morgan Transport

Morganites certainly deserve a lesson.

But we have no reason to start a war that will cost us innocent lives. We''d better watch our frontiers and cancel Pact as soon as we spot a CP in our territory.

	16-12-2002 16:43									#29
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Ha! I knew that Santiago has infiltrated us! Sooner or later, the spy had to appear! DBTS, you'll be interrogated and left molested!

	16-12-2002 16:52									#30
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We have ex-colonels of the KGB at the CCCP, if you're interested...