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MarkG is offline MarkG
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Macedonia, Greece
Jan 1970
time: 07:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:24 Visit MarkG<br><img src=/forums/images/admin-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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Pentagon Debates Propaganda Push in Allied Nations Inflate your Upload Space

quote:
Pentagon Debates Propaganda Push in Allied Nations

WASHINGTON, Dec. 15 — The Defense Department is considering issuing a secret directive to the American military to conduct covert operations aimed at influencing public opinion and policy makers in friendly and neutral countries, senior Pentagon and administration officials say.

Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld has not yet decided on the proposal, which has ignited a fierce battle throughout the Bush administration over whether the military should carry out secret propaganda missions in friendly nations like Germany, where many of the Sept. 11 hijackers congregated, or Pakistan, still considered a haven for Al Qaeda's militants.


full thing
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/16/i...&partner=GOOGLE


cool huh?

TheStinger is offline TheStinger
Warlord
International crime fighting playboy
Apr 2002
time: 05:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:30
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If this is true, I think the UK could very well tell the US to piss off when they want our assitance.

monkspider is offline monkspider
King
banned
Aug 2001
time: 23:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:32
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Unbelievable! The arrogance of the Bush administration knows no bounds.

MarkG is offline MarkG
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:35 Visit MarkG<br><img src=/forums/images/admin-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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i love this part
quote:
As a military officer put it: "We have the assets and the capabilities and the training to go into friendly and neutral nations to influence public opinion. We could do it and get away with it. That doesn't mean we should."

MarkG is offline MarkG
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:37 Visit MarkG<br><img src=/forums/images/admin-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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even cooler
quote:
"Running ops against your allies doesn't work very well," Adm. Dennis C. Blair, a retired commander of American forces in the Pacific, advised Pentagon officials as they began re-examining the classified directive over the summer. "I've seen it tried a few times, and it generally is not very effective."

TheStinger is offline TheStinger
Warlord
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Apr 2002
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 15:41
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkG
even cooler
quote:
"Running ops against your allies doesn't work very well," Adm. Dennis C. Blair, a retired commander of American forces in the Pacific, advised Pentagon officials as they began re-examining the classified directive over the summer. "I've seen it tried a few times, and it generally is not very effective."


an eight years old would know this. If they can't convince their allies through legitiamte means thats tough.

Alex is offline Alex
Emperor
Brasil
Mar 1999
time: 02:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 16:20 Visit Alex's homepage!
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Get a bigger avatar today!

Every day this Bush administration scares me more and more...

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 16:47
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What else you could expext from dubaya?
His gang is four horseman of apcalypse. I told you, the end is near.


Have a nice day

OneFootInTheGrave is offline OneFootInTheGrave
Prince
Kuzelj
Nov 2000
time: 05:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 16:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Serb
What else you could expext from dubaya?
His gang is four horseman of apcalypse. I told you, the end is near.


Have a nice day








Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:09 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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_Propaganda Push in Allied Nations_

Oh I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be the first time

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:18
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Got spare money?

Of course.
Remeber Yugoslavia

CyberShy is offline CyberShy

Emperor
Delft, The Netherlands
Mar 1999
time: 06:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:23
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There's much propaganda from the anti-bush administration. It's about time that the bush administration starts to fight them with the same weapons.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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quote:
Originally posted by Serb
Of course.
Remeber Yugoslavia


Is that what you mean Serb?



quote:
Globe and Mail, August 01, 2001
We Created a Monster

Albanian terrorists, armed by the West to fight in Kosovo, are destroying Macedonia, says Canada’s former ambassador to Yugoslavia

JAMES BISSETT

When Canadian pilots joined in the NATO bombing of Yugoslavia in March 1999, we were told by Lloyd Axworthy and Art Eggleton that the intervention in Kosovo was necessary to prevent the violence there from spreading and de-stabilizing the Balkans. Yet we now know that long before the bombing it was NATO countries themselves that were inciting violence in Kosovo and attempting to de-stabilize that Serbian province. Moreover despite the bombing the violence has spread – in Kosovo itself, in southern Serbia, and more recently in Macedonia.

Media reports have revealed that as early as 1998, the central intelligence agency assisted by the British Special Armed Services were arming and training Kosovo Liberation Army members in Albania to foment armed rebellion in Kosovo. The KLA terrorists were sent back into Kosovo to assassinate Serbian mayors, ambush Serbian policemen and do everything possible to incite murder and chaos. The hope was that with Kosovo in flames NATO could intervene and in so doing, not only overthrow Slobodan Milosevic the Serbian strong man, but more importantly, provide the aging and increasingly irrelevant military organization with a reason for its continued existence.

After bombing Yugoslavia into submission, NATO then stood by and submissively allowed the KLA to murder, pillage and burn. The KLA was given a free hand to do as they wished. Almost all of the non-Albanian population was ethnically cleansed from Kosovo under the watchful eyes of 40,000 NATO troops. Moreover, in defiance of United Nations resolution 1244 which brought an end to the fighting, NATO adamantly refused to disarm the KLA fighters. Instead, NATO converted this ragtag band of terrorists into the Kosovo Protection Force – allegedly to maintain peace and order in Kosovo.

To add insult to injury NATO appointed an alleged war criminal, Agim Ceku, as commander of this force. Agim Ceku is an Albanian Kosovar who led the Croatian army in "operation storm" which ethnically cleansed all of the Serbian population from their ancestral lands in Croatia. Some news reports have suggested that there is a sealed indictment against Ceku held by the war crimes tribunal in the Hague but not acted upon because to do so would embarrass his NATO bosses. On june10 of this year the London Times reported that in early march, Agim Ceku ordered 800 KLA reservists from Kosovo to enter Macedonia to help their fellow Albanians in their rebellion against the government there.

Few Albanian nationalists in the Balkans had forgotten that under the fascist and Nazi regimes of the 1940’s, Albania was given control of Kosovo, parts of Macedonia and northern Greece. Those latent dreams of Greater Albania have been given new life by NATO’s policy of encouraging and actively supporting the Albanians of Kosovo to use violence and force to achieve their political goals. It appears our NATO leaders did not realize [or did not care] that by supporting Albanian extremists the scourge of Albanian racism would be unleashed in the Balkans. Now in Macedonia the broader consequences of NATO’s ill-considered intervention in that troubled region of Europe is becoming more evident.

The KLA learned early in the Yugoslavian campaign that NATO countries are unwilling to risk the lives of their soldiers to resolve Balkan problems. It is one thing to bomb targets in Yugoslavia from 15,000 feet with little or no risk to its pilots. It is quite another thing to become involved in armed conflict on the ground against a well-armed and determined enemy.

Confirmation of this was evident when the KLA went into to southern Serbia.

NATO was not prepared to intervene militarily to halt that aggression. It was only when NATO was able to strike a deal with the new democratic powers in Serbia to have Serbian troops restore order in that region that the KLA were stopped.

Thwarted, at least temporarily, in southern Serbia, the KLA then turned its attention to Macedonia and in March started a new military campaign in that country. Their tactics were the same as those used successfully in Kosovo, i.e. assassination, ambush, and intimidation of the local population. Again as in Kosovo the KLA is armed and equipped by western powers. The Macedonian authorities in order to put down the armed rebellion have used the same tactics as employed by the Serbian forces in Kosovo; shelling of villages occupied by KLA fighters with consequent civilian casualties and refugees.

Unlike Kosovo, however, NATO authorities are unable to react to the Macedonian crisis as they did two years earlier in Kosovo because obviously bombing Macedonia is not the answer. Macedonia is not headed by a Slobodan Milosevic and its record of dealing with its Albanian minority is, by Balkan standards, exemplary. The issue is further complicated by the reality that the KLA is NATO’s own creature and continues to be looked upon favorably by its previous masters. There seems little doubt that NATO intends to ensure that Kosovo remains under KLA control.

Even more alarming is the fact that the KLA and its brethren in Macedonia continue to receive assistance and military help from NATO countries. Last month when Macedonian forces were closing in on KLA rebels near the town of Aracinovo, NATO intervened and helped evacuate the KLA fighters. According to German media reports the intervention was ordered because among the KLA forces were 17 American advisors from an American private mercenary organization that has been actively engaged in the Balkans during the Yugoslav wars. It would not do to have had a number of former us military personnel captured along with KLA terrorists.

Although embarrassed by the actions of the KLA in Macedonia NATO has shown no inclination to bring a stop to this naked aggression against a democratic and peaceful nation. To do so would result in armed clashes with the KLA with consequent loss of NATO lives. It would also underline the bankruptcy of NATO’s policy in the Balkans. This is not something that Lord Robertson or our NATO political leaders wish to have highlighted.

Unwilling to confront the KLA the response so far from NATO has been to bring diplomatic pressure on the government of Macedonia forcing it to yield to Albanian demands. The secretary general of NATO, Lord Robertson and the European Union’s foreign minister, Javier Solana have arrived in Skopje to press home NATO’s insistence that Macedonia’s sovereignty must be compromised. In the meantime KLA rebels are reinforcing their forces who have occupied most of western and northern Macedonia. So much for NATO’s dedication to democratic ideals, the rule of law and the peaceful resolution of international disputes.

James Bissett is a former Canadian ambassador to Yugoslavia.




http://www.balkanpeace.org/hed/arch...1/hed3828.shtml

MarkG is offline MarkG
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quote:
the anti-bush administration
the what?

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:39 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by CyberShy
There's much propaganda from the anti-bush administration. It's about time that the bush administration starts to fight them with the same weapons.


quote:
The Defense Department is considering issuing a secret directive to the American military to conduct covert operations aimed at influencing public opinion and policy makers in friendly and neutral countries, senior Pentagon and administration officials say.


The anti bush administration is using its military to conduct covert operations in the US to influence american public opinion?

I didn't know photoshop was considered an anti bush administration military covert operation...

TheStinger is offline TheStinger
Warlord
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Apr 2002
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:48
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quote:
Originally posted by paiktis22




The anti bush administration is using its military to conduct covert operations in the US to influence american public opinion?

I didn't know photoshop was considered an anti bush administration military covert operation...



But who is Darth Vader and who is the emporer

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
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Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:53 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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You're asking the wrong guy. I never was a fan of Star Wars

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 17:59
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quote:
I didn't know photoshop was considered an anti bush administration military covert operation...


quote:
Is that what you mean Serb?

Of course.

CyberShy is offline CyberShy

Emperor
Delft, The Netherlands
Mar 1999
time: 06:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 18:29
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quote:
the what?

the guys/gals who are against the bush administration.

MarkG is offline MarkG
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 21:25 Visit MarkG<br><img src=/forums/images/admin-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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then you should say the "anti-bush administration guys/gals"

for a moment i thought there was an secret administration (of something) against bush...

Gangerolf is offline Gangerolf
Prince
huuhh
May 2001
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:02
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well it aint a secret anymore. so if you're starting to feel extra pro-american you know why.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:18 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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Suckers, you fell for it, didn't you?

This is disinformation! They're telling you that they're thinking about doing it, which implies that they aren't already doing it. Hah! Hook, line, and sinker.

CyberShy is offline CyberShy

Emperor
Delft, The Netherlands
Mar 1999
time: 06:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:31
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And if you're against them,
you know it's because of the secret anti-administration

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:33 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Read up the tread Che

You underestimate us SO much commie relic

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:46 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by paiktis22
Read up the tread Che

You underestimate us SO much commie relic


No, even your post assumes it's not going on now. Yes, it went on in the past, but the point of this article is to say we aren't doing it now, when in fact, we are. And you bought it. But you buy into nationalism also, which shows your weak intellect.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 22:54 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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True.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 23:00 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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What? I win?

cool

Sprayber is offline Sprayber

Emperor
Dixie
Oct 2000
time: 23:24
  Old Post 19-12-2002 23:25
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You guys are so precious.

che gets an extra 20 points for making paiktis speechless

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
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  Old Post 19-12-2002 23:27 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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I like to think that when there is a special understanding there is no need for words

Kc7mxo is offline Kc7mxo
Prince
Kansas City, Kansas
Jan 1970
time: 21:24
  Old Post 20-12-2002 00:00
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Anyone remember the star trek ds9 episode "In the Pale Moonlight.?" Sisco tries to trick a romulan senator into thinking the dominion is going to attack them. He's hoping the romulans will join the war on the side of the federation, except the romulan finds out. So Garrack plants a bomb in the romulan's shuttle, and makes the romulans think the dominion did it.

Or for consipiricy theorists, how about the Churchhill's alleged attempts to get us to join the war earlier? slipping munitions onto transport ships which carried american citizens.

Propaganda isn't really a big deal as far as I'm concerned. Its just advertising, which is something all corparations do. Is it suprsising that governments would want to do it also? I imagine America's Army Operationgs game has done a good bit of propaganda for us among foreigners as well. A lot of them seem to enjoy playing it anyway.

 
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