01-01-2003 02:54									#1
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I'm currently at war with the orange AI civ. I take a city that happens to be the orange capital. The civil war thing happens and the orange civ is now orange and yellow. I really like the civil war thing. I remember the first time that happened... . Anyway, so when the empire split the orange capital (i just took it so only my mech unit is showing there) flips from orange to yellow as the civil war results happen. A second later it flips from yellow to blue, my color. The part that is new (for me anyway) is now I control a number of yellow units. They are in the Units supported window on the city screen. Now, control is pretty limited. pretty much only what you can do when you right click on the unit in the support window. But, it's much easier to get rid of those nasty rebels by disbanding them!

Of course, I have the saved game on the current turn.

	01-01-2003 07:55									#2
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Does it continue or disappear in succeeding turns??

If you have the .sav from the turn before, does it repeat if replayed??

Is there a respawned orange civ??

Were the orange/yellow civs allied??

Sorry if the questions are too many. Maybe it's better to keep the mystery for I agree, this is very odd.

	01-01-2003 12:09									#3
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I've had that happen on the Mac version of Civ II as well. I get a lot of pleasure disbanding major units such as armored divisions, battleships and aircraft that, technically, aren't mine (and it doesn't involve activating the cheat menu).

Gatekeeper

	01-01-2003 20:46									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Gatekeeper I've had that happen on the Mac version of Civ II as well. I get a lot of pleasure disbanding major units such as armored divisions, battleships and aircraft that, technically, aren't mine (and it doesn't involve activating the cheat menu). Gatekeeper

But even though it's not technically a cheat... doesn't it feel like a cheat? I mean, the poor AI has enough handicaps....

And I have no idea why that happens... of course normally all the orange units supported by the captured city are destroyed when you capture the city. But I guess in the course of dividing the empire and re-assigning which units belong to the orange and which belong to the yellow civ, the program accidentally rehomes them to the capital.

Did you save before capturing? Were those units you now see on your supported list, supported by the city before it fell? Or were they added during the schism phase?

	02-01-2003 05:08									#5
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MWHC
Do you play on a Mac?

(never experienced or heard of any remote control of enemy units when playing on a PC)

	02-01-2003 23:32									#6
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STYOM:

IMHO, the AI's handicaps are more than made up by the advantages it gets. Besides, I play in "realism" mode, which means no ship chaining, no rings of air bases surrounding cities and no airbases on mountaintops (among other things).

I haven't saved the games in which this occurs mainly because I didn't think much of it at the time. I usually get it every other game, generally because I let the AI civilizations grow to huge sizes if they're not near my starting point (I like modern warfare).

Gatekeeper

	03-01-2003 02:53									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Gatekeeper STYOM: IMHO, the AI's handicaps are more than made up by the advantages it gets. Besides, I play in "realism" mode, which means no ship chaining, no rings of air bases surrounding cities and no airbases on mountaintops (among other things).

Well....... how 'realistic' is it to be able to disband enemy units (over which you otherwise have no control) because of a glitch in the game? I'm not criticizing, or saying my way is the right way... just asking. I admit to shipchaining , but I seldom if ever use airbases. To each his own.

I'll probably never get to the point where splitting an AI Civ is an issue, anyway... it's very rare for me to not be #1 in population, and in those games I pick on the weak, or fly to AC. But, it'd be interesting to see if the units you can control were originally based in the capital you captured... or if they are somehow assigned to it during the schism phase

	03-01-2003 12:31									#8
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STYOM:

True ... to each their own. I don't make much use of airports, either, and ship-chaining is a foreign concept to me.

As for the units, they were probably property of the city in question ... but could have been "assigned" to the city due to proximity during a rebellion.

Gatekeeper

	03-01-2003 17:41									#9
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BTW, who thinks it is realistic to own a caravel which needs more than a millenium to sail across the map ?

	03-01-2003 20:27									#10
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quote: Originally posted by La Fayette BTW, who thinks it is realistic to own a caravel which needs more than a millenium to sail across the map ?

Well, true... and how realistic is it for a troop of horsemen to take 50 years to move 2 spaces? Horses don't even live that long... are we assuming that new horses are foaled and trained from the old ones during that trip?

For that matter the riders don't live 50 years either, back in the 4000 BC era.... anyway...

Hey, I'm not knocking shipchains... it just seems like an exploitation of the rules. It certainly doesn't seem to have been an intended effect. But to make it work, you still have to build several ships and defend the shipchain, which can be difficult sometimes. So there is a cost to running them... a balance if you will.

	03-01-2003 23:51									#11
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Shipchaining may or may not have been intended, but they've been available in Civ I, II and III.

(yes, I use them. )

	05-01-2003 00:04									#12
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well i don't ship chain... just rehome caravans

	05-01-2003 03:53									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Caesar the Great well i don't ship chain... just rehome caravans

Naughty Caesar ... ship chains OK ... but rehoming ... you may as well go into cheat and set your gold level.

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SG(2)

	05-01-2003 04:24									#14
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I don't rehome 'vans either... but if y'all are doing that, I'm going to start reloading bad hut results

	05-01-2003 04:43									#15
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...and bad combat outcomes, too!!

	05-01-2003 05:16									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Bloody Monk ...and bad combat outcomes, too!!

I do that already

	05-01-2003 05:49									#17
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Hey ... [New York Accent] Come on fellas ... dat Caesar guy was just having a bad day ... yeah [/New York Accent]

-----------------

SG(2)

	05-01-2003 06:11									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits Naughty Caesar ... ship chains OK ... but rehoming ... you may as well go into cheat and set your gold level.

and i've been sitting here using my own 2 caravans like a sucker....

	05-01-2003 06:30									#19
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Caesar ... Apolyton always has the answers

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SG(2)

	05-01-2003 10:07									#20
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Bah. If an enemy civilization pisses me off — say, by winning a victory or something — I just go into "GOD" mode and wipe them out w/the "Kill Civ" option or, better yet, create 100 nuclear warheads and drop them on their cities, oftentimes hitting each city three or four times, just to guarantee it ends up back in the Stone Age.



Gatekeeper

	05-01-2003 10:22									#21
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And the winner is...!!!GATEKEEPER!!!!

	10-01-2003 02:12									#22
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I don't see the re-homing caravans a cheat. Sure, I guess from outside the city detail screen you get some message saying it's not allowed... but it works fine from within the city management screen.

You still have to build the caravan and move it to the city you want to support it. I know this has been talked about before here.

But re-loading a game because of a bad hut or lost battle, why on earth play????

	10-01-2003 02:24									#23
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That's what my was for, MWHC.

	10-01-2003 03:11									#24
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quote: Originally posted by My Wife Hates CIV I don't see the re-homing caravans a cheat.

Build a freight in a size 2 city that happens to be a commodity demanded by a fat AI civ. Send it to your capital/SSC and support it from that city and ... bingo you increase its value 10 times.

It's quicker to enter cheat and set your gold level

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SG(2)

	10-01-2003 03:32									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits It's quicker to enter cheat and set your gold level

So true...

	10-01-2003 04:27									#26
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thats why we ban this in mp games

	10-01-2003 04:52									#27
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quote: Originally posted by War4ever thats why we ban this in mp games

You ban the use of the cheat menu? Spoilsport

	10-01-2003 05:59									#28
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hehe, no we ban the use of rehoming but me thinks some players are doing it anyways

	10-01-2003 06:21									#29
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there really is no way of enforcing it, unless of course you go back through endless saves... of course if someone is caught doing this, I doubt they'll be playing with anyone here any time soon

If its legal and everyone does it in MP, I really don't see the problem with it. After all oil drilled in Alaska doesn't generate commerce for Alaska, instead it generates commerce for the city which sells the oil. Taking the goods from one city to another - not terribly unrealistic.

Who cares if its not available in the orders menu, perhaps that was a bug (not like bugs are unheardof in civ2)

	10-01-2003 18:17									#30
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There's no way to enforce a lot of rules in MP games without going back and checking endless saves.

Honor is a must.

RAH