15-01-2003 08:15									#31
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc quote: Lol, we don't believe you are going to come to our assistance. Then why do you come to all of our wars?

Australians just like fighting.

	15-01-2003 08:15									#32
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If China invaded Australia (god forbid) The United States would certainly come and aid...

	15-01-2003 08:16									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse Lol, we don't believe you are going to come to our assistance. And who is *****ing? I like America and Americans. I'm just pointing out some pretty obvious differences we see here all the time. Maybe the problem is Americans are kind of shocked that when the rest of the Western world finds out about the American way, which we hear about here all the time, they say "no thanks" pretty emphatically. That must seem odd since you are "number 1". I mean, when the Romans and the Brits were on top people wanted to copy them. Why don't people want to copy American laws, values, government policies? Take a simple thing like accents, noone wants to speak English like an American. When the Brits were on top, everyone who spoke English in the British world wanted to speak it like a Brit. The American way is explicitly rejected by most Western countries. Why?

1. Cold war, kosovo. Defense spending levels.

2. yeah the language thing is interesting. We are really the most new world of all the offshoots. We had a hard break and it was a while ago. Not like Australia which still drinks tea!

	15-01-2003 08:16									#34
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GP, when was the last time we had to call on you? And as to the rest of the West?

"Never" for us, "WWII" for everybody else. Grow up, man. That was sixty years ago...

	15-01-2003 08:17									#35
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Canadians are sorta like Americans.

	15-01-2003 08:17									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger GP, when was the last time we had to call on you? And as to the rest of the West? "Never" for us, "WWII" for everybody else. Grow up, man. That was sixty years ago...

Cold War.

	15-01-2003 08:18									#37
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Only to Americans. And the last two years haven't done much to endear you to us...

	15-01-2003 08:19									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger (4) Canadian Football is much better

ACK!

	15-01-2003 08:19									#39
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Still they are not the

quote: only country

// edit you should start to count Turkey to the Western countries.. Nato, EU soon soon..

	15-01-2003 08:19									#40
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quote: Originally posted by GP Cold War.

Possibly. But not since the sixties. France and UK had enough a nuclear arsenal to stop the Russians by then, and you know it.

	15-01-2003 08:19									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse Take a simple thing like accents, noone wants to speak English like an American. When the Brits were on top, everyone who spoke English in the British world wanted to speak it like a Brit. The American way is explicitly rejected by most Western countries. Why?

You sure about that? In fact, I think the internet is helping a lot in making the rest of the world speak English like the Americans do.

	15-01-2003 08:19									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger Only to Americans. And the last two years haven't done much to endear you to us...

Don't get excited. It's not about "endearing". Canada and America are closer to each other in mood than either is to UK.

	15-01-2003 08:21									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse War on Terrorism - does anyone else believe in it outside the US? ... The European reaction to the frequent terrorist incidents there.

I think that you forget the Brits.

	15-01-2003 08:21									#44
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse Let's look at a few issues: Gun control - The US is the only Western country that doesn't have it. The death penalty - only the United States executes criminals. Crime and punishment - The US has a prison population about 10 times larger than the Western average. Support for Israel - only the United States is 100% behind Israel. War on Iraq - only Americans claim this is somehow anything but a cynical exercise in power and oil politics. War on Terrorism - does anyone else believe in it outside the US? Note the difference in the muted Australian reaction to Bali and the hysterical US reaction to 9/11. The European reaction to the frequent terrorist incidents there. Guantanamo Bay - The US is the only Western country that thinks its okay to hold prisoners without legal process. Social Welfare - The US, although the richest country in the world, is the only Western country without a social safety net. In some ways the US is more like a Third world country for many of its poorer citizens and nobody seems to have a problem with that. Healthcare - The US is the only Western country that doesn't offer a universal health care scheme to its citizens. Abortion - the only country where the right to an abortion is under serious threat. War on drugs - the only Western country which thinks prohibition is the answer. I mean, don't you find these differences striking? And I've listed just a few.

Alexander's Horse, this reads like a liberal/leftist wish list. The question really should be is why the rest of the West shifted so strongly to the left after WWII while the US did not.

	15-01-2003 08:21									#45
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Depends what you're talking about. Brits are bigger hawks than we are, less socialist, etc.

Only culture is closer. And I'm serious when I say that US attitude is causing a backlash here...

	15-01-2003 08:22									#46
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I don't think this is a troll any more than any other persons' posts. AH poses a good question. Ming, you seem to dismiss this too quickly without even bothering to think about it. Probably because you are defensive about the issue, but hey, I'm no shrink ...

IMO, white, conservative America is the way it is because of the Protestant work ethic. Save, keep money in the family, etc. Throw a mix of religious fanaticism, combined with a little self-righteous libertarianism, a little greedy capitalism; shake, and you get your average American conservative. I just hope that all foreigners don't think that this represents the average American... especially the younger generation. Modern American conservatism and its immoral stances on a variety of issues throughout history, like slavery, civil rights, workers' rights, feminism, and segregation, will soon find itself extinct as the younger, better educated, and more tolerant generation comes of age.

	15-01-2003 08:24									#47
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America is actually the "little brother" except this time the little brother has the power. Americans generally are very ignorant of world issues because quite frankly they dont NEED to know. They percieve it as what they dont know cant hurt them and to "let the politicians decide".
Generally Americans are a quite friendly (contrary to popular belief) people though they dont get quite as close to each other as Europeans tend to (generally speaking). September11th seemed to divide Americans into 2 groups: The ones who suddenly became very open people and actively persuing knowledge about the outside world, and those that, well, didnt. Generally speaking the ones in the former group tend to live on the west coast or in New England and had at least a college education.
I've also observed that the typical American is very stressed out about something whether it be their job or their children or something or another.

Just my observations.

	15-01-2003 08:24									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger Possibly. But not since the sixties. France and UK had enough a nuclear arsenal to stop the Russians by then, and you know it.

1. I beleive that other countries relied on our higher defense spending to allow them to spend less.

2. I don't mean that we defended the Canadians in the sixties or otherwise. (the ocean is good enough.) The battle was joined in the rest of the world. And that was still hot and heavy until late 70's. You can't remember, but there was an incredible mood change from late CArter to early rEagan. People felt like Soviets were on the rise in the late 70's. VietNam, Laos, Cambodia, Angola, Nicaragua.

3. Just as we have an incentive to overvalue our protection of others and our leadership. Others have an incentive to minimze it. It's human nature.

	15-01-2003 08:24									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Ned Alexander's Horse, this reads like a liberal/leftist wish list. The question really should be is why the rest of the West shifted so strongly to the left after WWII while the US did not.

Because the US never saw the horrors of war. It never grew up. It never saw the carnage. And you wonder why so many veterans are against going to war? Sheesh... Americans are ignorant, that's why.

	15-01-2003 08:25									#50
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americans r0x0r!!!!1!! omg phear!

	15-01-2003 08:26									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger Depends what you're talking about. Brits are bigger hawks than we are, less socialist, etc. Only culture is closer. And I'm serious when I say that US attitude is causing a backlash here...

So? You piss us off too. Only reason you don't piss us off more is...you're kind of tiny and we're kind of big.

	15-01-2003 08:27									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I don't think this is a troll any more than any other persons' posts. AH poses a good question. Ming, you seem to dismiss this too quickly without even bothering to think about it. Probably because you are defensive about the issue, but hey, I'm no shrink ... IMO, white, conservative America is the way it is because of the Protestant work ethic. Save, keep money in the family, etc. Throw a mix of religious fanaticism, combined with a little self-righteous libertarianism, a little greedy capitalism; shake, and you get your average American conservative. I just hope that all foreigners don't think that this represents the average American... especially the younger generation. Modern American conservatism and its immoral stances on a variety of issues throughout history, like slavery, civil rights, workers' rights, feminism, and segregation, will soon find itself extinct as the younger, better educated, and more tolerant generation comes of age.

Veterans tend to be more politically conservative and hawkish than the norm. Just go look at some political polling data.

	15-01-2003 08:28									#53
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quote: Originally posted by GP 1. I beleive that other countries relied on our higher defense spending to allow them to spend less. 2. I don't mean that we defended the Canadians in the sixties or otherwise. (the ocean is good enough.) The battle was joined in the rest of the world. And that was still hot and heavy until late 70's. You can't remember, but there was an incredible mood change from late CArter to early rEagan. People felt like Soviets were on the rise in the late 70's. VietNam, Laos, Cambodia, Angola, Nicaragua. 3. Just as we have an incentive to overvalue our protection of others and our leadership. Others have an incentive to minimze it. It's human nature.

The Sovs were going to collapse anyways. Defense spending or no. They were a different situation than the Chinese. Wanted to be the West, not fight them by the 70s. Perceived rise of Communism was nothing more than paranoia caused by social changes tearing through the US and rest of West. It was their last gasp. They were done, and the rational among them knew it.

	15-01-2003 08:30									#54
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quote: Originally posted by GP So? You piss us off too. Only reason you don't piss us off more is...you're kind of tiny and we're kind of big.

We try to be nice to you, though. You literally don't bother. And people are starting to get to the point of wondering if we do need you or not...

	15-01-2003 08:30									#55
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc quote: War on Terrorism - does anyone else believe in it outside the US? ... The European reaction to the frequent terrorist incidents there. I think that you forget the Brits.

We're just humouring you.

	15-01-2003 08:30									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Sava Because the US never saw the horrors of war. It never grew up. It never saw the carnage. And you wonder why so many veterans are against going to war? Sheesh... Americans are ignorant, that's why.

Jbeezus, are you mad? We never saw the carnage, when we lost, what was it, nearly 300 thousand men?

	15-01-2003 08:30									#57
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quote: Originally posted by GP So? You piss us off too. Only reason you don't piss us off more is...you're kind of tiny and we're kind of big.

Actually, most Americans really don't know much more about Canada than the maple leaf....And thats probably a good thing

	15-01-2003 08:31									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger And I'm serious when I say that US attitude is causing a backlash here...

So?

	15-01-2003 08:31									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Sava Because the US never saw the horrors of war. It never grew up. It never saw the carnage. And you wonder why so many veterans are against going to war? Sheesh... Americans are ignorant, that's why.

Perhaps. But we had our Vietnam and Korea. Both were nasty and failed to achieve victory.

	15-01-2003 08:31									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger The Sovs were going to collapse anyways. Defense spending or no. They were a different situation than the Chinese. Wanted to be the West, not fight them by the 70s. Perceived rise of Communism was nothing more than paranoia caused by social changes tearing through the US and rest of West. It was their last gasp. They were done, and the rational among them knew it.

Very much hindsight. Sure, the right may have exaggerated the threat. But the left did not predict the fall. Very, very 20/20 hindsight. Read some stuff from the 70's. Heck even look at the 70's red liberation movements in Europe, etc. Different mood back than.