03-02-2003 04:38									#1
	Making the friend-to-girlfriend conversion Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Help would be appreciated.

	03-02-2003 04:39									#2
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A lot of alone time in a private place.

	03-02-2003 04:41									#3
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Grab her ass, but be subtle about it.

	03-02-2003 04:45									#4
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Keep smiling and pretend you're listening to her while you put pills in her drink

	03-02-2003 04:50									#5
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additional challenge:

She is a supermodel.
She is very smart.
You don't know her.
Your name is Quasimodo.

	03-02-2003 04:52									#6
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Agreed.

Get her drunk.

	03-02-2003 04:56									#7
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Nah, it usually doesn't help your long-term prospects to vomit on your prospective girlfriend, nor does it help to induce them to vomit. Also, flacidity is not your friend.

Just do something like grab her ass, but be real casual about it. Then when she says something like "Hey, you're grabbing my ass," reply by saying something like "Damn straight! Wutang!" Your mileage may vary, of course.

	03-02-2003 04:56									#8
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This happened to me three months and two days ago, and I look forward to seeing her again after the three months we have been apart.

I didn't actually do anything here, but I realise what set her thinking. The Spice Girls actually said it best here - no, seriously. "If you wanna be my lover, you gotta get with my friends". I have been friends with her for a year and a half, and over that time had become very good friends with her best friends/flatmates. I guess it helped that my best friend dated her best friend for a while as well. All this time our friend circles were merging, and wherever I went, she was there too. What finally convinced her that I was worthy were her friends' attitudes to me. They were my friends as much as they were hers, and friends always want to see you happy. Whilst some of their boyfriends were away a couple of them started compensating through other relationships and friends, and there were the two of us - both single, both got on really well, both known to these people very well and both deemed to be compatible.

Insert mild amounts of alcohol to lessen inhibitions a little and BANG - she asked me out.

	03-02-2003 05:05									#9
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Long private discussion is the way to go. A little bit of alcohol helps to lose inhibition, but you won't have anything meaningful if you get her drunk, or if you're drunk yourself.

	03-02-2003 05:28									#10
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It really helps if you are more aquaintances than really close friends. Then she isn't risking something she might regard as valuable (your friendship) for something that might be risky (a romantic relationship). If you have already gone past the point of aquaintanceship you can still win her, but it's a tighter line you must walk. To your credit you should have a lot of understanding about what she wants and who she is (that is unless you do all of the talking). Working against you is the comfortable relationship that you already have, that could be ruined effectively by a romance gone awry.

I would take every opportunity to be there when she might be open to an approach, ie when she is drunk (not puking, can't remember last night drunk, just inhibitions lowered having a good time drunk) or lonely etc. Don't be obvious, just be there. If it is meant to be she will fall into your arms when the time is right.

	03-02-2003 05:34									#11
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quote: Just do something like grab her ass, but be real casual about it. Then when she says something like "Hey, you're grabbing my ass," reply by saying something like "Damn straight! Wutang!" Your mileage may vary, of course.

Change "grab her ass" to "stick your thumb up her ass" and you have my exact recommendation. I guess I'm a little bit more forward than Loinburger...

Wutang!

	03-02-2003 06:35									#12
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I'd prefer not to make that conversion

	03-02-2003 06:57									#13
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I'm 14.75, she's barely 14, so the get her drunk option isn't really viable.

I'm one of two best friends if that changes the picture. I'm close to her friends, and she's close to mine, but my friends and her friends aren't.

	03-02-2003 07:08									#14
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Well, does she know how you feel?

I made this same conversion at that age, and it was tight. We were friends, we went out for a bit, and then we went back to being friends. Things were a little tense since I ditched her at the homecoming dance, but we all got over that stoned mishap.

	03-02-2003 07:29									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Felch X Well, does she know how you feel?

No, and that is why I am asking about the best way to tell her.

	03-02-2003 07:30									#16
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http://www.intellectualwhores.com/ladderintro.html will enlighten you on how hard the leap will be...

	03-02-2003 08:39									#17
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Just tell her. Go up to her, this is hard to do, and say what you like about her (if tits or ass, say it's her "eyes"), and leave it at that.

The more casually you put it, the more conversational it feels, the better she'll take it. Just put the idea in her head that you're interested in her, and let her respond in due course. You have to be patient, since she is a friend, but if she likes you, she'll say something nice about you. And that's when you have your chance.

	03-02-2003 08:42									#18
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Just kiss her

	03-02-2003 08:48									#19
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ooops you're 14.

Sweat talk to her

	03-02-2003 09:06									#20
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Ari, that is the greatest website I have ever seen. It's insightfulness has hurt my brain. Thank you...

	03-02-2003 09:23									#21
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Ari,
That is a brilliant link.
A lot of truth in that theory.

	03-02-2003 09:39									#22
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I respectfully disagree.

There are a ton of parameters that screw up that ladder system in real life IMO.

What if "high on the ladder of Jane" Bob discovers that jane and him have so much in common makes him feel good, connect with eachother etc and they get together?

Happens.

There are many astathmitoi paragontes


plus this is nothing but the typical theory of a guy who's bitter.


and here's what he writes in his site

quote: Criticism:You're just bitter. Answer:Maybe I am. But ladder theory made me that way, my bitterness did not make ladder theory. Attack the theory, not the person behind it. And why does everyone always say I'm bitter just because 99.999% of chicks are *****es?

right. sorry to bust your admiration for that site. I just dont agree with it

	03-02-2003 09:44									#23
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quote: What if "high on the ladder of Jane" Bob discovers that jane and him have so much in common makes him feel good, connect with eachother etc and they get together?

First of all, Jane and Bob were together. Bob had all the power in the relationship because of the disparity between their ladder rankings.

In your scenario, Jane would move up on Bob's ladder. Bob would stick with her until he found someone better...

	03-02-2003 09:47									#24
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Not exactly since in that theory the primary quality that puts jane so down in bob's ladder is looks. And the main quality that puts Bob so high in Jane's ladder is money. (which BTW is largely wrong as a critiria - and mainly comes from poor sods that can't get laid)

However unexpected creation of funny fuzzy feelings between the two, which the ladder doesnt take into account at all, can screw up the entire system and there's no provision for them in that theory.

	03-02-2003 09:51									#25
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10% of the male pie chart was devoted to things other than looks and sluttiness. That's where your funny, fuzzy feelings are accounted for...

	03-02-2003 09:53									#26
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I used to use the "Kadoonk" method. A time honoured and successful method for those who can't stand long courtships.

What you do is wait for an appropriate time and attempt to kiss her (the "kadoonk"). Don't fart around, just plant one on her. Before doing this form a hunch as to whether she's actually interested in you - there is no way of telling for sure but just go with your gut feeling.

Two things can happen now.

(1) A really great snog.

(2) Some form of rejection.

If (2) and she asks you why you did that, just say, "I wanted to see what you would do." and leave it at that.

I'm married to a woman I used this method on, so it does work.

Some other advice: if you are only 14 don't go overboard on the physical stuff. It tends to scare women more than guys at this age (well it doesn't scare guys at all, but there you go).

And you better tell us how you get on.

	03-02-2003 09:55									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten 10% of the male pie chart was devoted to things other than looks and sluttiness. That's where your funny, fuzzy feelings are accounted for...

And that's wrong. The fuzzy feelings are one of the catalysts, the unstable, unforseable parameters that renders the whole system useless and wrong.

Why do you think hot babes are hanging out with short bald penyless **** ugly face men sometimes?

Just for his inner virtues? (read d!ck?)

No because they connect. Because he is offering her something she needs and didn't find anywhere else. (on a higher than physical level).

and vice versa

	03-02-2003 10:05									#28
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Not just looks Paiktis - many ugly non rich blokes have nice girlfriends/wives - it's force of personality.

	03-02-2003 10:08									#29
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That's what I'm saying Agathon. Force of personality or that undefinable (and thus unmeasurable and non fitting in any system) something that make them connect and be together.

	03-02-2003 10:14									#30
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I think you need to read it more closely, paiktis. The "intangibles" are mentioned in both the male and female pie charts.