14-05-2003 05:44									#31
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btw... who's going to give us Engineering? ND?

	14-05-2003 06:47									#32
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IIRC ...

GF and his goons extorted it from Vox.

Vox wanted something like 200g for it, but we threatened to pull our support of their war, if they didnt discount it heavily.

They reluctantly agreed to sell it for 30g.
I know Vox are still pissed about it...and would be even more pissed if they know we are screwing them over even further, by reselling it.

See Betas comments in the last email I got from him ...

We have talked to ND. They say they are on our side. But other than nice words of support - there has been lttle in the way of substantive support. Not even a deal for engineering - which is a bit frustrating. (I hope you have not made a deal with them. Given you are getting it for 30 gold - which still aggravates many Voxians. Particularly as this came on the heels of you giving 200 gold to GS for feudalism.

Regs

	14-05-2003 06:59									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Hot_Enamel GF and his goons extorted it from Vox.

Guido and Nunzio aren't goons.

	14-05-2003 08:21									#34
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb Guido and Nunzio aren't goons.

200g to 30g.... damn we're good!

	14-05-2003 23:44									#35
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ouch... thank god Vox has nowhere else to turn to. But dont forget that Vox may hold a grudge for this.

	15-05-2003 02:24									#36
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Perhaps we can present the case that GS has agreed to pay us 200 gold for Chivalry and out of respect for our the position of Vox we aren't selling GS Chivalry and thus giving up 200 gold.

	16-05-2003 04:40									#37
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ok

	21-05-2003 09:56									#38
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Due to the uncertainty regarding ND and the possibility we might have to withhold on selling Feudalism to the other teams, I will refrain from giving ZargonX a definitve answer on the trade deal just in case he mentions it in the chat...

	26-05-2003 01:04									#39
	Remove this text

From Vondrack:

quote: Lego-GoW Theo+Edu/Feu+Chiv trade draft Sorry for the mixup on our side. Here is a draft of the trade agreement informally agreed upon with GF and Panzer32: quote: Legoland-GoW Theo+Edu/Feu+Chiv trade agreement 1) Legoland agrees to provide GoW with Theology and Education. GoW agrees to not resell/trade/gift these techs to any other party for 20 turns from receiving Education. 2) GoW agrees to provide Legoland with Feudalism and Chivalry. Legoland agrees to not resell/trade/gift these techs to any other party for 20 turns from receiving Chivalry. 3) Legoland agrees to not attempt to build Leonardo's Workshop as long as GoW remains in the game. 4) GoW agrees to not attempt to build Sistine's Chapel and Bach's Cathedral as long as Legoland remains in the game. 5) The trade shall happen right after the last of the four techs is discovered. First, Theology shall be traded for Feudalism, and one turn later, Chivalry shall be traded for Education. On behalf of Legoland: vondrack, The President As there is another team offering us Feudalism at a reasonable price, we would appreciate hearing from you back soon. Best regards, vondrack

That "other" team is of course GS.

	26-05-2003 01:06									#40
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btw, the 20 turns seems perfect IMO, hopefully by then RP will be a crippled wreck.

	30-05-2003 06:37									#41
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deal annuled by Lego: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...304#post2045304

	31-05-2003 13:20									#42
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New Deal:

quote: Greetings, people of GoW! (all three of you ) Legoland has always wished to be on the best terms with Glory of War. In order to make this more than just hollow words and to demonstrate our good will and genuine desire for peaceful coexistence and close cooperation, we have decided to honour the trade we discussed, though never signed. As we were, in the meantime, while our negotiations stalled a little bit, able to acquire Feudalism from another source, we would respectfully ask for two minor modifications to the previously proposed agreement as a sign of good will from your side. Legoland-GoW Theo+Edu/Chiv trade agreement 1) Legoland agrees to provide GoW with Theology and Education. GoW agrees to not resell/trade/gift these techs to any other party for 20 turns from receiving Education. After these 20 turns, GoW agrees to not trade Theology to any other team, unless that team also agrees to not build Sistine's Chapel as part of the trade. 2) GoW agrees to provide Legoland with Chivalry and its World Map. Legoland agrees to not resell/trade/gift Chivalry to any other party for 20 turns after receiving it. 3) Legoland agrees to not attempt to build Leonardo's Workshop as long as GoW remains in the game. 4) GoW agrees to not attempt to build Sistine's Chapel and Bach's Cathedral as long as Legoland remains in the game. 5) The trade shall happen right after the last of the three techs is discovered. First, Theology shall be sent as "accepted" to GoW. On the next turn, GoW will send "accepted" Chivalry and its World Map, and Legoland will send "accepted" Education.

	31-05-2003 13:25									#43
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20 turns seems rather quite a long time IMO considering we might need the $$ for the RP war. On the other hand, well, there's probably going to be no-one at the time who will have $$ to trade for these techs other than GS maybe.

H_E has suggested we pressure them with regards to our initial deals in which we gave them techs. Unfortunately since I do not know the details, it is necessary that one of the "veterans" of the team (Panzer or H_E) be present during negotiations.

Vondrack is usually up all night, after 11-12am EST he's usually in the ISDG chat. Perhaps H_E would like to join us as his time-zone is most compatible.

H_E, please tell me if you'd be willing to talk with vondrack with me, what day, and we'll try and fix an time with him.

	31-05-2003 16:50									#44
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It seems they are going to give us 2 techs for one anyway.

ND already sold the BOB map to Lego when they made first contact, so I see no reason why we just give it to them with the deal.

I would like their map...but they wont give it. The deal above is pretty good...I say we take it.

ie Send acceptence ASAP

I am getting rw (real wife) grief about my internet usage. Too much Unreal Tournament with the mates, too many PBEM's, and she is wants help with some accounting assignments.
So committing to a chat time is difficult....I will see what I can do.

If I hook up with him...it will be completely informal. I have calmed down from my last rant..the above deal is good. I think we need to accept it.

	31-05-2003 16:55									#45
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

P.S. 20 turns is probably good.
Lego & RP are most likely aligned...so if we lock them in a deal to NOT send them Chivalry, then I think we grab it.

Thus another point. Vox, will be pissed when we dont send any troops, they will be doubly pissed that we attack their ally RP....so if we do sell them Chivalry, you can guarantee it will be giving to RP.

We must stop RP from getting Chivalry...
20 turns delay fron Lego
Dont sell it to Vox
Sell it to GS for 200g, and they cant sell to RP.

Regs

	03-06-2003 05:10									#46
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I cant find an appropriate time for a chat with Vondrack.

If we havent accepted the above tech deal yet ... do so ASAP

It's a 2 tech for 1, and I doubt we will get any better.

	03-06-2003 07:21									#47
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If anyone from GoW is able to chat with someone from Lego, tell them we will accept the deal, and see if they accept it.

On a related note, I haven't seen MZ around for a while... wonder if his internet's down??

	03-06-2003 21:59									#48
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I'm "here"...

as I said in the other thread, no internet access at home, I'm using the school computers, so I can't access IRC either.

I HOPE to have access back this afternoon, or at the most tomorrow.

	04-06-2003 00:36									#49
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From Legoland:

quote: a copy of our PM to Master Zen: Greetings, people of GoW! (both two of you ) Legoland has always wished to be on the best terms with Glory of War. In order to make this more than just hollow words and to demonstrate our good will and genuine desire for peaceful coexistence and close cooperation, we have decided to honour the trade we discussed, though never signed. As we were, in the meantime, while our negotiations stalled a little bit, able to acquire Feudalism from another source, we would respectfully ask for two minor modifications to the previously proposed agreement as a sign of good will from your side. [quote]Legoland-GoW Theo+Edu/Chiv trade agreement 1) Legoland agrees to provide GoW with Theology and Education. GoW agrees to not resell/trade/gift these techs to any other party for 20 turns from receiving Education. After these 20 turns, GoW agrees to not trade Theology to any other team, unless that team also agrees to not build Sistine's Chapel as part of the trade. 2) GoW agrees to provide Legoland with Chivalry and its World Map. Legoland agrees to not resell/trade/gift Chivalry to any other party for 20 turns after receiving it. 3) Legoland agrees to not attempt to build Leonardo's Workshop as long as GoW remains in the game. 4) GoW agrees to not attempt to build Sistine's Chapel and Bach's Cathedral as long as Legoland remains in the game. 5) The trade shall happen right after the last of the three techs is discovered. First, Theology shall be sent as "accepted" to GoW. On the next turn, GoW will send "accepted" Chivalry and its World Map, and Legoland will send "accepted" Education. On behalf of Legoland: vondrack, Vice-President & Military Architect

Sent a reply to Lego, saying the GoW accepts this agreement.

	04-06-2003 00:38									#50
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just the wording of the acceptance:

quote: Thank you Vondrack; I'm writing on behaf of MasterZen who is currently experiencing internet problems that the agreement is accepted by the Glory of War. Thanks Panzer32, temporary Emperor and current Consul of Internal Affairs of the Glory of War.

	04-06-2003 03:08									#51
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Thanks Panzer

I hope this situation doesn't repeat itself... unless I'm strapped for cash again at the end of the month!

	04-06-2003 03:54									#52
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Just want to let you know, I emailed Vondrack last night telling him that we were going to accept the deal.

He emailed straight back and said great, and that he would PM us with the latest agreement, and would request that someone "agree" by reply PM.

Then the US internet link crashed, and I could not access Apolyton.

But it looks like it turned out OK

Regs

	10-06-2003 08:21									#53
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Just had a quick chat with Zargon.

quote: [ZargonX] hey Panzer [ZargonX] may I speak with you for a bit? [Panzer_32] hey there [Panzer_32] sure [ZargonX] Well, basically, I just wanted to talk about the world situation with you, as it were [Panzer_32] ok [ZargonX] how are things going for GoW these days? [Panzer_32] fine [ZargonX] [ZargonX] how do you all feel about the developments on Estonia? [Panzer_32] I think that GS is going to control Estonia eventually [ZargonX] it does seem that way, yes [Panzer_32] basically Vox either needs somewhere to go or they will be wiped out. [ZargonX] how are your relations with GS? [ZargonX] you don't have to answer that, of course [Panzer_32] I don't mind... we're cordial with them [ZargonX] and how is the situation on Bob now? [ZargonX] stable? [Panzer_32] we're trying to work with GS and Vox to get a solution soon [ZargonX] ah, that's good [Panzer_32] yeah, Bob is stable at the moment [ZargonX] GoW as peace negotiators... how unexpected [ZargonX] well, I didn't really have a point for this chat, per se [ZargonX] but we feel it's a good time in the world to reforge diplomatic bonds [ZargonX] and we value highly our relation with your people [Panzer_32] The Bob situation may be sort of a ballence of power though [Panzer_32] no one power wants to war with another b/c the third will gang up on them [ZargonX] yes, I could see how that would be a sticky situation [Panzer_32] yes, our teams have always been good friends... opposites attract I guess [ZargonX] We think it's a mutually beneficial relationship for all involved [ZargonX] and your team has always been fair and honest with us, which is more than we can say for others... [Panzer_32] One of the possibilities for the Vox solution would be for them to settle somewhere on Legoland continent... what do you say to this? [ZargonX] no one has spoken to us directly about it yet [ZargonX] so as of yet, we really haven't had a proposal to comment on [Panzer_32] We do value both fairness and keeping contracts [Panzer_32] right, but what do you think of the basic concept of it? [ZargonX] well, it is a possibility [ZargonX] of course, it'd be something that'd have to be negotiated out [Panzer_32] I'm just wondering because there has been quite an amount of talk about it as well as other plans in our forum. I wondered how active the discussion has been in other teams forums [ZargonX] we've basically been holding off speculating about it until Vox contacted us directly [Panzer_32] ok... Vox seems reluctant to realize that they need to get off Estonia if they want to survive [ZargonX] I guess they're sort of hanging in with all they've got [ZargonX] I'm sure we'll hear something soon from them if things keep up [Panzer_32] Even with Roleplay's Iron, whatever financing youre giving them, as well as whatever support we can give them w/o compromizing our own security can't really compete with GS and their economy. [ZargonX] Has RP confirmed to you that they're giving Vox iron? [Panzer_32] not officially I believe... but its sort of taken for granted [ZargonX] in a recent talk we had with RP [ZargonX] they sort of gave us the impression that they were bowing out of the whole affair [ZargonX] we might have been misunderstanding them, though [ZargonX] but a powerful GS would be a problem for the Bob situation, you think? [ZargonX] if one team and GS allied against the others [ZargonX] sorry... got disconnected randomly... [Panzer_32] yes, it would (powerful GS). But there are some things we can't really influence too much [Panzer_32] I hadn't posted when you were disconnected [ZargonX] [ZargonX] yes, changing the GS situation would be difficult at this point [ZargonX] well, that pretty much covers it [ZargonX] like I said, just a friendly catch-up chat [Panzer_32] ok... you got disconnected; do you want a transcript at all? [ZargonX] if you don't mind, that'd be great [ZargonX] first rule of diplomacy: write it all down [Panzer_32] ok [ZargonX] oh, one other thing... [ZargonX] in regards to our tech deal... [Panzer_32] ? [ZargonX] do you have an ETA on Chiv? [ZargonX] so we can time the trade for Edu [Panzer_32] chivalry should come in about 7 turns [ZargonX] oh, great! that should time quite nicely [Panzer_32] oh? [ZargonX] I mean, with the arrival of Edu [Panzer_32] edu coming at the same time? [ZargonX] 2 turns later, I believe... [ZargonX] but I can't get into the forum to check for sure... [Panzer_32] ok, 2 turn delay isn't a big deal [Panzer_32] we probably won't be building universities any time soon [ZargonX] [ZargonX] I'll PM you with a firm figure when I get the save [Panzer_32] no, thats ok, don't bother. Just tell us when your'e getting close [ZargonX] no problem! [ZargonX] anyway, have to run for a bit! [ZargonX] been nice chatting with you [Panzer_32] ok, I'm just about to send the log to you [ZargonX] great, thanks! [ZargonX] talk to you later! [Panzer_32] bye [ZargonX] so long!

A couple of things that might be true:

1. Vox is reluctant to admit they will be defeated; they will be VERY reluctant to be assimilated into GoW.

2. Legoland might not be as closely linked with Roleplay as we think.

3. Roleplay might not actually be sending Vox Iron.

	10-06-2003 09:46									#54
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1. we don't need to assimilate the whole team. Maybe get Beta and Konquest would be enough. (Beta handling GoW's public information! )

2. true. That works even more in our favor

3. Hopefully on thursday we'll convince them to

	10-06-2003 22:27									#55
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Betahound seemed very blatant about the fact that Vox was defeated. The fact that told us to keep our troops on Bob and not even send them tells you they realize their postion.

	26-06-2003 23:26									#56
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just a small chat with Vdrack:

quote: vondrack> hello, Panzer! vondrack> u here? Panzer32> yeah vondrack> just briefly checking - any ETA on Chivalry? Panzer32> 190bc vondrack> 2 turns to go then, right? Panzer32> yes vondrack> we should be done with Edu in 150BC vondrack> 5 turns from now Panzer32> ok, great! vondrack> yeah, that will work nicely... vondrack> vondrack> ok, that's all - won't keep you any longer Panzer32> ok, see you later

	07-07-2003 12:29									#57
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quickie chat with Zargon. They want Astronomy for Invention. Sound's fine wit me...

quote: Session Start: Sun Jul 06 23:23:59 2003 Session Ident: ZargonX Session Ident: ZargonX (~jhaddock@pcp402982pcs.mntcrm01.md.comcast.net) [23:23] [ZargonX] Hey MZ! [23:24] [MasterZen] hey [23:24] [ZargonX] Just wanted to let you know, we have sent Theo on to you this turn as part of the Lego-GoW tech agreement [23:24] [ZargonX] Edu will be forthcoming after that [23:24] [MasterZen] ah ok! [23:24] [MasterZen] good, you shall get the merchandise in return [23:24] [ZargonX] Excellent [23:25] [ZargonX] We would also be interested in discussing another round of trades, if you are all willing [23:25] [MasterZen] sure, what are you guys going for? [23:25] [ZargonX] Well, we are assuming you are going down the Invention route... [23:25] [ZargonX] and we will be going for Astronomy [23:26] [ZargonX] If you are indeed going for Inv, we would like to possibly work out something for those [23:26] [MasterZen] yes that sounds ideal [23:26] [ZargonX] Excellent! [23:26] [MasterZen] Astronomy for Invention... [23:27] [ZargonX] Yes, we feel that would be beneficial to all [23:27] [MasterZen] hey, as long as no two teams research the same tech, it is [23:27] [ZargonX] heh, very true [23:27] [ZargonX] I will write up a draft proposal, and PM it to you shortly [23:28] [MasterZen] great [23:28] [ZargonX] Sounds good! [23:28] [MasterZen] we'll most likely agree to it [23:28] [ZargonX] Wonderful! As always, a pleasure working with you! [23:30] [ZargonX] Anyway, I'll have that draft soon [23:30] [ZargonX] and I'll be around; just shout if you need me [23:31] [MasterZen] ok

	18-07-2003 18:45									#58
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A quick email chat with Vondrack

quote: Hey, Just a quick question while I am on-line. How far away are you from finishing the Sistine Chapel ? We want to switch Imperial City over to it as a prebuild, but dont want to find ourselves screwed, if you all of a sudden finish it. It goes without saying, that I or any member of the GoW will not reveal such information to any other team. Can you say that you will not build it in 20 turns ?

quote: 20 turns... that's a long time and a lot can change (and will change, once we discover Astronomy and start trading luxuries). I could very well give incorrect estimate/assurance here. But you have my word that if you happen to have a problem with the lack of prebuild wonders to switch your Imperial City project to, we will help you out by providing Music Theory with an eternal NDA for free. Music Theory allows another 600-shield wonder, Bach's, which you waived in favour of ours, too - making the tech useless for you (thus "for free").

	20-07-2003 08:40									#59
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from vondrack.

quote: Hello, Master Zen! No problem, a luxury would be a good balance, I think (come to think of it, I believe you'll always have at least one luxury we will not have - wines, so that one would be safe to include). Be so kind and get back to us once you have an idea about the balance. Though... we'd appreciate if it's possible to finalize the deal in the foreseeable future - deals that are "informally agreed to" may sometime take rather unfortunate turns, exactly because they're not finalized and the parties involved have slightly different understandings what they "informally agreed to" (just remeber what happened to our Theo+Edu for Feu+Chiv deal... that was one such "informally agreed to" deal - and still...). Anyway - can you give us at least an approximation of the Invention ETA? We should be done with Astronomy within 15 turns. Best regards, vondrack

I think we should get this deal on the road ASAP, and accept Muisc Theory from them. What do you guys think? I'll draft something in the next couple of days.

	20-07-2003 19:49									#60
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Yes we need to strengthen relations with Lego to prevent them siding with someone against us.

Last edited by GhengisFarb on 21-07-2003 at 06:33