10-02-2003 04:48									#31
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Apparently Alexander the Great has been used in some pretty bizarre nationalist propoganda. Seems that, for some inexplicable reason, everybody wants to claim Alexander the Great as their own.

	10-02-2003 04:50									#32
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The most popular bisexual ever!

	10-02-2003 04:50									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Gangerolf canada, cause the greeks are busy arresting plane spotters and gamers

actually, we are currently busy arresting terrorists

	10-02-2003 04:53									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Man, how sad to have one's sense of national pride...

quote: The most popular bisexual ever!

ok, where's your third attempt at a good troll?

	10-02-2003 04:55									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov The most popular bisexual ever!

How is this a troll?

Oh, wait...sure, if you think bisexuals are somehow bad then I can see why you might think that is a troll.










*Cough*Bigot*Cough*

	10-02-2003 04:57									#36
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I think he's pointing out the irony in you expressing pride in AtG as an alternate sexuality type person immediately after making fun of people for expressing pride in him as someone born near where they were.

	10-02-2003 04:58									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger I think he's pointing out the irony in you expressing pride in AtG as an alternate sexuality type person immediately after making fun of people for expressing pride in him as someone born near where they were.

I don't think he was being that clever.

And I wasn't expressing that with any pride. I'm not a bisexual, after all.

	10-02-2003 04:59									#38
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Ah, but you are (as I so creatively phrased it) "an alternate sexuality type person".

	10-02-2003 05:00									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger Ah, but you are (as I so creatively phrased it) "an alternate sexuality type person".

Even so, I certainly don't need AtG to validate my identity! After all, I have Michaelangelo and Abraham Lincoln for that.

	10-02-2003 05:00									#40
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG political separations of ancient greece (e.g. the autonomous greek city-states) should not be confused with the cultural unity of the ancient greek people (language, customs, religion, etc etc)

Why the hell not? Do you think that there is a sudden and massive change in language, customs, religion, etc. every time you hit a national border? Your "nationality" is defined by what political unit you live in, not to what you may have cultural unity with. I'm not American, even though I share all of the necessary cultural unifiers you point out.

	10-02-2003 05:03									#41
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quote: The most popular bisexual ever!

trere are only two possibilities:
1) you trolled, thinking i would not like the idea of a "national hero" being a bisexual
2) you didnt troll, in which case you were cheering for the great bisexual ever. you interest to bring up bisexuals in a thread that noone had mentioned anything about sex could only mean one thing.....

	10-02-2003 05:04									#42
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Since the ancient Hellenes considered the Macedonai to be barbaroi, why should we dispute them? Hellas needs to get over itself. They're just Greek speaking Turks anyway.

	10-02-2003 05:07									#43
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quote: actually, we are currently busy arresting terrorists

oh so that's what you call plane spotters and gamers now?

quote: Your "nationality" is defined by what political unit you live in, not to what you may have cultural unity with. I'm not American, even though I share all of the necessary cultural unifiers you point out.

nationality in the old days and today are two quite different things.

back then, nationality was culture + language.

nowadays it might be what you said.

	10-02-2003 05:09									#44
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG quote: The most popular bisexual ever! trere are only two possibilities: 1) you trolled, thinking i would not like the idea of a "national hero" being a bisexual 2) you didnt troll, in which case you were cheering for the great bisexual ever. you interest to bring up bisexuals in a thread that noone had mentioned anything about sex could only mean one thing.....

Ohhh you...

1) The comment was actually directed at the nationalist/white supremacist Web sites, which would certainly object to the notion. The fact that you immediately took umbrage at it as a "troll" directed at you is...interesting...
2) There is such a thing as irony, and I have occasionally been capable of it. Sometimes...
3) What's wrong with Socrates? Just because you guys also killed him doesn't mean you can't make him the idol you worship for national self-esteem. Okay, sure, he's a highly fictionalized character, but that shouldn't bother you, considering you insist on making Alexander Greek.

	10-02-2003 05:10									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Kontiki Why the hell not? Do you think that there is a sudden and massive change in language, customs, religion, etc. every time you hit a national border?

actually this is the case for my national borders. i dont know about yours...

quote: Your "nationality" is defined by what political unit you live in, not to what you may have cultural unity with.

when i talk about nationality i mean ethnicity(and this is certainly how anyone would understand history tv's quiz). you might not make that distiction....

	10-02-2003 05:12									#46
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Since the ancient Hellenes considered the Macedonai to be barbaroi

untrue

	10-02-2003 05:48									#47
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By what I've read in my history book the Macedonians were half greek and half slavic. culturally, they were totally greek though.

BTW, to the greeks "barbarian" wasn't an insult, it simply meant a person who wasn't greek.

	10-02-2003 05:56									#48
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Modern Greeks simply aren't objective on this issue. They've been taught since birth that Phillip and Alexander were great Greeks, and no amount of historical evidence to the contrary will convince them otherwise. The rest of the world can draw conclusions which are different from Greek national myths.

Odin, the ancient Macedonai could not have been Slavs, since the Slavs didn't invade the Balkans until after the Huns, Avars, and Bulgars (yes I know that today the Bulgars are Slavic but back then they were Turks).

	10-02-2003 06:22									#49
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quote: Odin, the ancient Macedonai could not have been Slavs, since the Slavs didn't invade the Balkans until after the Huns, Avars, and Bulgars (yes I know that today the Bulgars are Slavic but back then they were Turks).

1) I thought that the slavs were "pushed" west and south by the the Huns and the Avars? you know, the great migration of people.
2) Bulgars are even today not very slavic. They're mixed.

	10-02-2003 13:20									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Odin By what I've read in my history book the Macedonians were half greek and half slavic.

actually slavs didnt come to the balkans until 600ad

	10-02-2003 13:22									#51
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara no amount of historical evidence to the contrary will convince them otherwise.

what historical evidence?

	10-02-2003 15:26									#52
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Caliming that the gReeks of 2500 years ago are the same as the Greeks today is the same as saying modernAmericans are the same as the people running around killing buffalo 2500 yaers ago

	10-02-2003 15:33									#53
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quote: Originally posted by TheStinger Caliming that the gReeks of 2500 years ago are the same as the Greeks today is the same as saying modernAmericans are the same as the people running around killing buffalo 2500 yaers ago

depends on the definition of "same"

btw, modern americans killed the ancient americans so they are definately not the same

	10-02-2003 15:36									#54
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Greeks of 2500 years ago, succesful political, cultural and scientific nation.
Greeks today.....
Proof if proof is needed

	10-02-2003 15:39									#55
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quote: Originally posted by TheStinger Greeks of 2500 years ago, succesful political, cultural and scientific nation. Greeks today..... Proof if proof is needed

Greeks today: presiding the largest economic force in the world: the EU

	10-02-2003 17:34									#56
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Odin, the ancient Macedonai could not have been Slavs, since the Slavs didn't invade the Balkans until after the Huns, Avars, and Bulgars (yes I know that today the Bulgars are Slavic but back then they were Turks).

At that time the Balkans were inhabited by Thracians. Later the Slavs invaded the region. When the Bulgarians invaded the Balkans the dominant population was the slavs.
The Bulgarian state that was formed in 7AD united the Slavs and the Bulgarians into one nation. The Slav population effectively assimilated the Bulgarian population so Bulgarians ara Slavs and Bulgarian is Slavic language.

	10-02-2003 21:46									#57
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I think the real question here should be: What's a Greek doing watching Canadian History TV?

	10-02-2003 23:37									#58
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG get your facts straight! the most succesfull Greek in history is our current prime minister

ROTFLMAO

That was a great joke

	10-02-2003 23:48									#59
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BTW Macedonians were Greek.

An Athenian tried to refered to them as Barbarians in order to persuade the rest of the Greeks not to ally with them.

Whatmakes the matter "sensitive" is that FYROm a new country and prompt to nationalistic expansionist propaganda has tried to establish a link with ancient Macedonians in order to push for an expansion to the south.

It was in its constitution that they had the right to attack Greece.
And it was in their flag: the Macedonian ancient symbol

and it was in their name which is the throny issue.

Greece forced them to change their constitution and their flag by imposing a crushing embargo on them and thus IMHO protecting the balkans for what could be very bloody years ahead.

The "Macedonian question" has been evaluated from hsitorians and analaysts of many decades as thenext cause of war in the Balkans since 3 countries wanted to claim the original lands of macedonia. in the end it was devided between greece and serbia and a tiny part went to bulgaria.

	10-02-2003 23:54									#60
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 An Athenian tried to refered to them as Barbarians in order to persuade the rest of the Greeks not to ally with them.

Demosthenes. Tpical of modern media and some hystarians to elevate the the rhetoric of one firebrand into being the opinion of a people.