15-02-2003 08:06									#1
	pc.ign.com ign review Full PM-box? Change here!

argh! Damn insider only. . .

	15-02-2003 08:27									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Would anyone like me to e-mail them the full review?

Here's some quotes from it:

quote: While they're considering their reply, let me tell you in confidence that I've played through several MOO3 games and worked through diplomacy with different races. It has to be said that Quicksilver has done a superlative job in building a sense of distinctive intelligence for each, less dependent upon a fixed characteristic than on a complex mix of independent goals, strengths, weaknesses, and perceptions about the rest of the universe. The AI here isn't quite as devious and nasty as human intelligence, but it has yet to leave me wondering at insane or stupid decisions.

quote: . As admiral, I only needed to give each task force the most elementary of commands. The grand picture was mine. The ship AI was truly competent enough to handle the rest.

quote: . Diplomatic AI has never been anywhere near as clever as in MOO3, for instance. Combat has never been so strategically focused. Colony development has never been so detailed and intensive, and computer opponents so well-balanced that literally any of them could win.

quote: Despite MOO3's complexity, I've actually found it a more absorbing game than either of its predecessors. (And that's despite giving MOO2 a high review rating in 1996, and periodically keeping it on my computer for months at a time, ever since then.)

You'll be happy to know that the vote has been changed to 'yea' as well. A small thing, but nice.

After reading this, I'm simply astounded by how great this game sounds. The game gets knocked on some presentation points, but man, there is so much...coolness involved. No spoilers either.

Well worth my signing up to IGN for a 7-day free trial.

	15-02-2003 09:03									#3
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Kalbear...Me, please! Can you PM a copy to this slobbering, drooling, I-can't-wait-any-longer mess?

Thanks

	15-02-2003 09:19									#4
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Kalbear, please check your private mail again, thanks!

	15-02-2003 09:21									#5
	Put an end to popups!

I'd like to say that PMing using these boards is the most annoying thing ever. Talk about your counterintuitive interfaces...

gunnergoz, the check is in the mail.

	15-02-2003 09:48									#6
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"Sadly, there's no option to win MOO3 jointly, in full alliance with another race. This was something Alpha Centauri did well."

Oh why, why are these things left out? If you have to betray your allies to win the game why have allies to begin with?

	15-02-2003 10:03									#7
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Well, CIV3 didn't have alliance games either, right?

	15-02-2003 10:07									#8
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quote: Saves are a bit annoying - unlike Moo2, it saves only the beginning of the turn, not anything during, so any actions you've taken aren't recorded

I hope they can patch this.

	15-02-2003 10:07									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Civ3 isn`t a measure of anything.

	15-02-2003 10:25									#10
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Thanks kalbear.

	15-02-2003 14:20									#11
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by kalbear Would anyone like me to e-mail them the full review?

	15-02-2003 17:51									#12
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by BleedTheFreak Well, CIV3 didn't have alliance games either, right?

Exactly. Civ3 is the perfect example of how not to make a good TBS.

	15-02-2003 22:00									#13
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quote: Originally posted by kalbear You'll be happy to know that the vote has been changed to 'yea' as well. A small thing, but nice.

YESSSSSSSS!!!




I meant.. Yay!!

	15-02-2003 22:02									#14
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by wildman45 I hope they can patch this.

Yeah, it would be nice, but not a big deal. Just keep a mental note not to save at the end of your turn.

Besides, after a good night's rest, I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't notice somethings you wish you had or hadn't done in the course of a saved turn. I know I do.

	15-02-2003 22:33									#15
	Tired of ads?

Nah, it's not likely that they completely redo their savegame system. They obviously had a good reason to make it save only completed turns in the first place. I guess it has to do with MP games being saveable and interchangeable. Confusing for SP though, especially for those cheat0rs who are used to saving before every major battle.

	15-02-2003 22:55									#16
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quote: Exactly. Where it gets frustrating is when it doesn't save the state of the Sitrep; so when you reload a saved game and hit the spacebar to see the Sitrep, you only get a blank screen. That Sitrep screen can be very handy when you're processing dozens of developments all over your empire, and I've come to count upon it to clue me on the "state of the game."

Now, I'm I understanding that sometimes the sitrep does not
show up even when you save the game at the next turn?

	15-02-2003 22:58									#17
	Inflate your Upload Space

Yep. According to the reviewer, when you reload the saved game the sitrep is gone, which is very annoying. He got around it by taking a printscreen of the sucker.

That's a bug, right there, but again, not a big one.

	15-02-2003 23:26									#18
	Suffering from ads?

Last edited by RolandtheMad on 15-02-2003 at 23:31

	16-02-2003 05:23									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

looks like MoO3 is a great game then, at last

	16-02-2003 06:54									#20
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quote: Originally posted by kalbear Yep. According to the reviewer, when you reload the saved game the sitrep is gone, which is very annoying. He got around it by taking a printscreen of the sucker. That's a bug, right there, but again, not a big one.

I don't necessarily agree that it's a bug...more likely a deliberate design decision, perhaps an oversight...but I doubt it's a bug in the traditional meaning.

Could it have to do with the save game file sizes? Or with MP? I never play MP and have no idea...can you even interrupt an MP game and come back to it?

	16-02-2003 06:57									#21
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

When you reload a saved game the... Sit... rep... dis... a... ppears...?

*sigh*

I kinda hoped they were gonna catch stuff like that... but s'ok, it won't break up the flow much for me, unless I find myself save/reloading a lot (which would be my own problem).

I'm glad the reviewer enjoyed the game, it bodes well

	16-02-2003 07:04									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

The reviewer didn't appear to just enjoy the game. The reviewer sent his review in, went and defended it against the hungry hordes of IGMOO, went to sleep, defended it some more and went back to playing the bastard.

Now that's some love.

It's a bug. It might not be something that's broken, and in theory it's by design, but it's not correct or intuitive behavior; the game is losing information when you save, and that's bad news.

	16-02-2003 07:11									#23
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quote: Originally posted by kalbear went and defended it against the hungry hordes of IGMOO

That's not just love, that's bravery of the first order!

	16-02-2003 07:26									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Cedayon When you reload a saved game the... Sit... rep... dis... a... ppears...?

Its an unintended feature!

BTW - A new AAR

This ensures I`ll never have Orion Presidency on as a victory condition.

	16-02-2003 08:50									#25
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quote: Originally posted by RolandtheMad This ensures I`ll never have Orion Presidency on as a victory condition.

Yeah no kidding.

	16-02-2003 10:07									#26
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quote: [Turn 220] I have lost!

	17-02-2003 00:15									#27
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quote: Originally posted by RolandtheMad Oh why, why are these things left out? If you have to betray your allies to win the game why have allies to begin with?

Game's called 'Master of Orion', not 'Master of Orion and all his tag along allies.

	17-02-2003 00:22									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Whether or not you want to turn off the Senate Victory option will probably depend on the other settings at the beginning of the game (i.e. your species, size of galaxy, etc.) and whether or not you start the game as a member of the Senate. If you start out in the Senate, I believe you will have a much better chance of thwarting any other players' attempts at Senate Victories.

And I suppose that if you have the "Starting Senate Member" trait set to random for the species you're playing, then you could just keep restarting until you get a game where you start out in the Senate. But that wouldn't be any fun, now would it?

	17-02-2003 00:24									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by gunnergoz Could it have to do with the save game file sizes? Or with MP? I never play MP and have no idea...can you even interrupt an MP game and come back to it?

Yes you can. You can even switch the players around, have AIs take over human empires or have humans take oven an AI empire. Useful for when someone can't make it or when a new player wants to join. Or when you just want a change around.

	17-02-2003 00:46									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Darkrenown Game's called 'Master of Orion', not 'Master of Orion and all his tag along allies.

I know you`re trying to be funny but this really irks me. Another game of shallow allegiances and allies of convience. Why can`t the Master of Orion be the Human-Nommo alliance, or the Humans and their assorted fiefdoms?