04-03-2003 19:30									#31
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quote: Originally posted by rah And I think the disadvantages of being white are overrated. The only problem time is between 3250 and 2000. (assuming RH and 2x1x, in 1x1x the problem period lasts longer).

I never noticed disadvantages to being white, what are they?

	04-03-2003 19:43									#32
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Barbs are a little more annoying given the turn order, and black map clicking is not so useful if you are on continent 1.

	04-03-2003 20:10									#33
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Yes, moving first, no response time to rush build an extra defensive or an offensive unit when barbs come on surprise.

And yes, many years ago when I used to take white in MP games, black clicking didn't always work, you wouldn't get the continent number. That has never happened when I'm not moving first. (don't know if that changed with any of the patches, but I assume not.)

RAH

	04-03-2003 20:13									#34
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I meant that if you are cont. 1 you cannot tell the border between your landmass and the main body of water. I was not aware of the problem you mention.

	04-03-2003 20:23									#35
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Rah, I determine the starting position advantage in the following ways:
1) pennisula or no pennisula- the host almost never starts on a thin pennisula, almost always in the meat of the cont
2) river system- the host has about a 30% chance of starting on the largest river system on the mapand non-host less then 20%
3) nearby huts- host generaly has 2-5 more huts in same radius as non-host
4) centralized location- expansion in all directions ( harder to defend but a big advantage none the less)
less corruption etc.
5) better resources- about 30% of the time host starts with a resource in starting city radius (20% for non-host)
I was even talking about going first.

	04-03-2003 20:46									#36
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quote: Originally posted by StrategicKingMi I was even talking about going first.

Thanks for posting that so quickly, but your last comment didn't answer my question clearly enough for an old man like me.

So I'll try again.
Are these stats for the white civ (or first positioned civ) which is what I believe based on experience.
Or are these the stat for the host? (I usually start near a coast and not in the middle.)

	04-03-2003 21:31									#37
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quote: Originally posted by DrSpike Barbs are a little more annoying given the turn order, and black map clicking is not so useful if you are on continent 1.

I usualy play without barbs so thats no problem.

And in an Island game I prefer being on island 1.

Guess all depends on setings

	04-03-2003 23:55									#38
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That is the biggest bunch of bullshit I have ever seen. Your "statistics" are a joke and have no evidence to back them up. You just pulled them out of the air. I can't begin to count how many times I have been stuck without resources or sandwhiched between water or starting on a pole as host. So what is the setting you are the greatest player at this year? I remember when you used to call yourself the greatest on my settings until you realized you couldn't beat me and that you would never beat me. Then it was no hut maps, then it was giga maps, then it was premade maps, it was island maps, then it was 1x1x, then it was 2x1x, make up your mind.

	05-03-2003 00:06									#39
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You just have to love the irony of the above post appearing in this thread...

	05-03-2003 00:51									#40
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So, MalevolentLight, when you host, do you always take white? And how much do you consider it an advantage?

Reading through those stats, the only one that I'll say my experiences validates is #4. I think there's a propensity for the first placed civ to be nearer the center of the map. The other stats, I've never really payed attention too. (especially since I don't select white) But one of my buddies that always takes white seems to start nearer the middle in most games.

RAH

	05-03-2003 02:39									#41
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by StrategicKingMi 4) I HAVE, AND WILL NEVER EVER CHEAT IN A GAME

Do you mean you have cheated but will never do it again? or that you have not and will never ever cheat?

	05-03-2003 03:03									#42
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Strate's poor grammar aside I think the meaning was clear......he has never, and will never, cheat in a game.

	05-03-2003 03:08									#43
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I usually choose blue, but the only advantage of being white is that you get to go first.

	05-03-2003 03:24									#44
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So in your experience, there isn't a higher propensity for the first placed civ to be place near the middle and subsequent placement nearer to the edge (or away from the first placed) ? hmmm, this could probably be quite easily tested using coordinates. Maybe I'll do that.
It would be worth knowing.

	05-03-2003 04:15									#45
	Got spare money?

depending on the amount of players in a game, does the color mix dictate anything?

does going first, regardless of being host give better land/huts

the luck factor from huts is supposed to even out in the long run , and i am sure it does, but some people seem to get alot of four legged units, and others seem to get archers.....

also, can we yet determine whether or not taking a hut from a different angle can/will produce different results, or is this just part of the random factor.

i had heard a rumour years ago, that approaching huts from differnt angles can produce differnt results

	05-03-2003 05:51									#46
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I think that rumour did not stand up to testing.

	05-03-2003 05:55									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: I've been in a few other forums......where making a post that's obvious flame bait is just as bad as the idiots who flame. ^_^

Frank Johnson:

It helps when you're the mod.

	05-03-2003 08:46									#48
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Excuse me, is Eyes trying to say that I am versitile because I played this game so many different ways? Yet, I am accused of not being this by Apolytoners, hmmm, very interesting.
Second, i did not make up thoose numbers, I have about 100 saved games in my computers vastly bloated memory, they bare this out. I further set up hundreds and hundreds of games and have anyalized the start positions of both players. I examine every game I play and reveal the starts at the end of the game.
And no, it has to do with who hosts. The computer gives the host advantages such as techs and settlers to make up for bad starts. Now, when they have a better start, they have no extras. Most players of course play "clean" starts so it is therefore logical that most starts by the host will be good and play bares this out in reality.
And, no Eyes, at your settings, since between compatant players, it is a 50% proposition. You are winning less then this because when faced without a quick win, you will quit. And since I find the way you play virtually skill less, and subject to the ole double computer trick not to mention boring and very limited the days of you being on my play list has been far removed.
Another reason, is that I never bring up the fact that I used to beat you with regularity on your own settings untill after you lie and brag and use that wonderfully selective memory of yours of games played 5 years ago where I had not the information needed to play on thoose settings such as city guiding since I was used to playing my civnet and civ 1 and just started playing non-hot seat games.

	05-03-2003 08:52									#49
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I suppose a "not" should be insurted...
"4. I HAVE NOT, AND WILL NEVER CHEAT IN A GAME"
(I type to fast and am far too lazy to reread my brilliant writing)

	05-03-2003 09:02									#50
	Tired of ads?

We may argue settings and what a valid way to play is...

But there is one thing I can respect you for... You seem to be an honest player, and nobody has EVER accused you of cheating...



Without honor, winning is meaningless

	05-03-2003 19:13									#51
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Please see

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...510#post1789818

for more discussion on hosting.

RAH

	08-03-2003 08:13									#52
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How to be great:

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

Yep, that sums up my knowledge on it. BUT, at least people want to play with me.

More than I can say about some folks.

	08-03-2003 12:11									#53
	Inflate your Upload Space

16) Never ever play against european or australian guys

17) know every 4-letter-word in at least 5 languages

18) call your second PC "skill"

19) never ever play on a fair map made by somebody else

	08-03-2003 13:56									#54
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cobra

	08-03-2003 16:56									#55
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But whoo is trully BEST in all?

In onlies tampere i know two players whoos are better mee... Soo maybe i am... Average.
(but i not know how good at Rasbelin is )

	08-03-2003 21:56									#56
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adn tsi lal giberbish ot em

	09-03-2003 09:15									#57
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wow, only took me 2 min to understand

	09-03-2003 16:14									#58
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quote: Originally posted by War4ever adn tsi lal giberbish ot em

I must agree with this

	10-03-2003 21:47									#59
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Stop the game and say that modem kaputt!

	10-03-2003 22:06									#60
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by ottok Stop the game and say that modem kaputt!

Note to those that do this. Kill the task right, because it's pretty funny when I get the message that their civ has retired, then they claim it was the connection. The message that you've lost connection is much more believable.