09-03-2003 08:24									#1
	Withdrawing from a League with no Honor Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I no longer have any use in playing league games. The players have no honor. 3 games in a row I had just the ugliest start and ended the game in 5 mins. Nothing was earned from these games. Nothing was reafirmed. Yet i have had 2 games where the otherside could not win and did not report cause i have a code of honor about this game. Bring a league into the equation and all players are concerned with is winning and not getting better, doing something different and having an interesting game. these people in the league just real are very bad and given equal starts get buried. Its the same old thing as it was in the wayning days of game league. This league is doomed by the very members it currently has. So who ever is in charge of this league remove my name from the league, it just sucks really bad.

	09-03-2003 09:12									#2
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Some players insist on reporting gaes over by 3600bc.............

	09-03-2003 14:32									#3
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blah, blah, blah.

You are so full of yourself. It is ranked, of course they want to win.

You think Kurt Angle will let Brock win the title because he tried really hard?

	09-03-2003 15:18									#4
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

So let me get this straight... if you have a bad start and you quit, it doesn't count?

And if you are lossing, but don't report it, it's ok and you don't really lose...

Am I missing something?

	09-03-2003 16:26									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Using this method , none of us will ever lose.

	09-03-2003 17:26									#6
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Hehe not to get in the way of the Strate trolling but I firmly believe for ladder games you should be able to request a restart (a limited amount obviously ) for the first few turns, like in the "silly kraut" league.

Last edited by DrSpike on 09-03-2003 at 19:33

	09-03-2003 19:31									#7
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Although strat sometimes seems to talk of little other than bad starts,in this instance its a fair point.

When playing in a ladderit seems silly to count games where one party is at a huge andblatant disadvantage.

Itsvery iddifuclt to quantify these things of course but I think most ladder players should be able to come to an agreement about reasonable starting poisitions.

I'm not talking about restarrting because the other guy got 3 specials, but if you are in a hopelesssituation, such as a pole or whatever.

In a ladder game I would feel happy to allow until BC 3200 or so to ensure both players get going. Otherwise there isnt much point playing the game.

Of course all of the above applies to duels. In 3+ player games, good luck!

	09-03-2003 21:07									#8
	Put an end to popups!

Genmax: strate is the first to offer a restart at 3500 when its obvious you have no chance in hell.

It is a 2-way street.....

	10-03-2003 00:18									#9
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He has never offered me a restart, offered many rematches. I do not believe I have ever played Gary in a ladder game...maybe I have...

My point is this, if you want to allow your opponent(and yourself) a restart in a bad situation, FINE. This should be agreed to during the setting negotiations. NOT whined about afterwards. If we agree to restart in 3600bc if conditions are bad for any player, that is fine with me. BUT, if we are playing, and in 2700bc some idiot finally explores his land to find he is on an island, or next to a dominent civ and DEMANDS a restart, then no. If you get a settler or advanced tribe in your first few huts, and your opponent gets masonry, an archer and 50 gold, no a restart is NOT in order.

This is the point I was making months and months ago about using premade maps. Assure yourself enough land and distance from other civs(and them from you, a "fair" and "even" start), and remove huts.

Flaming an entire membership of a ladder, because a player did not "Honor" your request of a draw, is rude and immature. You apparently are neither of those Gary, so act like it.

	10-03-2003 00:31									#10
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And yet somehow I'm 14-1. Guess I'm just lucky.

	10-03-2003 04:33									#11
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quote: Originally posted by MalevolentLight I'm 14-1.

1 loss, how can that be?

	10-03-2003 18:14									#12
	Tired of ads?

Allowing restarts up to certain time changes the game. (example-you settle your capital and your second settler finds a hut. In a normal game unless I think I'm already behind I don't open that hut with the settler.) Under a restart limit I can open it and if a barb kills the settler, ask for a restart. Or waiting a turn or two to open a hut so you don't get pimped on the tech path. Don't worry, if you get unlucky, ask for a restart. NO RISK, NO CHOICE, PURE LUCK, NO SKILL.

	10-03-2003 18:17									#13
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That's why it has to be a small number of requests available to you........IIRC the German league uses 1.

	10-03-2003 19:33									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I guess having just one would minimize my objections, For duels anyway.

	10-03-2003 19:37									#15
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

In German league its customary that both players can call 1 restart before 3500.

Good system imo

	10-03-2003 20:03									#16
	Put an end to popups!

Is the German League exclusively duels?

	10-03-2003 20:10									#17
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No it isnt, but I think the restart system only aplies to duels though.

	10-03-2003 20:28									#18
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So if I'm understand this correctly... Did somebody not allow SK the "customary restart before 3500" and is saying that it wasn't agreed to before the game?

	10-03-2003 21:31									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Let me shed some light on exactly why StrategicKing is resigning himself from the ladder.

His combined record in finished league games is 1 win and 3 losses, and 2 of those losses have embarrasingly come from people he considers to be complete newbies, cardcounter and JerryCawling.

It seems that after getting beat by these "rookies" and having written a post about being the "greatest player ever" in these forums," his pride could not accept the sad, sad truth -- he is perhaps the worst player in being able to recover from a bad or less than an average start. Against players like JC, who started playing this game like 2 months ago, an advanced player needs nothing but a forest within his capital to win a single-handed victory. Apparently, winning without a special resource even against a newbie is beyond the reach of StrategicKing, the self-proclaimed greatest civ player.

If he didn't like the league rules as written, then he should have come to some kind of an agreement (i.e. one restart before 3500 BC, etc) with the opposing player *prior* to the game. The fact that StrategicKing did not report two-ish lopsided wins does not give him the right to complain that two other players did not have "honor" because they did not do the same for him. There was no such an agreement prior to the game. Were they supposed to read Strate's mind? Apparently, such an understanding existed only in StrategicKing's mind, which of course wanders about many issues all the time.

The sad fact is that, all of the things written about StrategicKing in these forums is mostly true. He is the biggest whiner of poor starts, is *never* willing to fight when he is down early (he resigns or quits before you can fry an egg), and is terrific at boasting about his great wins in which the opposing player fought like hell to overcome a poor start.

I learned from StrategicKing about many facets of the game and for this I am grateful. However, I am also grateful that I did not inherit his weak heart and a stomach unable or unwilling to battle "losing" positions.

Honor? What does he know about honor? What honor does he have in quitting games in which the opposing player pops a settler or two from huts? There is no honor in that, and he certainly would be the last person to have the right to accuse others of not having honor.

Added later: Strate, I'm sorry about this post, but you really annoyed and disappointed me when you refused to credit those two legitimate, albeit quick, wins. I had to speak out on this issue.

Last edited by Spartan_RawB on 10-03-2003 at 21:41

	10-03-2003 21:42									#20
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Bring on the popcorn and beer.

	10-03-2003 21:51									#21
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quote: Originally posted by MalevolentLight And yet somehow I'm 14-1. Guess I'm just lucky.

When a former, big-time cheater has such a record in league games, I can only look away and smile.

	10-03-2003 22:04									#22
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Smile all you want... But iff you want to acuse him of cheating in recent/new ladder games, provide proof.

	10-03-2003 22:10									#23
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So robbie, what strategy have you written lately? Last I checked everyone plays a horseman rush and goes monarchy with knights. I set the standard for this game, what have you done? You're every bit as much of a whiney ***** as strat is. Only difference is you don't claim to be the best since you know the only people you can beat are newbies.

	10-03-2003 22:12									#24
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quote: Originally posted by MalevolentLight You're every bit as much of a whiney ***** as strat is.

Please enlighten me. What did I whine about?

Sean blahs on: "Last I checked everyone plays a horseman rush and goes monarchy with knights. I set the standard for this game..."

Wow, the typical Eyes' claim to fame. "I wrote so and so strategies and these are posted in so and so website, so I'm to be worshipped and my toes shall be suckled."

So tell me, Eyes, did you put this on your Gap resume? Is that how you got the minimum wage job?

	10-03-2003 22:28									#25
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Somehow even a ladder that hardly anyone here plays on still manages to bring amusing threads to the forum.

Keep it up.

	10-03-2003 22:39									#26
	Got spare money?

Way to change the subject robbie, I take it you concede to me your inadequecy in civ2. So you want to talk about my life do you? Foolish robbie, truly foolish. I think your constant zone messaging me about beating me down on the forums and "making me cry" shows just what a loser you really are. I doubt you've ever been in a fight your entire life. Still tutoring people in math (a subject any idiot can learn) for a measly 30 bucks an hour? You probably don't know but I work for a sports franchise now and run the city of Jacksonville. We go into apartment complexes and set up sports camps and afterschool activities. It's very good money, more than you will probably ever make. For all intents and purposes I'm my own boss. I'm 20 years old and running my own business. Have fun teaching math.

	10-03-2003 22:54									#27
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I'm still waiting for you to write your novel robbie. Make sure you use paragraphs and "comma splices" as you have advised me. I on the other hand will keep it short and to the point. No need to waste time on the unworthy.

	10-03-2003 23:07									#28
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It's been like a half hour and you are still writing? Good luck. I'm going to go get a haircut so that should give you an extra 20min or so to write your 3 pages.

	10-03-2003 23:07									#29
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Hey folks... If you want to abuse each other on lack of skills or strategy... fine.

But lets leave the personal crap out of it.

	10-03-2003 23:14									#30
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Edited by ming again.

If you ever edit a post back after a mod has edited your comments out, you will get a long restriction.

Last edited by Ming on 10-03-2003 at 23:29