26-03-2003 23:30									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Sava "Think for yourself, don't rely on the words of 2000 year old dead people" - Sava 59:22-12 I think that there was a man named Jesus that lived who had some good things to say. But I don't believe in the whole mythical walking on water crap. And I think his original followers somehow managed to make their cult a religion. I don't believe there will be a "second-coming" because I don't even believe in the "first-coming", so-to-speak.

Don't look now, but you're named after the patron saint of the Serbian Orthodox Church. I'm not suggesting you change your name, but you should probably know that you share it with a first-milennium patriarch.

	26-03-2003 23:34									#32
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Like every time he 'returned' previously : as soon as a big event occurs, and some religious lunatics see a deep biblical meaning in this event and its correlation with the fulfilling of the prophecy.

Edit : I give it a year, at most.

	26-03-2003 23:37									#33
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Christ knows

	26-03-2003 23:44									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Elok Don't look now, but you're named after the patron saint of the Serbian Orthodox Church. I'm not suggesting you change your name, but you should probably know that you share it with a first-milennium patriarch.

I'm quite aware of my name and where it comes from ...
BTW, tons of names come from religious roots. Ironically... Sava is my patron Saint. But I was directly named after my great-grandfather who was a veteran of two world wars. Personally, I don't see how the origins of my name are relevant. I would hold the same religious views regardless. Maybe I should change my name to Jesus. That way, when people exclaim "Jesus Christ" in frustration, I can respond with, "Yes?".

	26-03-2003 23:48									#35
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What is the white stuff dribbling from Heaven?

The coming of the Lord.

What is the white stuff dribbling from Heaven, but with lesser intensity?

The second coming of the Lord.

Why are you groaning?

	27-03-2003 00:11									#36
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I am an agnostic - I have no reliable information on the existence of God. Christ existed though and I believe in what he said.

So banana.

	27-03-2003 00:17									#37
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I see some people REALLY WANT TO GET RESTRICTED...

LAST WARNING FOLKS... TOAST TIME FOR PEOPLE WHO CONTINUE TO SPAM THIS THREAD.

	27-03-2003 00:23									#38
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IMO, the thread should have been closed immediately.

A question like this, especially considering the source, is frivilous at best.

	27-03-2003 00:27									#39
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Why... because somebody believes, and you don't...

If it's frivilous at best, people can ignore it and it will drop like a rock.

If people who believe want to answer seriously... fine.

If you spam, you are toast.

	27-03-2003 00:33									#40
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this is worisome
'

I am Christian, but do not believe that Christ is coming back 9

out of 25
'
Jon Miller

	27-03-2003 00:42									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Why... because somebody believes, and you don't... If it's frivilous at best, people can ignore it and it will drop like a rock. If people who believe want to answer seriously... fine. If you spam, you are toast.

Believes?? Believes what?
And this isn't spam, it a question and an opinion.

The question was asked by an Atheist that promptly hauled ass after posting it, and has been responded to primarily by Atheists.


No, don't say anthing about "Life Styles", but baiting Creationists is all fine and good.

	27-03-2003 01:25									#42
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I don't care...

Spam... (or continue discussing whether its a valid thread or not) and you are toast.

Stay on topic...

	27-03-2003 01:26									#43
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quote: Interesting that so many avowed Atheists have an interest in this subject.

Because a high (though not all) percentage of atheists actually use their brains to think about this kind of stuff, whereas a great many Christians (though not all) don't bother and just accept things blindly.

	27-03-2003 01:29									#44
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See you in 24 hours BustaMike...

Anybody else want to ignore the warning...

	27-03-2003 01:31									#45
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quote: Doh. You thought Rabbi Yehoshua is a Christian? I never should've trusted that neurotic what's his name, Saul, Paul, he kept changing names all the time.

*sigh*, I did add a smilie. I know Christ is a Jew...

As for his return, I'm surprised at the number of Christians who do not believe Christ will return. Why do you feel he won't come back, as he promised?

	27-03-2003 01:35									#46
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He will come back, and soon... I am going to say around 2015ish.

He will come in on Planet X and will cry upon the world, which will still be at war, or totally hurting (less than 80% of its current pop). He will revise the dead and taken them on his planet and leave.

Oh, well.

Go Raelians!!

	27-03-2003 01:37									#47
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They aren't Christians, Obiwan. That's the jist of my complaint.


And this isn't spam.

	27-03-2003 01:39									#48
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See you in 24 hours Japher...

Anybody else want to be a wise ass...

	27-03-2003 02:38									#49
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand IMO, the thread should have been closed immediately. A question like this, especially considering the source, is frivilous at best.

If you want to post what you think please do so.

I started this thread because I don't entirely understand the minds of Christians, and I'm making an effort to do so better.

I want to, in this thread specifically, get a feeling for how apocalyptic the average Christian is. I am making no judgments here.

I expected the spam, but I'd like the thread to continue in a more serious vein.

For the non-Christians this is not the place to question the entire belief in Jesus as the Messiah. Vote for banana and move on.

	27-03-2003 02:40									#50
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Why have so many folks voted for the second last option?

quote: I am Christian, but do not believe that Christ is coming back

I have no problem with this belief, but I didn't expect it to be so widespread. I was under the impression that the overwhelming majority of Christians believed that the Second Coming was indubitable.

Can someone who believes this please explain?

	27-03-2003 02:48									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger If you want to post what you think please do so. I started this thread because I don't entirely understand the minds of Christians, and I'm making an effort to do so better. I want to, in this thread specifically, get a feeling for how apocalyptic the average Christian is. I am making no judgments here. I expected the spam, but I'd like the thread to continue in a more serious vein. For the non-Christians this is not the place to question the entire belief in Jesus as the Messiah. Vote for banana and move on.

I would ask a christian freind..

Jon Miller

	27-03-2003 02:53									#52
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I know what my very few Christian friends believe. I asked here to get a broader view on a specific question.

	27-03-2003 02:59									#53
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I used to be all into the end time stuff, convinced that we had less than 100 years. The Jehovah's Witnesses firmly believed the end times started in 1914 and that not everyone alive at that time would pass away before Christ came again.

After seeing prediction after prediction fall away. After an intense study of Revelations, I am only convinced of one thing. No one knows when and how it will occur. I am convinced that something big is in store for humankind and its all part of God's plan, but when is beyond me.

I too am curious about Christians who don't believe in the return of Christ. To me its a fundamental tennant of Christianity as recorded in the gospel and preached by the disciples and Paul. Of course there is no law against such a belief, but I am pretty certain you would have a hard time espousing that belief in any Christian church. If there are Christian churches who accept that belief I'd like to know who they are.

	27-03-2003 03:16									#54
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They are usually called "amillennialists," meaning they don't believe in a literal return of Christ and concommitant 1000 year physical reign on Earth. They see the whole Apocalyptic vision as allegory. The belief is surprisingly common in some denominations (Lutheran, for ex).

I'm more curious in how the "I am Christian, but do not believe that Christ is coming back" voters define the former part than how they explain the latter part.

	27-03-2003 03:56									#55
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quote: by straybow They are usually called "amillennialists," meaning they don't believe in a literal return of Christ and concommitant 1000 year physical reign on Earth. They see the whole Apocalyptic vision as allegory. The belief is surprisingly common in some denominations (Lutheran, for ex).

Amillennialists believe Revelation to be allegory, but they still believe in the return of Christ. The apostles creed is accepted by the Lutheran Church and it clearly says "He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead" The return of Christ as judge is central to Christianity, I don't think you can easily cast it off and still be a Christian in the full sense of the word. I don't believe any Christian preacher would preach the message that Christ isn't coming back.

Its a big world out there, I'm sure there are many flavors of faith, but I'd like confirmation from a Lutheran that they reject the return of Christ as an essential article of faith. It would be news to me.

	27-03-2003 04:20									#56
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I believe he will return and I was raised as a lutheran
(even though I was baptized as a roman catholic), this year I will definitely make my official change to lutheranism.

	27-03-2003 09:17									#57
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH Fluffers are girls employed to 'prepare' male porn stars for their scenes.

Silly question, but how do they do that exactly, dare i ask? I know it's not the right post to ask, but the mind boggles!

	27-03-2003 09:33									#58
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What part of my warning did you not understand...

Lung is restricted for 24 hours

	27-03-2003 18:23									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Frogger Why have so many folks voted for the second last option? quote: I am Christian, but do not believe that Christ is coming back I have no problem with this belief, but I didn't expect it to be so widespread. I was under the impression that the overwhelming majority of Christians believed that the Second Coming was indubitable. Can someone who believes this please explain?

The word Christian has taken on many meanings over the years. Martin Luther King jr. did not believe in the literal return of Jesus for example. Nor did he believe in the resurrection of Jesus in a literal sense. In fact, he called the idea that one could die in the place of another and thereby atone for sins "bizarre." Of course MLK and others of like belief are called Christian. But that is really like calling the Pope a Protestant.

The name now means almost nothing as far as I am concerned. From every wierd corner you will now find someone calling themselves Christian. MLK would be called by some a "social" or "liberal" Christian. Others would say that he should not have even used the name. There was a time however when a Christian was one who believed in the teachings of Jesus and lived out those teachings with the same spirit of compassion and humility that he was of. To say that Jesus will not return is to say that he is a liar. That in my view is not a Christian belief.

	27-03-2003 18:34									#60
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Well, I was raised Catholic, so of course I don't know anything about what the Bible says. But I do remember an interesting argument that biblical scholar Elaine Pagels makes (in The Gnostic Gospels) that many, maybe even most, of the Biblical references to Christ's return imply that it will happen within the lifetimes of the apostles. Is that a reasonable reading? Because he's really, really late.