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Promethus
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Battle Creek, Michigan
Jan 2002
time: 00:27
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Well I have always maintained that if you had to be "Licensed" to be a parent there would be a lot fewer of them. Is this a "Fair" verdict?
Couple Guilty of Assault in Vegan Case
By GREG RETSINAS
A Queens couple who fed their baby daughter a strict vegetarian diet, including homemade infant formula, were convicted yesterday of nearly starving her to death.
A jury in State Supreme Court found the couple, Joseph and Silva Swinton, guilty of first-degree assault and two lesser charges. They were immediately taken into custody. Each faces 5 to 25 years in prison.
The case, described in some headlines as the Vegan Baby Trial, attracted widespread attention beyond the couple's Queens Village neighborhood. Prosecutors said that as exotic and sensational as it sometimes seemed, the facts were plain enough: a diet with no dairy products or infant formula is not adequate for a newborn child, and the parents should have known better.
"This community spoke through the jury and indicated that the weakest will be protected," said Eric Rosenbaum, the prosecutor. "The law protects children."
The results of the Swintons' care, prosecutors and medical experts said, were disastrous. By the time the authorities intervened when the child was 15 months old, she was toothless, had rickets, broken bones and internal injuries. She was severely malnourished and weighed 10 pounds — less than half the normal weight for a young toddler.
The girl, IIce (pronounced ICE), will be 3 in July and has been living in foster care since the authorities took her from her parents in November 2001. Prosecutors said yesterday that IIce was "now on the growth scale," and was physically progressing, but doctors suspect that she has neurological damage.
Lawyers for the Swintons said they would appeal the verdict, noting that the first-degree assault charge included a finding that an offender had depraved intentions. Part of the Swintons' defense had been that they were not knowledgeable enough about child nutrition and did not realize that they were endangering their child until hospital workers told them that IIce was sick.
"I don't see justice here," said Christopher Shella, a lawyer for Mrs. Swinton. "That they made the wrong choice doesn't make it depraved, given how much they cared about their child."
Mrs. Swinton, who is 32, gave birth to IIce at her home three months prematurely. They never received prenatal or postnatal care. In an interview yesterday as she waited for the verdict, Mrs. Swinton said she had been a wayward, 300-pound young adult when she decided to adopt the vegan diet. She and her husband of seven years, who is also 32, have been on it for several years.
Mrs. Swinton said she chose not to breast-feed IIce. After trying to feed her different kinds of commercial baby formula for several months, the couple decided to put her on a natural foods diet. Examining the label on commercial baby formula cans, Mrs. Swinton said she tried to replicate the chemical composition with natural ingredients, including ground nuts and puréed fruits and vegetables.
"We were brand-new parents trying to do everything we could for her," Mrs. Swinton said yesterday. She was rueful, noting that she had "never even got a speeding ticket" and now faced prison.
Amy Lanou, the nutrition director for the Washington-based Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine, testified during the three-week trial that both vegan and vegetarian diets would allow breast milk, and barring that, soy-based baby formula.
Mr. Rosenbaum, the prosecutor, said the care given to IIce was akin to what a child might offer to a "pet gerbil." He said that no matter what the parents' intentions, their failure to seek any type of medical care as IIce's condition worsened merited the criminal charges. In addition to assault, the parents were convicted of first-degree reckless endangerment and endangering the welfare of a child. They will be sentenced on May 16.
Members of several black advocacy groups attended most of the trial and after the verdict, some said that from the start, the mostly white jury was against the Swintons, who are black. The jurors, who deliberated for two days, had been sequestered since Wednesday morning, prompting Judge Richard L. Buchter to remind them as they were dismissed that "there's a war going on, and it's people like you serving in this system that is what America is all about."
The verdict shocked the Swintons' relatives and friends, many of whom sat through day after day of often highly complex medical testimony regarding the ability of the human body to process certain chemicals. Some relatives, though, had testified for the prosecution, confirming that the Swintons were IIce's sole caregivers and had complete responsibility for her feedings.
Mr. Swinton's lawyer, Ronna Gordon-Galchus, said she believed that the nine women and three men on the jury were emotionally swayed by the disturbing testimony of the child's medical condition and that the Swintons' intentions should have played a larger role in the verdict.
"Everything they did for their child, they believed was in her best interest," Ms. Gordon-Galchus said.
The parents were arrested six months after the baby was removed from their home. Mrs. Swinton was able to post bail, but Mr. Swinton has been in Rikers Island since his arrest. She gave birth to a second child, a boy, named InI (pronounced I-en-I), last July. She said she hid him from the authorities for 15 days and was now limited to regular visits with him. He is also in foster care.
As she was led from the courtroom after being taken into custody, Mrs. Swinton called out to her mother, "Tell IIce and InI that I love them."
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/05/nyregion/05VEGA.html
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MRT144
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Seattle Washington
Oct 2002
time: 21:27
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So true anun, so true
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MichaeltheGreat
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Apolyton Grand Executioner
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mooning the house that Ruth built.
Oct 1999
time: 21:27
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That's a rather weird way of phrasing it, so I wonder what the actual statute says.
Clearly, they were aware she was having severe problems, and never sought medical care until way late - almost too late. There are a lot of resources out there for parents, a lot of the free, but I think that any charge that presumes intent is probably excessive in this case, unless the statute allows intent to be presumed from actual conduct, instead of requiring positive proof.
The duration of suffering and degree of suffering inflicted is extreme, though, so even if the first degree assault charge didn't apply, the other charges should result in the maximum sentence for those charges.
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
I'm not sure if it should be legislated, but forcing a kid to be a vegetarian is just wrong. Children need the protein that is in many meats. Let the kid make up its own mind when it's older for Christ's sake!
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Sorry, but you need to get a clue. Meat isn't the only source of protein, and protein is not at all hard to get. Vegetarian diets are not very difficult at all to keep healthy, and require no more care then an omnivorous diet - infact, the care required to avoid meat usually means vegetarians are much more consious of their health, while omnivores are willing to gorge themselves on fast food.
But we aren't even talking about a vegetarian diet here, anyways. This is a Vegan diet - ie. no dairy and animal by-products, which can also be completely healthy but requires much more nutritional care, especially for developing children and pregnant women. But it can be done.
You don't seriously think a vegetarian is going to feed his baby meat, do you?
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Sava
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GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:27
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quote:
Sorry, but you need to get a clue. Meat isn't the only source of protein, and protein is not at all hard to get. Vegetarian diets are not very difficult at all to keep healthy, and require no more care then an omnivorous diet - infact, the care required to avoid meat usually means vegetarians are much more consious of their health, while omnivores are willing to gorge themselves on fast food.
But we aren't even talking about a vegetarian diet here, anyways. This is a Vegan diet - ie. no dairy and animal by-products, which can also be completely healthy but requires much more nutritional care, especially for developing children and pregnant women. But it can be done.
You don't seriously think a vegetarian is going to feed his baby meat, do you? |
It'd be nice if you didn't insult me. 
Sure, meat isn't the only source of protein. But humans have eaten throughout their evolution. Children should have a balanced diet. Then when they are older, they can make their own dietary decisions.
BTW, my cousin is a vegetarian and she feeds her daughter meat. She's also a nutritionist. So think before you hurl insults.
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
It'd be nice if you didn't insult me.
Sure, meat isn't the only source of protein. But humans have eaten throughout their evolution. Children should have a balanced diet. Then when they are older, they can make their own dietary decisions.
BTW, my cousin is a vegetarian and she feeds her daughter meat. She's also a nutritionist. So think before you hurl insults. |
First, I didn't insult you. I said you needed to get a clue, which you do, because you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.
Vegetarian diets are completely balanced.
And yes, humans have eaten throughout there evolution, I'm not sure what you're trying imply by that. Or did you mean eaten meat? In that case, we haven't eaten meat all through our evolution. But it doesn't matter anyways, because we aren't cavemen anymore. And we don't go around raping women because that's what our ancestors did, either.
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Willem
That depends entirely on the person's metabolism. For the most part, people can get by just fine without meat, but in some cases it could be harmful to them. I ran into a problem myself a number of years ago after I went vegetarian, because I was having a hard time getting enough Iron. I actually started passing out because of it, until I figured out what the problem was and started eating meat again. That type of diet just wasn't right for my physiology at the time.
In the case of a small child, that becomes even more of an issue because of all the cellular growth that's occurring then. |
I agree, you have to watch what you eat with any diet, and especially on specialized diets. People going vegan should deffinately put alot of research and thought into their diet. Vegetarian diets, on the other hand, really aren't as demanding as some people like to think.
By the way, iron deficiency can easily be solved in a vegetarian diet - spinach, for example, is loaded with iron. There's nothing in meat that you can't get in vegtebles, grain, fruit, and dairy. The only thing that you can't get in both dairy and meat is, as I understand, vitamin B12, but I am a bit sceptical about that. (I still eat a bit of dairy, so it does not really matter to me anyways)
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:27
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Many experts agree that once early hominids began to hunt and eat animals, our mental evolution was catapulted in that massive brainpower was needed for us to hunt animals that could easily kill us. In other words, we wouldn't be what we are today if we stayed vegetarians.
This is certainly debateable, but my studies have led me to more or less believe this hypothesis.
Just something to think about...
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Willem
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Canada
Dec 2001
time: 00:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Osweld
By the way, iron deficiency can easily be solved in a vegetarian diet - spinach, for example, is loaded with iron. |
I tried a few different things, but I still couldn't get enough. Plus it occured to me that eating red meat would be much less of a hassle. Besides, I wasn't to crazy about Spinach.
quote:
The only thing that you can't get in both dairy and meat is, as I understand, vitamin B12, but I am a bit sceptical about that. |
Engevita yeast is one of the best sources of B12 you'll ever find, and tastes great on salads and popcorn. Brewers yeast is a good source as well, but it tastes like crap unless it's in beer and then you lose most of the nutrients.
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
BTW, I never said it wasn't possible to have a balanced vegetarian diet. I said children need the protein found in meats. |
No they don't, they just need protein. The protein found in vegtebles, grains, and fruit will do just fine.
quote:
And forcing a child to be vegetarian is wrong. What happen when the kid goes to a friend's house and has a burger for the first time? The child will get sick. It's simply not healthy to not feed children meat. For an adult, being a vegetarian, if managed properly, can be very healthy. |
How do you propose it's done then, let the baby toddle around the supermarket and pick out what it wants? There is no reason to not raise a child on a vegetarian diet. And what is this about eating hamburgers?  I thought we where talking about a vegetarian child here - he wouldn't eat it. (just like most kids won't eat their brocolli  )
I could just as easily say "forcing a child to eat meat is wrong", anyways. That sort of statement has little value.
EDIT: By the way, "get a clue" is a suggestion. 
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MRT144
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Seattle Washington
Oct 2002
time: 21:27
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what i meant was that no child can turn down chicken fingers. kudos on the great diet. i hope im half the father you are.
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05-04-2003 10:51
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