10-04-2003 09:53									#301
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economies fund armies

	10-04-2003 09:56									#302
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They are hanging Ba'ath party members in the street.

One part of me says, "Good."

But it also illustrates that we need to move fast to restore law and order with a new administration. General Garner needs to move fast and the new government needs to be appointed NOW.

	10-04-2003 09:58									#303
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quote: Originally posted by MRT144 economies fund armies

and where does the biggest chunk of the budget come from?

	10-04-2003 10:00									#304
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen And you say you're country will erradicate it...

We'll be the one to erradicate the organization that attacked us on 9/11.

quote: BTW then 9/11 was a totally valid military strike in your opinion?

Validity doesn't enter into the equation.

	10-04-2003 10:00									#305
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Gas tax?

State lottery?

The tip jar at Denny's?

Pray tell us with your leading questions!!!

	10-04-2003 10:00									#306
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc We'll be the one to erradicate the organization that attacked us on 9/11.

DAMN STRAIGHT

	10-04-2003 10:04									#307
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen and where does the biggest chunk of the budget come from?

tax payers...

and for the record i am playing devil's advocate

	10-04-2003 10:04									#308
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc We'll be the one to erradicate the organization that attacked us on 9/11.

And how about all the other ones and those which will be organized during the rest of mankind's existance? Sorry, you really can't win a "war on terror"

quote: Validity doesn't enter into the equation.

Not when it doesn't suit you right?

	10-04-2003 10:08									#309
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quote: Originally posted by dv8ed Yes, all of these things need to be done. That doesn't mean we can't celebrate a situation improving from horrible to bad.

Well said, I can agree to that. The reasons weren't there but it is a reasonably well fought war.

	10-04-2003 10:09									#310
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen And how about all the other ones and those which will be organized during the rest of mankind's existance?

What about them?

quote: Not when it doesn't suit you right?

Not really. I'd still support squashing OBL even if he had only sent a car bomb on to the Pentagon grounds.

	10-04-2003 10:10									#311
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen And how about all the other ones and those which will be organized during the rest of mankind's existance? Sorry, you really can't win a "war on terror"

Did you even read what Dino said?

Or are you just arguing with yourself now?

	10-04-2003 10:16									#312
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker Did you even read what Dino said? Or are you just arguing with yourself now?

If "War on Terror" = "War on Al-Qaeda" then it's a poor choice of words. And the Bush administration has said more than once that it is more than a war against the perpetrators of 9/11 but a war against global terrorism which can take 50 years or more...

What I am arguing is that you can't fight an idea. Not even during the Cold War was it called "War on Communism"

And communism isn't dead, just like democracy, capitalism, fascism, etc. Ideas don't die.

BTW, are you even arguing something or just posting nonsense?

	10-04-2003 10:17									#313
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc What about them? quote: Not when it doesn't suit you right? Not really. I'd still support squashing OBL even if he had only sent a car bomb on to the Pentagon grounds.

I asked you a question: in your opinion was 9/11 a valid military strike? You have not answered it.

	10-04-2003 10:19									#314
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen I asked you a question: in your opinion was 9/11 a valid military strike? You have not answered it.

I told you that the question is irrelevent.

	10-04-2003 10:20									#315
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc I told you that the question is irrelevent.

Because you can't answer it without shooting yourself in the foot.

	10-04-2003 10:29									#316
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen Because you can't answer it without shooting yourself in the foot.

No, because it is irrelevent to my point. I fail to see why you keep harping on this point given that I had already stated that the tactics of terrorism are abhorent but that still doesn't change the fact that it is a form of warfare.

	10-04-2003 10:31									#317
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc No, because it is irrelevent to my point. I fail to see why you keep harping on this point given that I had already stated that the tactics of terrorism are abhorent but that still doesn't change the fact that it is a form of warfare.

Well, then, I'll take that as a YES.

	10-04-2003 10:33									#318
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If it will keep you from annoying me further, please do.

	10-04-2003 10:38									#319
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc If it will keep you from annoying me further, please do.

I will, this thread has lost all intellectual stimulation whatsoever...

	10-04-2003 10:45									#320
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Good... since you both agree... time to get back on topic.

Who hasn't seen the videos of Iraqi dancing in the street, and them dragging the head of the statue around while everybody hit with their shoes

	10-04-2003 10:50									#321
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I just saw it again and I hadn't realized until the commentator mentioned it. Half of the guys in the crowd dragging the head are photographers. Its hilarious they highlighted 7 guys and it left only 10 Iraqis or so!

	10-04-2003 11:14									#322
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I found it hilarious how some people just did whatever came to their minds to profane the statue. This one guy put a stick in the hole in Saddam's head, guess it was the first thing that came into his mind!

	10-04-2003 11:38									#323
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Good... since you both agree... time to get back on topic. Who hasn't seen the videos of Iraqi dancing in the street, and them dragging the head of the statue around while everybody hit with their shoes

I saw the videos of hungry, thirsty, pissed off Iraqis in Umm Qasr, Basra and Najaf *****ing out coalition troops about water supplies and general lawlessness.

Dancing in Baghdad is nice (of course, in another part of Baghdad, a Marine was KIAd by a sniper, but that's another story... ), but I prefer to finish a job before I get all mushy and celebrate.

It's like a guy building a house, telling his wife "Hey, honey, I bough a couple of bags of sack-crete and some two by fours. We'll have us a wall in no time, let's celebrate!"

	10-04-2003 11:42									#324
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There is indeed a ton of work ahead. The fighting isn't over... but that's really not the hard part. The harder part will come when the fighting ends. I'm not sure how this is all going to come out... but I'm not really confident at this point.

We can only hope...

	10-04-2003 15:15									#325
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Poor some ice water on it, commie.

I must object to this blatant smear. I have never been a communist, and most heartily reject communism.

	10-04-2003 15:59									#326
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I wonder : do the American media show the images of a unanimous Iraqi population cheering the US army ? Most American posters here seem to forget a very significant chunk (a big majority ?) of Iraqis are more concerned with food and electricity than politics.

Sure, many people danced, especially among the Shias and Kurds, who were the biggest victims of the regime. But we shouldn't confuse these dancers whith the whole Iraqi people.

There is a peace to win, and this will be difficult. A sure thing is that we cannot imaging changing Iraq like the colonial powers wanted to "civilize" conquered countries in the past. I think a Garnett-led reconstruction would be dangerous, because it is up to the Iraqis to rebuild their political system, now that they have been freed from their tyrant.

	10-04-2003 20:42									#327
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Spiffor, the Iraqi's will set up their own government. The only thing we are guaranteeing is that the new goverment will be 1) a government of the whole of Iraq; and 2) democratic.

The problem with turning this over to the UN is they do not guarantee 2.

	10-04-2003 20:49									#328
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Considering the half-assed job we're doing in Afganistan, we' can't guarantee 1 or 2.

	10-04-2003 20:50									#329
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One thing has been overlooked really. Look at the pics. Baghdad is a city of 5 million people, that is bigger than Berlin is. Now, compare the size of the dancing crowd to that crowd at the Brandenburg gate when the wall came down...really, look at it.

In that plaza there was at most a couple of thousand people, not the throngs of cheering humanity we had in other examples.

Obviosuly that does not diminish the happyness for those there, but it does say that most people, even in that neighborhood, were elsewhere at the time. It is the people who were not there that we have to win over, not the ones there. They are the ones we can't afford to lose.

	10-04-2003 20:51									#330
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BTW, did anyone hear Rummy's excuse for why they may not find bio/chem weapnos? They may have been snuck out of the country.