20-04-2003 00:46									#91
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I like exchanging opinions and ideas. that doesn't mean I want to convert the world. and it certainly doesn't mean I feel a responsibility to conform to wut ur ever more annoying ass keeps harping on.

I dont understand ur question "wut education reform does n. korea need" are u implying that they have an excellent education system and need no reform?

I think education is one of the necessities of democracy. teaching things like critical thinking and open mindedness. which is of course why no totalitarian regimes put much emphasis on either. it also helps if u dont kill teachers who speak out against u. but that might just be a little detail.

	20-04-2003 01:04									#92
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quote: I dont understand ur question "wut education reform does n. korea need" are u implying that they have an excellent education system and need no reform?

i never had the question "wut education reform does n. korea need". my question was "what education reform does nkorea need?"
i'm not implying that they have an excellent educational system. i'm just saying that you claimed that they were uneducated, which is a misconception and patently false.

quote: I think education is one of the necessities of democracy.

it's very much a foundation for a functioning democracy. however, nkorea is not a democracy.
you'd also be hard pressed to find examples of values like that in modern western english-speaking nations, what with the low scores in science, math, grammar, history, geography, and spelling. (actually, scratch that. bad scores are pretty much across the board.)

quote: teaching things like critical thinking and open mindedness.

no amount of "reform", as you put it, would ever bring that to a totalitarian educational system.

quote: which is of course why no totalitarian regimes put much emphasis on either. it also helps if u dont kill teachers who speak out against u. but that might just be a little detail.

funny. in many of the more authoritarian democracies throughout east asia (japan, skorea, taiwan, singapore), which one could argue are rather totalitarian in their educational system, teachers are often forbidden to speak out against the government.
they do, however, constantly score higher on the same tests that western english-speaking nations do so abysmally at.
so i fail to see your point here about education having anything to do with nkorea.

very obviously, nkorea has an educational system. it's a totalitarian one that teaches a stilted version of history and what not, but to assert that nkoreans are uneducated is a fallacy.

the funny thing is, yavoon, i'm not disagreeing with you in regards to how little nkorea spends, and would spend on education should the us stop sanctioning them. although perhaps you hadn't realized that, what with me also arguing with other points of your argument.

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quote: I like exchanging opinions and ideas. that doesn't mean I want to convert the world. and it certainly doesn't mean I feel a responsibility to conform to wut ur ever more annoying ass keeps harping on.

i like exchanging opinions and ideas as well. however, like in the last thread which we discussed anything in great detail in, i wanted to convince you that your ideas were based on fallacious statements, and you patently refused to bring any shred of evidence supporting your position to the table. furthermore, rather than doing any research, you often continued to maintain your bald-faced assertions, even when confronted with heaps of evidence to the contrary.
granted, i don't want to convert the world. there's no way in hell that i'll probably be able to convince dinodoc or ned that bush might have quite a bit to do with the current tension rather than clinton. however, because they are willing to argue using evidence and make sharp points discerned from their research, rather than bald-faced assertions, it's a lot easier for me to accept that they have a difference in opinion.
i still fail to see when i've actually had an ad hominem attack on you, or flamed you. the "ur ever more annoying ass", though, comes awfully close to an ad hominem attack and flame by you.

	20-04-2003 01:25									#93
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now ur trolling to bring the last thread back? feelin a lil bitter? ur developing a pretty long history of using creative adjectives against me and passing it off as argument. u also like to make claims about the state of the argument instead of arguing. perhaps trying to drag me into the same inane thing so we could have a nice flame war instead of arguing.

I mention n.korea could use education reform, u say "omg they're literate" I clarify what i was talking about and then u bring up low math scores?

the west places very high value on education. I'm not sure if ur talking about america in specific w/ the low test scores or if ur including europe. cuz europe actually has a pretty rigorous high school(closer to asia's). and seeing as how when I mentioned education reform I was speaking of values and not pure academic performance(see critical thinking and open mindedness). ur point still falls very flat.

	20-04-2003 01:35									#94
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Wow, you two have turned an interesting thread into something completely gay. Good job.

	20-04-2003 01:47									#95
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yah I do apologize=[. I didnt want ne of this.

	20-04-2003 01:56									#96
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Originally by cubed
"The united states has no space-based weapons platforms; spy satellites, not coming equipped with weaponry, does not count.
second, even with the spy satellites in the sky, there is a lot we don't know about the nkorean military's distribution. in the end, it would be difficult to cripple the nkorean military in any sort of first strike"
Well none that we are going to admit to 'anyway' and would we lie but the technology to build them has existed since the 80s'there are something in the nieghborhood of 200 SECRET military shuttle flllights (a conservative estimate to say the least as I know there were 25 in 1991 alone) so the opportunity has also existed to build them all we lacked was the desire to build them We even have a executive Mandate to construct them called SDI. I don't believe the military is forthcoming in all its assets do you?
Your secound premise ( that the NK leadrership wants paid off) is pretty sound and I like it for fit
but they may know something that we don't know,we havent accounted for all the Soviet materials, Yet these weapons maybe held by enemies of any nation.
I think the truth would scare the hell out of those of us who love life and peace and I don't believe we are told the truth; maybe I need to see a shrink; maybe people who buy what these good ole boys are saying do.

	20-04-2003 01:59									#97
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quote: now ur trolling to bring the last thread back? feelin a lil bitter?

trolling? how was that trolling? pfft. this isn't worth my time.

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quote: Well none that we are going to admit to 'anyway' and would we lie but the technology to build them has existed since the 80s'there are something in the nieghborhood of 200 SECRET military shuttle flllights (a conservative estimate to say the least as I know there were 25 in 1991 alone) so the opportunity has also existed to build them all we lacked was the desire to build them We even have a executive Mandate to construct them called SDI. I don't believe the military is forthcoming in all its assets do you?

i don't believe the military is forthcoming in all of its assets, but i highly doubt that there could ever be any space-based military installations at this time, simply because we seem to have developed a pretty rigorous database for everything launched, including whatever orbits that they are parked at.
besides, a shuttle launch is rather difficult to hide... so the entire "secret shuttle launch" thing i can't buy.

quote: Your secound premise ( that the NK leadrership wants paid off) is pretty sound and I like it for fit but they may know something that we don't know,we havent accounted for all the Soviet materials, Yet these weapons maybe held by enemies of any nation.

i don't think that the nuclear materials really came from the soviets. granted, it was a soviet design they used, but the material they have for the construction of weaponry i highly doubt came from russia in the enriched state.
but ol kim definitely wants to be bought off. he's a right nasty cvnt.

	20-04-2003 02:38									#98
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They admitted and do admit to the shuttle flights,what the Air force won't say is what thier purpose is or give us any figures on tonnage. Vandenburg does't advertise anything it does and it don't report to Nasa or anyone else. I only know that assuming there is know D-day platform I would concur with you whole heartedly but there is evidence IMO that there indeed is a space based weapons program.I don't ever want to see my theory proven either but there are suspiciouse things about targeting of smart missles specificly target painting and strikes purportedly delivered by
aircraft but confirmed by satelite that I don't buy. I also find it more likely that missle interdiction of the test occurred in space and from the surface of the Earth.
My father,myself and other people in this area have scene for lack of a better term UFO 's and we do not believe in aliens.I am telling you that all the cards are not on the table. "Just take the blue pill and this was all a bad dream"