19-04-2003 23:36									#1
	What exactly is an energy park? Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Like one square with 8+ energy being harvested by a supply crawler of something?

	20-04-2003 00:04									#2
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No, it's a way to collect alot of energy for one city, usually with the purpose of making it produce a tech a round.

You raise a big chunk of land to 3000m, and then place echelon mirrors and solar collectors in alternating rows:

OXOXO
OXOXO
OXOXO
OXOXO
OXOXO
OXOXO

O being solar collector and X being echelon mirrors.

Another version is building alot of trawlers (boat with crawler unit) and placing em on tidal harnesses in some nice part of the ocean.

This is good if you want to keep your number of cities low, and have the land to spare. However an energy park is a real juicy target in multiplayer, and a chopper that slips by your defenses will wreak havoc in it.

	20-04-2003 00:12									#3
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quote: What exactly is an energy park?

It's something that crashes my game.

	20-04-2003 00:43									#4
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Its only worth thinking about if you play someone like morgan or the pirates, other factions don't benefit from it as much.

	20-04-2003 04:28									#5
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wow, thanks, i didnt know ocean crawlers could be used!

	20-04-2003 08:48									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Xian wow, thanks, i didnt know ocean crawlers could be used!

Armored they make fairly good coastal sensors/defenders as well.

	20-04-2003 08:57									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Static Universe Armored they make fairly good coastal sensors/defenders as well.

I never found that the added cost of armour was worth it as it really doesn't add much survivability against either sea or airpower. I do like to add deep radar to increase the sensor net. You can have the trawlers gathering resources and if you are willing to micromanage you can have the trawler do a short patrol out and back, ending the turn on the resource.

I consider them to be an expendable early warning system

	20-04-2003 10:19									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Flubber I never found that the added cost of armour was worth it as it really doesn't add much survivability against either sea or airpower. I do like to add deep radar to increase the sensor net. You can have the trawlers gathering resources and if you are willing to micromanage you can have the trawler do a short patrol out and back, ending the turn on the resource. I consider them to be an expendable early warning system

I think armor is worth it once it's free! It gives you some protection against (low tech) enemy depredation, but more often the higher morale the unit gets makes it more likely to survive a worm attack.

Any faction can benefit from this strategy, though some more than others. The large energy parks seem to be best suited for games on extremely large maps, one city challenges etc. I will often beef up the capitol with a few energy crawlers or trawlers placed on tiles of opportunity, such as areas where forest has spread outside of base radii, energy specials, or choke points where I want to keep an eye peeled for enemy infiltration and don't mind making a profit while I do so. The trawler with deep radar is great for this.

	20-04-2003 11:21									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Sikander I think armor is worth it once it's free! It gives you some protection against (low tech) enemy depredation, but more often the higher morale the unit gets makes it more likely to survive a worm attack.

I notice this a lot in many PBEM games. Once you reach the higher reactor/weapon/armour levels, much of that lower grade stuff suddenly becomes free, yet so few people exploit that, and so we still see things like the crawlers/trawlers you've mentioned, and 1-4t-1*2 garrisons even when a 2-4t+-1*2 costs exactly the same.

	20-04-2003 20:36									#10
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When I feel like a 60 hour micromanagement marathon I play on a huge map, and build several energy parks. A city can only construct a single tech in a round, so you need several "super science cities" to get several techs a round, and then smaller bases circling them to provide crawlers, defenses etc etc.

In truth a second super science city isn't really worth it. It's not much more efficient than just tossing up more cities. It's the secret projects that really make a SSC.

Other good things to do for late mid-game to end game maximizing:

Crawler in food, keep workes on two boreholes, and make the rest into engineers, or later into transcendi. A fully developed city with 30 transcendi throw out alot of science each round. (If you have the cloning vats you can work sea squares with kelp+harness on em, as each worker means 3 extra transcendi (food from satellites))

Read the threads on how eco damage really work, so that you can have mineral multiplicators and nessus mining stations that in total means 100's of eco damage free minerals each turn.

	21-04-2003 17:45									#11
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If you are going to make an energy park, make sure that the energy input is made use of properly. Try crawering it into a Super Science City (SSC for short). Put the Merchant Exchange, the Longevity Vac., The Supercollider, The Theory of Everything, the Network Backbone, & the Space Elevator in that city. Also, don't forget the basics, like Network node, Research Hospital, Energy Bank, Tree Farm, Hybrid forest, Fusion Lab, Quantum Lab, & NanoHospital. Combined, these bring in a tremendous amount of both research & Credits. Just remember, that city then becomes a *very* juicy target, so protect it and the surronding area. A marine strike, Planet Buster attack, of a frontal assault can bring tears to your eyes, seeing your lovely handywork go down the drain!

Good Luck

	24-04-2003 17:29									#12
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quote: Originally posted by lethe No, it's a way to collect alot of energy for one city, usually with the purpose of making it produce a tech a round. You raise a big chunk of land to 3000m, and then place echelon mirrors and solar collectors in alternating rows: OXOXO OXOXO OXOXO OXOXO OXOXO OXOXO O being solar collector and X being echelon mirrors.

Is this the most efficient set-out for the energy park? I usually use this set-out:

OOOOOO
OXOOXO
OOOOOO
OXOOXO
OOOOOO

That way I don't have to spend as much time building as many Echelon mirrors, and technically it should be just as effective. [Echelon mirrors only need to be adjacent to Solar Collectors for them to work, right?]

Is there any greater advantage in more Echelon Mirrors as set-out in the pattern presented by lethe?

Bkeela.

	24-04-2003 23:25									#13
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In your plan most solar collectors only gets one extra energy due to echelon mirrors. In Lethe's plan most solar collectors gets +6 energy.

	24-04-2003 23:50									#14
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To elaborate on what Maniac said - the energy output for a solar collector is increased by one for EACH adjacent Echelon Mirror, provided the Echelon Mirror is in your territory.

	25-04-2003 00:52									#15
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So if my Maths is correct it works out something like this ? (assumed all at +3000feet)

oxoxox 22 for solar collectors + 12 for echelons
oxoxox 27 + 12
oxoxox "
oxoxox "
oxoxox 22 + 12

grand total of 185 energy

OOOOOO 30 for solar collectors
OXOOXO 20 for sc and 8 for echelons
OOOOOO 36 for sc
OXOOXO 20 +8
OOOOOO 30

Grand total of 152

Guess its upto you how quickly you need the park built but in the long run seems top method is far better.

Last edited by Lazerus on 25-04-2003 at 01:19

	25-04-2003 01:31									#16
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There are other reasons to favor the more compact, higher yield layout that Lethe suggests. A smaller park is easier to defend, and you need build fewer crawlers to harvest all the energy, and of course, there are fewer squares to raise to 3000+ feet above sea level.

	25-04-2003 05:56									#17
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Hmm. A 6x6 grid, 4 (base) for echelons and SCs, and +1 for SCs adjacent to EMs?

Why not:

OOXXOO - 5 6 4 4 6 5 = 30
OXOOXO - 6 4 6 6 4 6 = 32
XOOOOX - 4 6 5 5 6 4 = 30
XOOOOX - 4 6 5 5 6 4 = 30
OXOOXO - 6 4 6 6 4 6 = 32
OOXXOO - 5 6 4 4 6 5 = 30
182 energy, and 6 fewer echelon mirrors [12]. And it's all nice and symmetrical, too...

I could look for a better one, but I have stuff to do.

Last edited by Uchuu-kun[SM42] on 25-04-2003 at 06:10

	25-04-2003 06:09									#18
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Okay, here's the most efficient layout I can come up with right now:

OXOOXO - 24 + 6
XOOOOX - 24 + 7
OOXOOO - 24 + 8
OOOXOO - 24 + 8
XOOOOX - 24 + 7
OXOOXO - 24 + 6

Not symmetrical, alas. But 186 energy return, and only 10[!] echelon mirrors.

	25-04-2003 07:03									#19
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Hmm. The ideal 5x5 energy park [AFAI can plan] is this:

XOOOX - 20 + 6
OXOXO - 20 + 6
OOOOO - 20 + 10
OXOXO - 20 + 6
XOOOX - 20 + 6
134 energy total. The 6x6 park is more efficient, though:

5x5: 134 / 25 = 5 9/25 energy / square; 8/17 echelon:SC [appx. 1:2]
6x6: 186 / 36 = 5 5/6 energy / square; 5/26 echelon:SC [appx. 1:5]

	25-04-2003 08:13									#20
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Do echelon mirrors improve solar panels that are diagonal to them? I was under the impression that they didn't.

	25-04-2003 08:34									#21
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Well, I just assumed so. Based on Lazerus's energy park evaluation, it would seem so.

	25-04-2003 10:18									#22
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quote: Originally posted by BustaMike Do echelon mirrors improve solar panels that are diagonal to them? I was under the impression that they didn't.

Yes, they certainly do.

	25-04-2003 12:30									#23
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Insommnia prompted the following:

code:
First number is total +, second is + "per mirror";
first diagram is max energy, second is 'cheapest' [fewest echelon mirrors]
2x2 park:
XO  XO
OX  OO
4,2 3,3

3x3:
OOO   OOO
XOX   OXO
OOO   OOO
12,4  8,8

4x4:
OOXO  OOOO
XOOO  OXOO
OOOX  OOXO
OXOX  OOOO
20,5  14,7

5x5:
OOOXO   OOOOO
OXOOX   OXOXO
OOOOO   OOOOO
XOOXO   OXOXO
OXOOO   OOOOO
32,5.3  30,7.5

6x6:
OXOOOO  OOOOOO
XOOXOO  OOOXOO
OOOOXO  OXOOOO
OXOOOO  OOOOXO
OOXOOX  OXOOOO
OOOOXO  OOOOOO
44,5.5* 32,8

*when tiled, this jumps to 56,7:

      X  
 +------+
 |OXOOOO|  = 6 4 6 6 6 6 
 |XOOXOO|X = 4 6 6 4 6 6
 |OOOOXO|  = 6 6 6 6 4 6
 |OXOOOO|  = 6 4 6 6 6 6
X|OOXOOX|  = 6 6 4 6 6 4
 |OOOOXO|  = 6 6 6 6 4 6 
 +------+    -----------
   X      Ttl 200 energy 

	25-04-2003 13:02									#24
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thanks. I tried making one and was half successful. I'm still trying to figure out the location for the base in relation to the energy park. I tried one where the base was located in the center of the park, and another where two were on opposite sides of the park.

How do I maximize the total amount of energy to minerals?

	25-04-2003 14:37									#25
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You use supply crawlers, instead of worring about base radii. But if you want to use a base, try

code:
 OOO
OXOXO
OOBOO
OXOXO
 OOO

	25-04-2003 17:30									#26
	Inflate your Upload Space

Solar flares when you've got an energy park are such a cool thing
I still prefer my 3 or 4 boreholes per base and just having a swarm of bases though, usually nets more.

This can't be the most efficient


X
+------+
|OXOOOO| = 6 4 6 6 6 6
|XOOXOO|X = 4 6 6 4 6 6
|OOOOXO| = 6 6 6 6 4 6
|OXOOOO| = 6 4 6 6 6 6
X|OOXOOX| = 6 6 4 6 6 4
|OOOOXO| = 6 6 6 6 4 6
+------+ -----------
X Ttl 200 energy

for a start all you need to do is :


X
+------+
|OOOOOO| = 6 6 6 6 6 6
|XXOXOO|X = 4 4 6 4 6 6
|OOOOXO| = 7 7 7 6 4 6
|OXOOOO| = 6 4 6 6 6 6
X|OOXOOX| = 6 6 4 6 6 4
|OOOOXO| = 6 6 6 6 4 6
+------+ -----------
X Ttl 203 energy

and thats just at a glance. Can some maths whiz work out a nice formula or pattern for the ultimate park ?

	25-04-2003 17:47									#27
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Umm. Could you put that in [code] tags, please? It's making my brain hurt trying to figure it out.

Heywait. There's no limit? I was working under the assumption that there was a max of 6... dammit. I'll have to start over.

	25-04-2003 22:51									#28
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How about this:

xoooxo 33
xoxoxo 34
ooxooo 38
xoooxo 36
xoxoxo 34
ooxooo 33

Grand total 208 energy with 12 echelon mirrors in 6x6 park.

Assuming a max height park and correct arithmetic of course

Rich

	25-04-2003 23:17									#29
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Thanks....whoops, I don't know why I added that last line in my previous post...I think I was a little too tired at that time.

Props! I'll give it a try with the supply crawlers.

	25-04-2003 23:19									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Lazerus Solar flares when you've got an energy park are such a cool thing I still prefer my 3 or 4 boreholes per base and just having a swarm of bases though, usually nets more. This can't be the most efficient

Damn, this can't be good for the environment? How's the eco-damage? And how do you fend off all the mind worm attacks? When I make 1 borehole Planet gets all nuts and swarms my a**.