02-05-2003 12:08									#31
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Well it kind of depends how many units fo the Murmansk front I'm given permission to use. Currently I think destroying that Karl and reinforcing Leningrad (an airlifted Kv1 would be great!) will be the way to go.
I am a bit concerned though, I am presuming there are quite a few Wermacht SG in Narva currently, I am not sure Leningrad will be able to withstand their attack coupled with the stukas even with another KV1

	02-05-2003 12:12									#32
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and request certain things from the murmansk front, we'll get Yip to play first and I guess depending on your conning skills you get what you get for your turn (play last) other commanders may reinforce you.

	02-05-2003 13:12									#33
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Is the karl homed to Narva or is it NONE?

	02-05-2003 13:46									#34
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Excellent question! It would then be interesting to raid Narva!

BUT it sadly is a NONE...

	02-05-2003 16:13									#35
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I know this may add some time to the turn but the Marshall needs to decide what to do here because it affects 2 maybe 3 fronts.

So acting Marshall its really up to you, you need to tell the other front commanders to give Henrik what he needs or abandon Leningrad. And its up to you whether you want Stavka invovlement or not.

Boy Im glad Im at my Dacha right now!



Airlifting is out right now. I tried with the Gorky AA and it said it could get intercepted so I stopped. (Since I have never seen an interception fail)

	02-05-2003 16:17									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Colwyn and request certain things from the murmansk front, we'll get Yip to play first and I guess depending on your conning skills you get what you get for your turn (play last) other commanders may reinforce you.

Colwyn no offense here but we really shouldn't do this, you need to be DECISIVE on this and give direction to either save Lenningrad or abandon it. (Maybe we should do a poll and let the other southern front commanders play first.)

Leaving this to the Front Commanders and letting them decide is not the optimal solution.

ESPECIALLY since this decision will affect the viability of the Murmansk to Viipuri line, and whether Tikvin will hold out or not to keep the Archangel line open.

	02-05-2003 16:24									#37
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first, the Karl MUST be destroyed, no matter what the cost is, I don´t think it will be possible to hold the city, and I don't approve the abandon of the murmansk front, maybe moving the good units but the cities must be defended

and as I said, use the planes to kill as many finish infantry as possible

are we not allowed to airlift the caravans once they are in the russian motherland??

	03-05-2003 08:46									#38
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Use the labor brigade to build a city on the river/spruce b/w chevepockets and tikvin as it will give a +100% defence with city walls +200%!! (brigade is already there, did you have the same idea?)

Henrik you can use this city as the fall back city should any plan to hold leningrad/Tichvin fails and a the junction of the roads from Archangle and Volgoda its a perfect spot, just ensure it gets citywalls/barracks a AA and a few good units before summer 42!

You can then use the 3 citys as your new front and build new cities behind it (as many as possible) so your can gets lots of Redguards per turn.

PS move the frieghter out to Vilpuri as well.

Last edited by Colwyn on 03-05-2003 at 09:12

	03-05-2003 09:57									#39
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OK Im back. Colwyn thanks for covering for me.

Now Comrades the Lenningrad question.

Henrik is authorized to do what it takes to kill the Karl and save Leningrad.
Yop you are to support Henrik with what he needs from the Murmansk Front.
If Anzac can get that new KV-1 to Leningrad to reinforce that is authorized.
I dont reccomend an airlift, it will probably get intercepted.

Yop this means you will probably need to give up cities.
I want the high value units to make a Beeline for Tikvin in case the defense of Lenningrad fails. Yop keep the Murmansk-Tikvin road open as long as you can to move units to Tikvin. Dont forget to rehome them when you get there. Start selling off improvements in the Kola.

We are giving up the Kola.

We are trying too save Leningrad and kill the Karl.

Last resort is to execute Colwyns plan of building a city in the woods at the Road Junction between Cherpovits/Tikvin/ Archangel. And make that a bunker if we lose even Tikvin.

Good luck Im not going to tell you all what to do exactly, thats what I pay Front Commanders big rubbles for. You have my general intent now execute a plan and fight the good fight. Is this clear enough? Good Luck!

Yop/Anzac and Henrik have to work together on this one. The Rodina is counting on you!

	03-05-2003 10:32									#40
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If this has taught us anything, we must not repeat our mistakes. We should also put extra high priority on Perekop, as when it is captured the events create two Karls!

Last edited by EZRhino on 03-05-2003 at 12:11

	03-05-2003 13:51									#41
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I need the KV 1 and T26 in Viipuri for the destruction of the Karl, if the AA in Vipurii is moved to 41,43 I will be able to pick it up with some luck (it will have 1/3s move left) with the transport in Leningrad and move it to defend the city.
Possibly I'd like the motorized infantry as well but I realize I've allready weakened the city way too much

I will reinforce Leningrad as much as possible (which isn't a lot I'm afraid, it will be one extra AA if I get the one from Vipurii+the red army unit just northeast of leningrad+The NKVD trooper who was on his way to Novgorod+possibly the Kv1 in Vipurii (I am thinking of using it to deliver the final blows to the Karl, which would mean it will survive)).
I will however move lots of units to the fort at 45,51 within range of Leningrad, in hope that if the city holds out, I will be able to reinforce it next turn.

Any airlifted KV1s or even AAs are much, much welcome (I don't see how they could possibly reach the city trough other means).
Obviously only one unit per turn can be airlifted so the other front commanders should post if they have units they can airlift before attempting to do so.

There is a T26 in range of Leningrad in Kitela, will it hurt your front too much if you lose it Yop?

General Henrikov would like to apologize for all the trouble his apparently inept handling of the seige of Leningrad has caused other front commanders and the motherland as a whole.

	03-05-2003 15:04									#42
	Remember winter is almost here! Got spare money?

If you going to defend Lenningrad we may only need to wound the Karl with the Artillery (with luck it can take 1/2 its HP) it will then withdraw or fortify itself, we can then defend leningrad with the KV1 (without losing it to the karl) and other units.

Leningrad will not hold one turn if there arn't a decent garrison in it at the germans turn karl or not won't it?

	03-05-2003 16:18									#43
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I like the idea
but could we defend the city with the Karl hanging around?

	03-05-2003 16:26									#44
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the road between petsamo and murmansk should be pillage

	03-05-2003 16:44									#45
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Shaka, that's what I need to do. Henrik, I'll try to send you as much as possible, but don't forget that the winter is nearing and that the Finns are strong during winter. It may cost me Kitela and Viipuri.
Also, try to keep the partizan alive. It will prove usefull during winter to destroy any hedgehogs.

	03-05-2003 17:12									#46
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quote: Originally posted by yop73 Shaka, that's what I need to do. Henrik, I'll try to send you as much as possible, but don't forget that the winter is nearing and that the Finns are strong during winter. It may cost me Kitela and Viipuri. Also, try to keep the partizan alive. It will prove usefull during winter to destroy any hedgehogs.

We can not hold the Viipuri-Murmansk line and Leningrad.

Priority 1: We need to try and at least wound the Karl and possibly kill it.

Priority 2: Make sure Tikvin gets built up!

Priority 3: Garrison Leningrad

priority 4: Defend the Viipuri to Murmansk line.

Am I being clear here? Having good defenses in Murmansk amd losing Tikvin or even Cherepovits is not a good idea! As a last resort we really need to keep the Archangel to Cherepovits Road Open! Convoys of supplies from the Capitalists via Archangel will be crucial to rush building, wonder building, and economic development of the Rodina.

And one of the reasons we lost Narva is because we are trying to do too much. We tried to hold Luga and Narva and look what happened.

It wont last long comrades we will begin beating back the Fascists within a year.

Keep fighting the good fight, pick your battles and your front line well. Prepare for the ultimate destruction of the Germansky's!

	03-05-2003 17:30									#47
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This was posted by Yop in another thread, I believe the new city talked about is the one Colwyn suggested and I asked for at the crossroads between Tikvin-Cherepovits-Archangel:

quote: Originally posted by yop73 The new city would fall under which front commander??? Btw. There are some Finnish infantery just outside Viipuri. If I don't use the KV-1 to kill them, Viipuri will surely fall in the winter.

Tikvin is part of the Baltic Front and the new city will be as well for now.

If you lose Viipuri so be it. I am assuming by executing the:Save Lenningrad/Kill the Karl plan that the Murmansk to Viipuri line will be lost. Thats why I said the Murmansk Front Commander needs to get the High value units into the Lenningrad fight or heading for Tikvin.

AGAIN: Holding Murmansk is futile if we lose Tikvin Cherepovits!

And we can only airlift so many convoys and Armored Infantry!

-If we lose Leningrad Tikvin will be real tough to hold.
-If Tikvin goes holding open the Archangel to Cherepovits road will be Difficult!
-If Cherepovits falls the Convoys are cut off! (Except for airlift.)

Do you understand my reasoning?

Im trying to hold Leningrad, but if it falls I want the Kola Pennisula high value forces headed for Tikvin, just in case. (Thats your good units from the whole Murmansk to Viipuri line YOP!)

At this point in time a KV-1 in Tikvin is a LOT more valueable than a KV-1 in Murmansk.

OK , do we all understand.

And lets keep the Baltic Front-Leningrad Front Discussion here so we all know where it is. I posted in several places last night to make sure we all saw it. Thanks

	03-05-2003 17:37									#48
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quote: Originally posted by conmcb25 Originally posted by yop73 Btw. There are some Finnish infantery just outside Viipuri. If I don't use the KV-1 to kill them, Viipuri will surely fall in the winter.

Use the T28 in Kitela for those on the forest tile and one of your red army for the one on the swamp.

I like the ideas about simply gravely wounding the Karl, however we will need the KV1 and T26 in Leningrad regardless. (And if possible the AA as well, that one will make a huge difference imho)

	03-05-2003 18:29									#49
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I will try and divert units up to your front ASAP. Though that recent destruction of a section of the Leningrad-Demyansk road isn't going to make it easy for me to get there.

	03-05-2003 18:55									#50
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Good, Good!

You guys are working up a plan together, to satisfy the commanders intent.

Excellent keep up the good work!

	04-05-2003 00:48									#51
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If we dont wound the Karl enough and it attacks anyway, it would be better to have the partisan outside of the city. Because if the 2 strongest units die by default to the Karl while defending Leningrad, we will lose our best means of counter attacking. I suggest in the long run we should build Artillery and Katyushas in Leningrad and Perekop for the future. In addition, you should use the I-16 in Kitela to kill the stack of He-111 and SGs by Narva. Events dont create more of these units if they are killed.

	06-05-2003 19:46									#52
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The Karl has now been reduced to less than 50% of it's health!
Thanks to the artillery in Luga, which unfortunatly was also lost during the fighting, the gigantic Karl siege mortar has now been gravely wounded and hopefully will be withdrawn by the Germans for maintenance



Leningrad has also been reinforced both with the help of the Karelian front and by units stationed near Leningrad. As can be seen in the air surveilance photo above the city is now garrisoned by two T26s, one KV2, one AA battery, one Red army and one NKVD unit.

The brave Polikarpov pilots from Russian karelia did their work well and 6 units where killed in the bomber stack (hopefully most of which where bombers).
Also in a bold raid ordered by General Henrikov the Destroyer stationed in Leningrad made a raid destroying another 4 units poised to strike at the city just west of Narva. The destroyer survived and the men are now counted among the many veterans of this war

Furthermore a large contignent of Luga's defenders have moved into range to assist the besieged city of Leningrad within one turn.

Now all we can do is hope

	06-05-2003 19:47									#53
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Oh yes and the city of Borisov was also founded for the eventuality that Leningrad might actually fall.

	06-05-2003 19:54									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Henrik Oh yes and the city of Borisov was also founded for the eventuality that Leningrad might actually fall.

Of course the Marshall my have to rename this city after himself during phases 2.

	06-05-2003 23:53									#55
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Good job comrade

we'll have to do something with the Karl, we are going to have problems if not

	07-05-2003 00:10									#56
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Winter is near. I suggest getting a Kollective and a Grain elevator up as soon as is possible.

	07-05-2003 01:41									#57
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Why not finish the Karl off once and for all? Surely, if we allow the Krauts to fix the Karl, we will have to worry about the Karl again in a few turns.

	07-05-2003 02:11									#58
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In a few turns it will be winter, and the Karl will have a movement of zero. This is a good reason for building a mine field on the square between Narva and Leningrad.

	09-05-2003 19:36									#59
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Leningrad has been heavily reinforced.

Got two KV1's in Leningrad now, switching production to AAs (I want atleast one more before I build more KV1s/cruisers/etc).



Also while I appreciate getting another KV1 for free I'd apreciate if the marshal/armaments minister would ask me before changing production in the future

	09-05-2003 20:45									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Henrik Also while I appreciate getting another KV1 for free I'd apreciate if the marshal/armaments minister would ask me before changing production in the future

One would think you would be worshipping the ground I walk on for the oppurtunity to defend Leningrad. It is I who ensured you had the tools you needed.

Dont forget this Comrade!