10-05-2003 21:45									#31
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It's silly. After college, how you did in HS wouldn't make a difference.

	10-05-2003 21:52									#32
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High school is a cancer... the whole system needs reform...

	10-05-2003 21:55									#33
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quote: But Wolfson said the school's decision "would send the message that we have two valedictorians this year, a disabled one and a non-disabled one."

Everyone here seems to disagree with her. Why wouldn't it send that message?

	10-05-2003 22:26									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I don't think the tutoring is the issue here. It's the self-serving, frivilous lawsuit.

I rhink it does if for the past 2 years she has been essentially home schooled. Being placed in classes of one would definitely give her an advantage over someone in classes of 25 to 35, especially if her illness is not debilitating. Again, I'd like to know more about the nature of her illness.

	10-05-2003 22:29									#35
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I'm not against someone getting tutors and such. I'm against frivilous lawsuits. I really don't care about the whole valedvictorian mess. I'll leave that debate to others. She just shouldn't be suing... that's my point.

	10-05-2003 22:30									#36
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My school had two valedictorians and salutatorians. One for the regular people and one for the Magnet program people. It didn't bother me that much that the regular valedictorian had a lower GPA than me (Magnet salutatorian). I mean, in the long term none of this matters much. At our school at least the competition for the top spots was decided well in advance and not based on selective course taking. I got the number two spot, even though I had a 4-5 Bs, the valedictorian had a B in something at somepoint, but we just had so many more AP classes than everyone else that it didn't matter much.

	11-05-2003 00:18									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Sava And what's funny is that in the real world, being valedvictorian doesn't mean sh1t.

Aside from the honor that goes with it, being valedictorian can be worth some scholarship money, especially the local stuff, which usually goes to the top 2 or 3 graduating students. Its not nothing, but it sure is overblown.

	11-05-2003 00:25									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Frogman Aside from the honor that goes with it, being valedictorian can be worth some scholarship money, especially the local stuff, which usually goes to the top 2 or 3 graduating students. Its not nothing, but it sure is overblown.

So if this girl is too sick to go much further then taking the valedictorian postion from the other student really hurts the school, since college admission commitees often place some value on the school an applicant is from based on the performance of students they've had from that school.

	11-05-2003 00:30									#39
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What's a valedictorian?

	11-05-2003 01:25									#40
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A. The case is in federal court because the girl filed it as a discrimination action. This does have some basis, because apparently the school board basically changed its rules THIS YEAR when they saw that she was going to be valedictorian. It was basically a rule change solely focused on her, which makes the thing very, very fishy.

B. She shouldn't have won, and it'll probably be reversed at a higher level, because there is a reasonable explination for this discriminatory classification (handicaps aren't a suspect class).

quote: So if this girl is too sick to go much further

But she isn't. Apparently she and the other guy involved here are BOTH going to Harvard.

	11-05-2003 01:43									#41
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IIUC, a valedictorian some honorific title that goes to the kid who has the best grades in his high school ?

The very existence of it sounds stupid to me. It only leads to rabid and unfair competition, especially since kids most often don't give rats about fairness when it clashes with their pride (it is much worse by them than by adults, as I see it). This shitty trial is an absolutely unsurprising result of the valedictorian system.

For the record, I agree with everything Pekka has said in this thread

	11-05-2003 02:00									#42
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yeah, god forbid we introduce some competition on things other than "how good one looks" in highscool.

	11-05-2003 02:11									#43
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If I were the other kid with her in Harvard, I'd ridicule her mercilessly, much like I did when I ran into the valedictorian of my class (who was still an *******)...

	11-05-2003 02:35									#44
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I think her parents should give her a good swift kick in the a** to straighten her up.

	11-05-2003 02:37									#45
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Being valedictorian can be very important to some people.

I see this guy I went to high school with every year or so, and he never fails to tell the story about how he missed out on being valedictorian by just a few points, and that was like 15 years ago.

He still drinks wine coolers, too.

	11-05-2003 05:53									#46
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(who was still an *******)

Eunuch? Oh, rear...

	13-05-2003 01:01									#47
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aw, hell. let's just get rid of the public school system anyway. if it's not one ******* suing it for valedictorianness, it's another about the pledge, another about creationism vs evolution, another about the lack of spirit in the black history month celebrations, another about having to read cold sassy tree, another about not being given yadayadayada...

it's a money losing enterprise. people like that should be sent to private school that matches their beliefs. oy.

and i'm not really serious about that...

	13-05-2003 01:18									#48
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Wow, what a *****. She doesn't need a kick in the ass. She needs to get laid.

I don't recall Valedictorian being a big deal at my HS. I haven't the foggiest who it was, and most likely didn't know at the time (7yrs ago).

-Arrian

	13-05-2003 02:14									#49
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Poor one I hope she didn't have it serious. I still remmember how ugly it was on shool with this, in country that doesn't force teachers to behave. Offences discriminations and falsifications of exams. They really tried to kick me out, because they liked normal students, not talented ones with slignt health problems. If I'd sued them I wouldn't be poor today. So she probably did right thing. They would pay her back for sure, but she will learn at least little from law system. Some people with diploma don't understand anything else than being sued or worse. Now I'm independent game developer specialist on AI and some other hard to come things. I wouldn't be if I'd sue them because I wold be alowed to go on Uni get red diploma and possibly normal work or invalid rent.

I however argree that we should get rid of school system, because it will teach students only noninteresting things like go to shool you crippled bastard, or repeat this sentece like is writen in textbook, we don't care it is wrong. It is in the textbook so it must be true.




BTW what is a valedictorian? salutatorian?

	13-05-2003 02:19									#50
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX right, cause colleges are going to like this. i say we take her off her meds on sneeze on her.

She would probably survive it. These problems are geting worse later. BTW I think I could make simillar sentence with words Bush and "bulet", but I think mods would dislike it a lot.

	13-05-2003 03:42									#51
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Seriously, what's with all the pent-up agression in this thread. Yes, she's being a bit of a jerk, but that's no reason to have a virtual stoning. All of you people need to chill out.

	13-05-2003 04:14									#52
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Yah, I kinda agree St. Leo. I can SEE where she is coming from, even if I think she's being an idiot. I mean, she thought she was sole validictorian. She probably told everyone. And then the school board says because of her cirriculum, she has to share it. That would make me pissed.

But I still think she should lose .

	13-05-2003 04:16									#53
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If this girl was a guy, I'd say to give him a good ass-kicking.

Hopefully everyone will boo her at graduation and make fun of her for the rest of the year. If they made her cry every day I wouldn't feel sorry for her.

What a *****.

	13-05-2003 04:21									#54
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If this girl was a guy, I'd say to give him a good ass-kicking.

Americans.

	13-05-2003 04:22									#55
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Whiny kids need ass kickings - if their parents won't do it, that is. Corporal punishment (by parents, at least)

	13-05-2003 04:23									#56
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quote: A person with a decent solid self esteem wouldn't care about such things.

Best point of the thread. If you're not enough without it, you're not going to be enough with it.

They should do what my school does, turn the Valedictorian into a more subjective enterprise, by having the Valedictorian makes speeches as well as meeting a certain minimum in grades.

	13-05-2003 04:47									#57
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I earned the top grades of my medical school class, yet I was not selected to be the valedictorian because for two years I had been a faculty member as well as a student, and had been excused from taking certain classes (my own). I didn't complain at all.

Still, if the school did indeed decide to have two valedictorians this year solely because she's disabled, then I can see her point. I think that I would sue only gor an apology and court costs, though. There might also be a question however as to whether the school excused her from the usual requirements needed to be named valedictorian, and whether these exceptions were substantially unfair to the other students.

	13-05-2003 04:49									#58
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If she is disabled, and thus judged by a different standard/allowed to take honor's classes rather than PE, she should be automatically disqualified from being valedictorian. If she can't play by everyone else's rules, why should everyone else be punished by her special rules? I'm sorry she's disabled, certainly, but that's not anyone else's fault.

	13-05-2003 04:59									#59
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Why not just compute the GPAs of the students competing with her disregarding the subjects she was excused from due to her illness and then see who comes out with the highest score?

I still expect that the crux of the controversy as the school saw it was probably more than her just being excused from PE, but that she evidently was tutored at home for the better part of the last two years.

	13-05-2003 06:41									#60
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Whiny kids need ass kickings - if their parents won't do it, that is. Corporal punishment (by parents, at least)

Americans.