24-05-2003 07:36									#1
	Public education should get no more funding Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

at least not on the elementary/high school level. money should go towards college. Why?

I've been in the philly public school system my whole life and though most the people i know are not going to college or they have already dropped out of high school, they are all universally intelligent. Take a random boy off the street hustling oils or some **** and you could seriously have an intelligent debate with him about politics or whatever. sure his grammer may not be right but he would use plenty of sophisticated words and knows what he's talking about.

So to me, funding is not the problem. The school district has basically churned out thousands of very intelligent men and women, even those who dropped out or stayed straight cutting classes. sure, some weedheads are retarded as **** and there's always those with 'learning disabilities' but the average student in the school district is probably just as smart as anyone in fancy private institutions.

the problem is that 1) there's little oppurtunity (what with the cost of college) out of high school to continue one's education, 2) people don't see the point in going to college (they figure they got enough knowledge to get a job and survive), and 3) people see college as that **** for white people.

but people insist that the public education system don't work because it don't get enough funding... **** that... the problem is people don't see the point in going to class, and especially not college.

We need to somehow convince people of the worth of a college education or at least the importance of a diploma if only as a sheet of paper that proves you actually know ****.

and thats the truth.


thanks

	24-05-2003 07:42									#2
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There are scholarships/loans available for bright yet less well off children.

	24-05-2003 07:49									#3
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Well then why not educate them better in high school?

The whole education system needs to be shaken up (but kept public)

	24-05-2003 07:52									#4
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You don't realize what a highschool education gives you. Yeah, college is a place to expand your mind and learn worldly ideas, but how the **** are you gonna make it in there without knowing how to write a paper?

	24-05-2003 08:11									#5
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Daaaamn!

	24-05-2003 08:13									#6
	Re: Public education should get no more funding Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer but people insist that the public education system don't work because it don't get enough funding...

Er... that's public education system doesn't work because it doesn't get enough funding

quote: **** that... the problem is people don't see the point in going to class, and especially not college.

They'll change their minds after the get turned down for promotion because they lack the required education.

	24-05-2003 08:28									#7
	Re: Public education should get no more funding Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer the problem is that 1) there's little oppurtunity (what with the cost of college) out of high school to continue one's education, 2) people don't see the point in going to college (they figure they got enough knowledge to get a job and survive), and 3) people see college as that **** for white people.

But why are those reasons against giving more funds to public schools?

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer the problem is people don't see the point in going to class, and especially not college.

That is not a problem with funding the schools. That is a personal problem.

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer We need to somehow convince people of the worth of a college education or at least the importance of a diploma if only as a sheet of paper that proves you actually know ****.

Show them the wanted ads. Check out the difference between a floor sweeper and an Oracle DBA.

	24-05-2003 13:22									#8
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Let me get this straight...

The objective is to get more people into colleges from poor areas?

Therefore there must be no funding to schools. Which means no teachers or books for those kids for most of their formative years.

It could work, but only if the US is ready for a B.A. in "See Spot run".

	24-05-2003 18:04									#9
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To sum up:

"Based on my experiences in the place where I live, with no significant outside contact, I've found that the public school system produces many intelligent and thoughtful individuals. Therefore we must stop its funding."

	24-05-2003 19:37									#10
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I didn't say we should stop its funding... i said we should not give public schools MORE funding...

Liberals always complain that schools don't got enough funding but the lack of funding is not the issue. With as little funding as public schools get, they still are very effective.


Urban:

quote: But why are those reasons against giving more funds to public schools?

They AREN'T reasons against giving more funding! They're the reasons why the public school system seems bad on paper and why the percentage of public school students who go to college is so low... lack of funding is the not the problem! the problem is those reasons!

quote: That is not a problem with funding the schools. That is a personal problem.

EXACTLY!


StarChild:

My experiences are in the supposedly worst school district in the entire United States... and i still say that almost everyone i know, many of whom didn't even graduate, are very intelligent individuals. They could easily do good in college except they see no point in going and it's expensive.


thanks

	24-05-2003 20:05									#11
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Speer rant of the day:

I always look at the bright side, though: At least it's not a "My love life, part MCMLXXVI" thread.

	24-05-2003 20:34									#12
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What Public Education needs is dicipline, high standards and competition.

	24-05-2003 21:08									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer I didn't say we should stop its funding... i said we should not give public schools MORE funding...

Perhaps if your school had been better-funded, you'd have been left capable of seeing that "Public Schools should get no more funding" is not the same as "Public Schools should not get increased funding".

Reassure me you aren't studying English.

	24-05-2003 21:24									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Liberals always complain that schools don't got enough funding but the lack of funding is not the issue. With as little funding as public schools get, they still are very effective.

So, by extrapolation, if more funding is given to public schools, they'd more efffective, thus sending more people to universities.

	26-05-2003 02:57									#15
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I think an interesting point to raise is that one of the highest funded school districts in the nation - that of Washington, DC - is also one of the lowest performing.

Something tells me that money has little to do with the performance of a school district, and that throwing more money at public education isn't the answer.

	26-05-2003 03:05									#16
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd I think an interesting point to raise is that one of the highest funded school districts in the nation - that of Washington, DC - is also one of the lowest performing. Something tells me that money has little to do with the performance of a school district, and that throwing more money at public education isn't the answer.

	26-05-2003 03:08									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer at least not on the elementary/high school level. money should go towards college. Why?

So that the upper class can become even MORE elite?

quote: I've been in the philly public school system my whole life and though most the people i know are not going to college or they have already dropped out of high school, they are all universally intelligent.

Bullshit. Philadelphia harbours a 50% failure rate.

quote: Take a random boy off the street hustling oils or some **** and you could seriously have an intelligent debate with him about politics or whatever. sure his grammer may not be right but he would use plenty of sophisticated words and knows what he's talking about.

I find the irony and inconsistency of this overwhelming.

quote: So to me, funding is not the problem. The school district has basically churned out thousands of very intelligent men and women, even those who dropped out or stayed straight cutting classes.

And with less money they'll 'churn out' even less. With no public funding they won't 'churn out' any.

quote: sure, some weedheads are retarded as ****

Oh i see, the users are stupid but the dealers are rhodes scholars...

quote: and there's always those with 'learning disabilities'

Quotes? Do you deny that some people do have learning disabilities?

quote: but the average student in the school district is probably just as smart as anyone in fancy private institutions.

I'd laugh if it weren't for the fact that you actually, for some reason or another, believe this shite.

quote: the problem is that 1) there's little oppurtunity (what with the cost of college) out of high school to continue one's education

Nope. Community college is dirt cheap. If you can attend Temple, anyone in the city can go to college provided they are accepted into Community college.

quote: 2) people don't see the point in going to college (they figure they got enough knowledge to get a job and survive)

So why fund colleges even more? What good will that accomplish.

quote: and 3) people see college as that **** for white people.

More bullshit, only now you're speaking for people you can't speak for.

quote: but people insist that the public education system don't work because it don't get enough funding... **** that... the problem is people don't see the point in going to class, and especially not college.

If people don't see the point in going to class, that's their own fault...those that do go to class shouldn't be punished with less funding. And it is true, lower funding = poor performance. And once again, if they 'especially' don't want college, why on earth would you want to fund colleges with this money?

quote: We need to somehow convince people of the worth of a college education or at least the importance of a diploma if only as a sheet of paper that proves you actually know ****.

Why don't you start by convincing people of the value of a high school education which PREPARES you for college, so that you don't spend your days typing up uneducated horseshit like this.

	26-05-2003 03:30									#18
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd I think an interesting point to raise is that one of the highest funded school districts in the nation - that of Washington, DC - is also one of the lowest performing. Something tells me that money has little to do with the performance of a school district,

Really? Try running a school on no money at all.

	26-05-2003 03:34									#19
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quote: Really? Try running a school on no money at all.

Interesting point. Home schooling costs little, yet often times provides a better education, with less government BS requirements thrown in.

Not that I support homeschooling as the primary option - I think parents who force their kids to homeschool are robbing them of something very important, and that's social interaction.

What I DO support is everyone paying for their own education, rather than expecting me to do so.

	26-05-2003 03:37									#20
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Interesting point. Home schooling costs little, yet often times provides a better education, with less government BS requirements thrown in.

Other than the minor expenses involved in not working, of course.

	26-05-2003 03:40									#21
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quote: Other than the minor expenses involved in not working, of course.

True, in a one parent family this would be a tad difficult, although still possibly doable. In a two person family, there's no reason one parent can't stay home, in the absence of things such as income taxes, property taxes, etc., if that parent really wants to.

But again, I'm not a big fan of homeschooling - it deprives kids of a good deal of social interaction. Turning a kid into a dork is not the best move a parent can make.

I'm just saying, pay for the services you use.

	26-05-2003 03:59									#22
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quote: Turning a kid into a dork is not the best move a parent can make.

I know plenty of kids that were home schooled and are not social nitwits. Dorks will be dorks and geeks will be geeks regardless of whether they're home schooled or not.

	26-05-2003 04:00									#23
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quote: I know plenty of kids that were home schooled and are not social nitwits. Dorks will be dorks and geeks will be geeks regardless of whether they're home schooled or not.

The point I'm making is that there is less opportunity for social interaction, and spending all your time with your parents (or at least much of your time) might not be the best thing for your social development.

Still, homeschooling is better than funding public education.

	26-05-2003 04:03									#24
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd I think an interesting point to raise is that one of the highest funded school districts in the nation - that of Washington, DC - is also one of the lowest performing. Something tells me that money has little to do with the performance of a school district, and that throwing more money at public education isn't the answer.

No, the areas in Virginia just outside DC are some of the highest funded school districts in the nation, and some of the best performing (trust me - I live and go to school there). The District is another matter entirely.

	26-05-2003 04:05									#25
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quote: The point I'm making is that there is less opportunity for social interaction, and spending all your time with your parents (or at least much of your time) might not be the best thing for your social development.

Since when do homeschooled children only spend time with their parents? Aren't you overgeneralizing an already inaccurate stereotype here?

	26-05-2003 04:06									#26
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Oh, and home schooling only works if the parents are at least marginally intelligent. Sadly, this is not the case for the vast majority of humanity

	26-05-2003 04:07									#27
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...and in particular those whose children are most likely to fail at school...

	26-05-2003 04:50									#28
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skywalker, I don't have exact stats on me, but I'm fairly sure that DC is very well funded.

In any case, the fact that a school in Virginia suburbs performs well probably has more to do with the students who go there than with the funding it receives, right?

	26-05-2003 04:57									#29
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quote: Originally posted by The diplomat What Public Education needs is dicipline, high standards and competition.

especially the discipline. Instead of this stupid idea of students choosing the school we need to let the schools choose the students. Then the parents can deal with these trouble students. That will fix things quick.

I had hoped that this thread would get jacked good, but I guess not. It's soooo absurd!

	26-05-2003 05:06									#30
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd skywalker, I don't have exact stats on me, but I'm fairly sure that DC is very well funded.

I'm not sure they're poorly funded per se, but the funding doesn't go to the right places.

quote: In any case, the fact that a school in Virginia suburbs performs well probably has more to do with the students who go there than with the funding it receives, right?

Actually, it doesn't. Our schools have a LOT of technology at them. Especially my school, which is a magnet school for the entire area (it's a tech school), and it's not just full of a bunch of rich kids.