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MrWhereItsAt
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New Year's Resolution: 2005 is the year of Where It's At - come get some.
Nov 2001
time: 17:28
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So E_T - you have made those plans with the assumption that no grassland recovered from Forests or Jungles will have a bonus shield?
If so we can expect to do better than your plans, overall. 
Here's a rough guess, from E_T's plans and using BFM's Information posts, of what our immediate future will bring:
Just roughly guessing that we will have The Republic in 30 turns and have become a stable Republic at about 35 turns (revolution time), then we will have, in addition to what we currently do,
13 NMs
4 Settlers
6 Workers
5 Warriors
2 Galley
Plus whatever the other three cities build in that time.
This will bring our units available for assaulting CDG to
15 NMs
13 Warriors
1 Galley...?
where of course at least most of 9 units will stay behind to protect our 9 cities (we will have 9 unless some of the settlers haven't settled yet), and one or two units will go with at least one Galley, and we will have something Barb-farming too, I guess.
Upgrading these warriors would amount to 520 gold, but some we will not upgrade as they are/will be Elites, or will stay in cities as martial law enforcers until they are needed.
I'm not certain of the MoW's requests for units for the attack, but to me this certainly looks good.
I would be grateful if, using this sort of information, someone who can look at the save would probe a bit further - with tax on 100%, how long would it take to garner this amount of cash for upgrades? There will of course be a few unknowns in that equation - where new cities go and exactly when they get there, worker improvements that result in more cashflow... but even just looking at our current cashflow, how many turns will it take? We can of course take this time and know that we will do slightly better than that realistically, much as we know this of E_T's plans.
Overall, the way these plans are set out is really good, E_T. It gives us a kind of lower limit to our production capacity (due to those unknowns), and so we can aim for a minimum amount of development and know that we will in fact improve on that.
These have a great potential for allowing us to plan in more detail further towards our attack on CDG than we could before, and I think that everyone should have at least a cursory look at the plans in conjunction with the save.
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MrWhereItsAt
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New Year's Resolution: 2005 is the year of Where It's At - come get some.
Nov 2001
time: 17:28
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Oh Whoops. 
I was going by an estimate of Togas' from a week or three ago that, if all the trading went to plan we could have Republic in 30-odd turns.
Things have moved on since then, and I have not of course done a simulation. However, for those who know how those sims went, is it at all possible that Republic will be gained much earlier than 50-55 turns?
If we DID somehow get to a Republic earlier, then perhaps it would be best to wait until that 50-55 turn mark before attacking - we would have used the Republic to stash a lot more cash and build plenty more Warriors ready for upgrade.
Trip - we will of course build Swords when Iron is hooked up, but especially when we are in Republic, the cash bonus should be higher than our production bonus, so upgrading Warriors may be more cost-effective than just building them, as we use our money to speed completion, rather than just expending the shields.
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E_T
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Orlando, Florida
Mar 2001
time: 00:28
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quote:
Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
So E_T - you have made those plans with the assumption that no grassland recovered from Forests or Jungles will have a bonus shield?
If so we can expect to do better than your plans, overall.
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Yes. I plan for the worst (no bonus) and hope for the best (bonus sheild). That way, I only have to rework things if it's better for us.
Also, this is one thing that you can't accurately simulate, because you DON'T know where those bonus tiles will be at. You can only assume that a certain % of tiles will be bonus, but until they show themselves, we can't say if it's bonus or not.
quote:
Here's a rough guess, from E_T's plans and using BFM's Information posts, of what our immediate future will bring:
Just roughly guessing that we will have The Republic in 30 turns and have become a stable Republic at about 35 turns (revolution time), then we will have, in addition to what we currently do,
13 NMs
4 Settlers
6 Workers
5 Warriors
2 Galley
Plus whatever the other three cities build in that time.
This will bring our units available for assaulting CDG to
15 NMs
13 Warriors
1 Galley...?
where of course at least most of 9 units will stay behind to protect our 9 cities (we will have 9 unless some of the settlers haven't settled yet), and one or two units will go with at least one Galley, and we will have something Barb-farming too, I guess.
Upgrading these warriors would amount to 520 gold, but some we will not upgrade as they are/will be Elites, or will stay in cities as martial law enforcers until they are needed.
I'm not certain of the MoW's requests for units for the attack, but to me this certainly looks good.
I would be grateful if, using this sort of information, someone who can look at the save would probe a bit further - with tax on 100%, how long would it take to garner this amount of cash for upgrades? There will of course be a few unknowns in that equation - where new cities go and exactly when they get there, worker improvements that result in more cashflow... but even just looking at our current cashflow, how many turns will it take? We can of course take this time and know that we will do slightly better than that realistically, much as we know this of E_T's plans.
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Remember, the NM sheild cost is equil to the Swordsman and the Horseman (and Galley for coastal cities), i.e. 30 sheilds each. I have NM everywere as it's easier for me to cut and paste. I could just as easily say "30SheildUnit" and have the same effect.
It's up to the MoW and the Consuls to say exactly what will be built in those spots. I just give you the production plan.....
quote:
Overall, the way these plans are set out is really good, E_T. It gives us a kind of lower limit to our production capacity (due to those unknowns), and so we can aim for a minimum amount of development and know that we will in fact improve on that.
These have a great potential for allowing us to plan in more detail further towards our attack on CDG than we could before, and I think that everyone should have at least a cursory look at the plans in conjunction with the save. |
Thanks, I hope everyone else agrees and takes a close look at them. I'll try to have the new Bananatopia sheet up soon and then I'll work on the other 3 cities and the jungle clearing.
MoI E_T
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vondrack
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Praha, Czech Republic
Jan 2002
time: 06:28
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quote:
Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
E_T I may be missing something obvious, but for Bananatopia between turns 64 and 65, there is a tiny discrepancy (doesn't muck up your build estimates at all).
On turn 64, there are 3 shields in the box, and there is a surplus of +3spt. On turn 65, the SPT is up to +5, but the shields in the box are up to 9, not 8 which they should be with the +5spt from the one turn. Is there something I am missing here or is it just a tiny error? |
It is correct. Bananatopia grows by 1 pop on that turn and the new labourer is adding that extra shield that looks like an error to you. It is difficult to decribe this in a table, as the new labourer is "not there" on turn 64 yet, but his shields ARE added to turn 64 total output (but NOT the commerce, which is weird... but it is so).
Note: E_T, if you want to have your tables sharper (and hopefully even taking less space in your upload storage area), use GIF instead of JPEG. The JPEG compression is not suitable for this kind of images. See my summary tables in the turn report thread - those are saved as GIFs...
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MrWhereItsAt
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New Year's Resolution: 2005 is the year of Where It's At - come get some.
Nov 2001
time: 17:28
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Sorry to push the issue, but I want to make sure I fully understand.
On turn 64, the pop is 2, the shields accumulated are 3 and the spt are +3. End turn, and the population grows, where the third citizen will work a tile with 2 food and 2 shields (forget trade for the moment), so the spt will be +5, and that +5 will go into the accumulated shields box for turn 65. BUT how does the 3 shields already accumulated at turn 64 +5spt from the end of turn 64/start of turn 65 = 9 accumulated shields during turn 65?
In every other case where the pop grows that I can see, the shields accumulated in the turn before the pop growth + the shields per turn for the turn after the growth = the shields accumulated in the box for the turn after growth.
For example, look at Turns 77/78 for Bananatopia.
At turn 77 there are 5 shields accumulated and there is +5spt. End turn, then Bananatopia grows to a population of 4, and the new labourer is assigned to a tile with 3 food and 1 shield (food surplus goes from +2 to +3, and spt goes from +5 to +6). The new value +6spt is added to the previously accumulated shields and then, at turn 78, the shields accumulated are 11, exactly what I expected. This is different to turns 64/65.
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E_T
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Orlando, Florida
Mar 2001
time: 00:28
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Because the worker tasks are done at the end of the turn, I can't "program" them into the tables that are used to formulate the outputs. I have to manually enter it in the next turn (you see a colored box). the color is partly to distingish that it is a manual correction, but also to help denote the amount or type of manual addition (+1, +2, +10. The thing is, my coloring hasn't been consistant except for purplem, that is a worker table/task change effect).
I'll try ti post more about this later, have to get ready for work.
to answer you question on turn 64, had 3 in sheild box, normal turn WITHOUT growth + 3 sheilds = 6. Difference (AFTER WASTE) in sheild output for growth +2 = 8. Mine at tile #8 finished at the end of turn 63 (just before) +1 = 9.
It's unfortunate that I couldn't sweeze one more sheild from somewhere, as the warrior would be completed that turn and not the next. Sometimes you can't help it...
E_T
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31-05-2003 05:31
, I would like some form of feedback here. This let's me know that I'm keeping your (the general populus') interests and general National direction to what is required and envisioned.
Good for the team. 
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