24-06-2003 05:43									#1
	A Deal with Lego for Theology and The Republic Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

You can read the chat log and summary here.

Please post comments and discussions in this thread and not in that thread.

	24-06-2003 06:15									#2
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Bad bad boy. Just read it. Sounds like a good one. Also, I would add into it that they cannot even attempt to build bachs (or whatever it is that compliments sistine... sorry, forget its name).

	24-06-2003 06:31									#3
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I dislike it.. so far the builders are IMVVHO trying to throw all the otehr nations at war with each other , while they just keep back, financing things and laughing at our self destruction... we must keep in mind that they may know what caused GoW and ND the score growth (consider they may even be behind it) and they warn us to cause unrest in our relations... and if they are financing an attack by ND and GoW on us , it may serve tehm to have us mobilized in order not to get us mowed apiece by such a surprise strike, so that we consume each other in a advanceless attack...
think about it,
Nuclear Winter

	24-06-2003 07:42									#4
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Push for Education in the deal as we need to "hurry to get Bachs" if we're not going to for Sistine.

See what you can get for it and seal the deal.

We don't need Sistine. I know it's great for our RP and great for our civ and our cheap cathedrals, however, we have 4 luxuries and we will be importing 3 more luxuries (wines, incense, furs) so we'll have zero happiness issues. We just need to Legos to sweat a little in this deal.

Once we get Theology we will restart our research engines. I need suggestions from the team about what tech we should go for next. Should it be Engineering (Vox will have later on) or should it be something else?

Bottom line, we'll take Theo + Rep for such a no-build clause any day of the week ... but let's try to get a little more out of this first.

--Togas

	24-06-2003 17:12									#5
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!

In character, I have a storyline for Roberto planned out for the Voxodus to Legoland.

	24-06-2003 21:10									#6
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I don't know...it's too pristine, too clear...to nice. It doesn't make sense. They seem to have something up their sleeve, and I don't trust them.

Don Iago Calamari de Toledo

	24-06-2003 22:27									#7
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BigFree, you are an excellent diplomat, I honestly wouldn't have gotten out a deal that is so nice as this one.

I favor the second proposal over the first one because. Am I right that If we have Edu we can reseach music oureselves? Then this deal perfectly fits to the King's plan to reopen the laboratories of the academy and the libraries of the abbeys.

Another thing I want to inform you about is that I found it in some way difficult to read this. I am ambassador to Legoland, but I wasn't present when this deal was made and Legoland is ignoring me when it comes to making deals. Do you have a suggestion to solve this problem?

Aidun

	25-06-2003 01:21									#8
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I'm sorry Aidun. vondrack contacted me because I happened to be on-line in chat in the ISDG with him and he took the opportunity to ask me question, in private about Theology.

The only thing I can suggest is to more actively persue tals/chats with Lego's Ambassador. I certainly am not trying to take your place, you a fine diplomat, if only Lego had the decency to reutrn your PM's and messages.

	25-06-2003 04:38									#9
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HIstory Guy pointed a very important issue there... let us give it proper consideration... they seem way too much deseperated for Sistine, it almost sounds like a trap to me... call me Paranoid, but as I´ve already said in my previous message they are playing some sort of wicked game with the teams and so far the teams are falling for it.

LEt us be cautious, I beg

	25-06-2003 05:22									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Nuclear Winter HIstory Guy pointed a very important issue there... let us give it proper consideration... they seem way too much deseperated for Sistine, it almost sounds like a trap to me... call me Paranoid, but as I´ve already said in my previous message they are playing some sort of wicked game with the teams and so far the teams are falling for it. LEt us be cautious, I beg

Nuc, I wholeheartedly agree with you . The thing is but that this deal is very beneficial for us.

The moment of getting your goldenage is comparable of buying stocs at a stockmarket. you have to wait until the price is low: if you buy too early, you pay too much and you benefit less, but if you buy too late, you also pay too much and you benefit less.

I believe that if we would NOW start with getting our GA by building the SC soon, we'll get our GA, but it will have ended by the time we need it. A GA benefits us also during a war. it is not only economical growth that matters, increased military power during a war is also a major advantage over the enemy.

let the Legos get ther SC if they like. I don't trust them, but I don't deny it them either. Another argument: BF lied about us pre-building the SC. How do you imagine that we could build the SC. Pamplona has something else to do, as well as Zaragoza and Madrid. At this momsnt we are not even able to build it.

BF uses this inability to gain Techs: that is two techs for FREE and eventually one tech for a lower price. A better deal is simply impossible.

Aidun

	25-06-2003 07:20									#11
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I found the deal very nice (BF you evil man ) but I think there is something behind it that we should cautiously ponder... and I don´t think we can build the sistine chapel, but the point is we must at least be aware of what are their intentions even if we are accepting (I myself am in favour of this... sor the holy horns of santiago, 3 techs for a promise and some gold! ) .

	25-06-2003 07:55									#12
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There is no hidden meaning. If you read the whole chat you see that Lego is overly (maybe rightly so) concerned with happiness in it's Nation. They are realtively luxery poor, when compared to us. It is realtively easy to see why they would think they NEED The Sistine Chappel.

I made them believe, rather evily, that we were in fact already planning on it; pre-building it even! If they lost that Wonder to us, they feel that they would not be able to have any large cities without support (luxeries) from other Civ's. Which means that if a war broke out, they would have to use the luxery slider a lot.

	25-06-2003 21:05									#13
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I don't know...

It's almost reassuring knowing that Legoland's cities are filled with discontented citizens and that the army is dwindling...

Thanks, Nuclearis. My thoughts exactly.

Don Iago Calamari de Toledo

	25-06-2003 23:14									#14
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Look - we don't have much of a chance at sistine, so promicing to not go for it is just admitting it and stealing some techs as well. I say go for it, and take the Bas**ds for as much as possible.

	01-07-2003 12:32									#15
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The deal has been finalized.

We get The Republic and Theology.
Lego gets our promise not to build The Sistine Chappel.

We should get those techs on the very next turn.