04-07-2003 23:07									#121
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quote: If people think they are cool becuase they cost more, that is conspicuous consumption.

NO NO NO! You are not getting it! People think it is cool because it is...

but the things that MAKE it cool MAY also drive up the price. For example, you aren't going to find a Ferrari's engine and handling in a Ford . And also you won't find the 'cool' styling in a Ford either.

	04-07-2003 23:11									#122
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quote: Originally posted by DAVOUT But some people (40% for instance) do not spend all their income; they save a portion of it. After a few months there are differences in the personal wealth of citizens; if Kiditious let the things go this way, after a few years, big inequalities will appear again. How can we prevent this horror?

This isn't an inequality. If someone saves their money to make a bigger purchase instead of making imediate small purchases how is that inequality.

If the savings results in unemployment you just lower prices.

	04-07-2003 23:13									#123
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: If people think they are cool becuase they cost more, that is conspicuous consumption. NO NO NO! You are not getting it! People think it is cool because it is... but the things that MAKE it cool MAY also drive up the price. For example, you aren't going to find a Ferrari's engine and handling in a Ford . And also you won't find the 'cool' styling in a Ford either.

You don't have a point again Imran, because you changed the argument again. Go back to the original context.

	04-07-2003 23:29									#124
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I didn't change the argument. I'm AT the original context. People don't think things that cost more are cooler, things they think are cool rise in price because of that cool factor. Thus lower price doesn't always equal higher demand... which is what Spiffor said.

Remember, I said the things that make it cool MAY also drive up the price... but don't always have to. Just being cool may drive up the price.

One of the things economics doesn't do well is incorporate people's irrational desires.

	04-07-2003 23:32									#125
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui I didn't change the argument. I'm AT the original context. People don't think things that cost more are cooler, things they think are cool rise in price because of that cool factor. Thus lower price doesn't always equal higher demand... which is what Spiffor said. Remember, I said the things that make it cool MAY also drive up the price... but don't always have to. Just being cool may drive up the price.

Fine, but you aren't arguing against any of my points then.

	04-07-2003 23:34									#126
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quote: Fine, but you aren't arguing against any of my points then.

I wasn't in the first place! I was agreeing with Spiffor, and then you wanted to argue with my agreement!

	04-07-2003 23:43									#127
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30+ posts of active arguing to notice both contenders were in agreement from the beginning !

Gotta love 'Poly

	04-07-2003 23:47									#129
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: Fine, but you aren't arguing against any of my points then. I wasn't in the first place! I was agreeing with Spiffor, and then you wanted to argue with my agreement!

You were agreeing with Spiffor when he made a argument with me. But you brought up the point that people would pay more for something because of it's price, not because of the demand.

	04-07-2003 23:48									#130
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quote: But you brought up the point that people would pay more for something because of it's price, not because of the demand.

No, not because of its price. But it may BE pricier.

Like I said in support of Spiffor:

Demand doesn't solely depend on price.

	04-07-2003 23:51									#131
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: But you brought up the point that people would pay more for something because of it's price, not because of the demand. No, not because of its price. But it may BE pricier. Like I said in support of Spiffor: Demand doesn't solely depend on price.

I support Spiffor there too . So what's the argument.

	04-07-2003 23:51									#132
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Are those politicians of a different stripe? And who appoints this commitee? What happens when one dies?

They're as much politicans as are Judges. There are a variety of solutions available to elect them. They can be appointed by the government, and the whole proccess could be overseen by the State Auditor, they can be elected... etc. etc.

quote: Perhaps, but it'd be SUPER expensive. Remember, you cannot take private property under the US Constitution without just compensation (ie, amount of money it is worth). And saying it is being taken by the state's 'police power' ain't gonna work here.

It can be instituted with a 100% tax on dead people's stocks' and cash assets. What's it's name? estate tax, right? The government will begin to slowly buy up the economy. Heck, if you'd cut the defence budget in half, you'd be able to buy Microsoft in a year, or something.

quote: Ming is gonna hurt you now!

quote: Btw, how much do you think those commericals actually influence people to buy things? Commercials that are more tied to the product themselves will help sell goods.

I honestly don't know. But if they do, it's obviously wrong, since basically, not the most suitable product is bought, but the one that messes up with your brain the most. If they don't work, it's all effort lost anyway, and is a waste of time. I think that commercials are stupid. With the technology today, people could access all the products via the internet, for example, to evaluate them.

	04-07-2003 23:55									#133
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quote: They're as much politicans as are Judges.

Obvious you don't know my opinion on Judges (basically they are politicians in robes )

quote: It can be instituted with a 100% tax on dead people's stocks' and cash assets. What's it's name? estate tax, right?

Perhaps... but it'd STILL be mad expensive. Like really freaking expensive!

And of course a 100% tax will just cause all the companies to leave anyway .

	04-07-2003 23:57									#134
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quote: I support Spiffor there too . So what's the argument.

Hence Spiffor's last post .

	04-07-2003 23:57									#135
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quote: And of course a 100% tax will just cause all the companies to leave anyway

That's the real problem. That's why I think a revolution is needed. I think that way too many money is lost on the rich.

	04-07-2003 23:58									#136
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quote: That's the real problem. That's why I think a revolution is needed. I think that way too many money is lost on the rich.

Bah, the rich will just hire an army (paying them more than you can, of course) and shoot down all the hippie revolutionaries .

After all, they have all the cool guns and toys... and the military is generally more conservative anyway .

	05-07-2003 00:01									#137
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: I support Spiffor there too . So what's the argument. Hence Spiffor's last post .

What attitude does that face represent? I have no idea.

	05-07-2003 00:03									#138
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui and the military is generally more conservative anyway .

That's generally because the republicans like to spend money on them. If another party wanted to spend more money on them it would change their attitudes.

	05-07-2003 00:04									#139
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: That's the real problem. That's why I think a revolution is needed. I think that way too many money is lost on the rich. Bah, the rich will just hire an army (paying them more than you can, of course) and shoot down all the hippie revolutionaries . After all, they have all the cool guns and toys... and the military is generally more conservative anyway .

The sad thing is, that this is true.

We can attempt this with Europe, though. We'd have much more support, and they have no military to speak of anyway.

	05-07-2003 00:06									#140
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quote: That's generally because the republicans like to spend money on them. If another party wanted to spend more money on them it would change their attitudes.

I don't think that's it. The type of person that goes into the military is generally more conservative. They are more patriotic and love their country more. Even though they are poorer, they generally follow conservative policies (which isn't rare... poor Southerners and Midwesterners also will vote Republican).

The left is generally less patriotic, so less in tune with the type of military person.

	05-07-2003 00:07									#141
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious What attitude does that face represent? I have no idea.

represents embarassment ("oops")

	05-07-2003 00:08									#142
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If the army did attack civilians I think that that would permanently damage the reputation of the govt. It might prevent a revolution in the short run, but not the long run. If it happened during a depression I think there would be big trouble. The only reason the Chinese govt maintains power is because of their economy.

	05-07-2003 00:09									#143
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quote: We can attempt this with Europe, though. We'd have much more support, and they have no military to speak of anyway.

	05-07-2003 00:10									#144
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quote: If the army did attack civilians I think that that would permanently damage the reputation of the govt.

Not if the civilians were engaged in a revolution. It probably would increase the reputation of the government.

	05-07-2003 00:12									#145
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: That's generally because the republicans like to spend money on them. If another party wanted to spend more money on them it would change their attitudes. I don't think that's it. The type of person that goes into the military is generally more conservative. They are more patriotic and love their country more. Even though they are poorer, they generally follow conservative policies (which isn't rare... poor Southerners and Midwesterners also will vote Republican). The left is generally less patriotic, so less in tune with the type of military person.

I don't think liberals are unpatriotic, the left yes. Liberals tend to turn to the left though during periods where the govt isn't working.

	05-07-2003 00:14									#146
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: If the army did attack civilians I think that that would permanently damage the reputation of the govt. Not if the civilians were engaged in a revolution. It probably would increase the reputation of the government.

Is a revolution marching to the capital in mass and demanding change? If you mean taking up arms and attacking the military of course the military would attack them.

	05-07-2003 00:15									#147
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My idea of a communist economy would be having the essentials, such as healthcare, agriculture, insurance, etc, be state run. Luxury good industries would be ran by employee-controlled, democratic enterprises. The workers elect the board of directors and can fire them when they want to. The employees get an equal share of the profit. The employees also elect a supervisor for the thier worksite, this supervisor has the power to hire and fire employees.

	05-07-2003 00:36									#148
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quote: I don't think liberals are unpatriotic

Not UNpatriotic, but LESS patriotic. There is a difference.

quote: Is a revolution marching to the capital in mass and demanding change?

No, unless you have a different definition of revolution .

	05-07-2003 00:38									#149
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Wouldn't that create a collision of interests?

Besides, I want a system in which the entire society will decide on the future of the economy, and this won't have this. Just groups of people deciding on their individual patches of influence over the economy. It's just a bit more egalitarian capitalism, that's it.

	05-07-2003 00:40									#150
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quote: No, unless you have a different definition of revolution

Actually, that's how the fascists made the revolution.